News Sony finally outs PS3 at E3

the hddvd addon for the 360 might have hdmi out and 1080p.


and its no deal really, most consumers don't want to choose sides in the hd player war yet anyways. they just want to buy a games system. the average consumer jumps in on the video players once they drop to a level where they get sold at walmart. especially at the 100-150 price point or even less as we've seen with 50 dollar dvd players. its a bit silly anyways as video players drop in price much easier than consoles, no memory/gpu/cell processor etc to add to costs. hddvd looks good at 499 starting point, if it continues to rapidly drop bluray is dead. and with the supposed ease of stamping out media in current factories with little modification the market will be flooded with both legal and illegal hddvds which will just further push adoption. most will just wait a few years and get a player for almost nothing and this whole ps3 issue will jsut be irrelevant.

and blurays not superior in any way that matters. its digital storage, its notlike past format wars where analog signals were handeled differently and led to image quality difference. this time its the same compression and resolution, its just a file. if the hddvd special features spill over onto a second cheap to make disc so what? is that so bad? the hype is on the sony side on this where they talk of 200gb discs that are just not going to be made. like 4 layer dvds...how many do you own? its cheaper and easier just to print two dual layer dvds in the real world. hddvd has more than enough space for film.

and of course theres the issue of sony being part of both riaa/mpaa customer sueing *******s. i'd rather not give them more money than i have to. i do not trust them with control of a media format. remember the root kit fiasco after all, its all part of a long pattern of anti consumer behavior.

not that gamers are probably good customers for bluray anyways. having paid 600 dollars for a ps3, then 50-60 for games, i think they will be rather stingy when it comes to buying films. the gamers i know buy games before they buy dvds. then maybe theres 4 dollar gas by the time this all comes out to ding the entertainment budgets even more.

 

http://xbox.gamespy.com/articles/706/706923p1.html
conference report card
Overall:

Sony C, D, C+, D+

MS B+, B, B-, A-

Nintendo B, B+, B+, B

Pretty much neck and neck MS and Nintendo, while Sony, well you know the story.

Bryn Williams (EIC, Console)

Sony: C
Nintendo: B
Microsoft: B+

Gerald Villoria (Associate Console Editor)

Sony: D
Nintendo: B+
Microsoft: B

Miguel Lopez (MMO Editor)

Sony: C+
Nintendo: B+
Microsoft: B-

Will Tuttle (Console Editor)

Sony: D+
Nintendo: B
Microsoft: A-


David Hodgson (Freelancer)

 

from another forum"The PS3 will not win Sony the next generation format war. Here are a few of the movies on HD-DVD right now:

Goodfellas
Apollo 13
Million Dollar Baby
Serenity

And here's a mostly total list minus a very notable exception, King Kong. Also note, this isn't a complete list, obviously.

Universal:
The Bourne Supremacy
The Chronicles of Riddick
Van Helsing
Apollo 13
U-571
12 Monkeys
Dune
The Thing
End of Days
Backdraft
Waterworld
The Bone Collector
Spy Game
Pitch Black
Conan the Barbarian
Dante's Peak

Warner Bros., New Line and HBO:
Above the Law
Alexander
Angels in America
Austin Powers: International Man of Mystery
Batman Begins
Blade
Catwoman
Charlie and the Chocolate Factory
Constantine
Contact
Dark City
The Dukes of Hazzard
Eraser
Executive Decision
Final Destination
Friday
From the Earth to the Moon
The Fugitive
Gothika
Hard to Kill
Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone
Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets
Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban
House of Was (2005)
The Last Samurai
The Mask
The Matrix
The Matrix Reloaded
The Matrix Revolutions
Maverick
Million Dollar Baby
The Music Man
Mystic River
Next of Kin
North by Northwest
Ocean's Eleven
Ocean's Twelve
Passenger 57
The Perfect Storm
The Phantom of the Opera (2004)
The Player
The Polar Express
Red Planet
Rush Hour
Se7en
Soldier
The Sopranos
Spawn
Swordfish
Troy
Under Siege
U.S. Marshals
Wild Wild West

Paramount:
The Manchurian Candidate
Spongebob Squarepants
Elizabethtown
Coach Carter
The Italian Job (2004)
School of Rock
Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow
Forrest Gump
Braveheart
Ghost
Grease
Mission Impossible 2
Black Rain
Save the Last Dance
Sleepy Hollow
U2 Rattle & Hum
Vanilla Sky
Lara Croft: Tomb Raider
Star Trek: First Contact
We Were Soldiers
Assault on Precinct 13

Now, let's take a look at the Blu-ray titles.

Title Studio Info 50 First Dates Sony Release date: June 20, 2006 A Knight's Tale Sony Release date: June 20, 2006 Aeon Flux Paramount
Amityville Horror MGM Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Angel Seekers Air TBS Japan only Armageddon Disney
Basic Instinct Lionsgate Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Batman Begins Warner
Behind Enemy Lines Fox
Black Hawk Down Sony
Blazing Saddles Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats Bram Stoker's Dracula Sony
Bridge on the River Kwai Sony
Brothers Grimm Disney
Charlie and the Chocolate Factory Warner
Chicken Little Disney Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006 Chronos Goldhil Documentary, Release date: May 23, 2006 Constantine Warner
Crash Lionsgate Release date: June 27, 2006 Crimson Tide Disney Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Dark Water Disney
Desperado Sony
Devil's Rejects Lionsgate
Dinosaur Disney
Dukes of Hazzard Warner
Dune Lionsgate TV miniseries aka Frank Herbert's Dune, Release date: June/July Everest Disney Documentary Fantastic Four Fox
Fifth Element Sony Release date: June 20, 2006 Flightplan Disney Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES For a Few Dollars More MGM
Four Brothers Paramount
Full Metal Jacket Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats Goodfellas Warner Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Great Raid Disney
Green Mile Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats Guns of Navarone Sony
Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats Hero Disney
Hitch Sony Release date: June 20, 2006 House of Flying Daggers Sony Release date: June 20, 2006 Ice Age Fox
Incredibles Disney Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Into The Blue Sony Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Italian Job Paramount
Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back Disney
Kill Bill Vol. 1 Disney
King Arthur Disney Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Kiss Kiss Bang Bang Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats Kiss of the Dragon Fox
Kung Fu Hustle Sony Release date: June 27, 2006 Ladder 49 Disney
Last Samurai Warner
Last Waltz MGM Documentary, Release date: June 20, 2006 League of Extraordinary Gentlemen Fox
Legends of the Fall Sony Release date: June 27, 2006 Lethal Weapon Warner
Lord of War Lionsgate Release date: June 27, 2006 Manchurian Candidate Paramount
Matrix Warner
Matrix Reloaded Warner Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Million Dollar Baby Warner
Mission Impossible Paramount Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006 Mission Impossible II Paramount Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006 Mission Impossible III Paramount Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006 New Cinema Paradise Asmik Ace Japan only Ocean's Twelve Warner
Phantom of the Opera Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats Pirates of the Caribbean Disney Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Punisher Lionsgate Release date: June 27, 2006 Rambo: First Blood Lionsgate
Reservoir Dogs Lionsgate Release date: June/July Resident Evil Sony Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Resident Evil: Apocalypse Sony Release date: June 20, 2006 Robocop MGM Release date: June 27, 2006 Rumor Has It Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats S.W.A.T. Sony Release date: June 27, 2006 Sahara Paramount
Saw Lionsgate Release date: June 27, 2006 See No Evil Lionsgate
Sense and Sensibility Sony
Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow Paramount
Sleepy Hollow Paramount
Species MGM Release date: June 27, 2006 Spider-Man Sony Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES Stargate Atlantis MGM TV series, Release date: June/July Stealth Sony Release date: June 27, 2006 Steamboy Bandai Visual Japan only Step Into Liquid Lionsgate
Swordfish Warner
Syriana Warner Not yet announced, but Warner has stated that they will release all their titles in both formats Terminator MGM Release date: June 27, 2006 Terminator 2: Judgment Day Lionsgate Release date: June 27, 2006 Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines Warner
Tomb Raider Paramount
Total Recall Lionsgate Release date: June/July Training Day Warner
Troy Warner
Twister Warner
U2: Rattle and Hum Paramount Documentary Ultraviolet Sony Release date: June 27, 2006 Underworld: Evolution Sony Release date: June 6, 2006 Unforgiven Warner
We Were Soldiers Paramount
xXx Sony Release date: June 20, 2006 xXx: State of the Union Sony Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
Not that HD-DVD doesn't have it's fair share of stinkers, but I know I've always wanted to see Ultraviolet, Underworld: Evolution, the xXX movies, Troy, Terminator 3, Stealth, Steamboy, See No Evil, SWAT, Desperado, Dukes of Hazzard, Fifty First Dates, Aeon Flux, A Knight's Tale, Amityville, Flightplan, Four Brothers.... If there's anything to be said for this list, it is that Sony Pictures SUCKS.

One costs $499 and has a superior list of titles. One costs $999 and has the Resident Evil movies. Yeah.

Not to mention, the transfer of the films on both are identical 1080p transfers.

Come Christmas, the Xbox 360 will be lowered by at least fifty dollars on each unit. So, $249 and $349 compared to $499 and $599. But, it's ok, PS3 enthusiasts. You have DUAL HDMI OUTPUTS FOR 32:9 ULTRA REAL GAMING. Ohh... wait.

You have A SLEEK CASE, UNBULKY, SVELTE CASE... ohh, wait.

Well, at least you can say you ripped off Nintendo's controller. Again.

Also, at least you have native 1080p support... oh, wait. But, not that that matters, and this isn't tongue in cheek, as I challenge anyone here to notice a difference between 1080i and 1080p in any TV smaller than 50". I challenge you. 1080p being "THE BEST THING EVER" is PURELY AN IGN CONCOCTION.

We know the original case was a lie. We know 1080p is a lie. We know that developers are claiming that it is impossible to program for.

It'll still do reasonably well as there are, well, those of you who will always flock to Sony and not realise they lost over half a billion dollars last quarter and are one of the worst run companies of the last twenty years. Plus, it might have a killer app in MGS4, however, Ghost Recon looks just as good and the next-gen Splinter Cell looks better and even the original Splinter Cell plays better than MGS3.

HD-DVD is going to win out. Microsoft and Nintendo are going to be the big winners. Sony's bet too much on Fifty First Dates winning the console and next generation format war. Not that I probably won't end up buying a PS3, but, well, I'm going to need more than an overrated franchise to convince me. As of now, well... GTA4 and Halo 3 are going to be on the 360. That's kind of a big deal.

If all the trade magazines are bashing Sony, coupled with Sony proving that they lied about the PS3 and Sony proving they rip off Nintendo every chance they can get and then NOT have a killer app...

Period."

 

Hate to break it to you or the original poster, but there is quite a discernable difference between 1080i and 1080p. Remember that DVDs are 480p and if you have a progressive scan DVD play and a capable TV, the quality difference is quite noticable. THe only problem with 1080p TVs that are on the market is that they're not really displaying at 1080p even though that's their native resolution and that's the input that they're receiving. Due to some technical difficulties, they deem to be upscaling a 1080p signal to a 1080p signal which causes slight blurriness and distortion. This isn't every 1080p television but it does effect a good deal of them.

HD-DVD and BD both will have flicks at 1080p resolutions, however Sony is touting that all of there games are 1080p which, in a sense, is true. It's also false at the same time. Yes your TV might be displaying MGS4 at 1080p, but what Sony isn't telling you is that it's a 720p signal being upscaling to 1080p. Makes a huge difference in quality when it's between upscaling and a native resolution. Sony is big on mis-marketing their products. They promise you a chocolate cake but give you an after dinner mint instead.

 

actually dvd is 480i. but film source dvd can be deinterlaced into 480p.

and yes upscaling is a joke. a good tv upscaling 360 would be the same as a ps3 essentially lol. never believe sony.

anyways.

Microsoft sides with Nintendo in fight vs Sony
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/11/AR2006051100612.html
quote:
LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - Microsoft Corp. (MSFT.O) sided with rival Nintendo Co. Ltd. (7974.OS) on Wednesday in the fight to unseat video game leader Sony Corp.(6758.T), saying many consumers will choose to buy both of their machines for the price of one PlayStation 3.

The bad blood between Sony and Microsoft in the fight for dominance in the nearly $30 billion video game industry has escalated over the last few days, with both sides trading barbs at the E3 Expo, the video game industry's annual trade show.


Microsoft entered the next-generation game console market first with its Xbox 360 last November.

Sony aims to extend its market leadership with its upcoming PS3, while Nintendo plans to offer a new game machine called Wii in the fourth quarter.

"Tell me why you would buy a $600 PS3?" Peter Moore, a Microsoft vice president, said in an interview. "People are going to buy two (machines.) They're going to buy an Xbox and they're going to buy a Wii ... for the price of one PS3."

Microsoft predicted on Tuesday it will have 10 million Xbox 360 consoles in the market before Sony launches the PS3. The high-end Xbox 360 sells for $399, but it does not include a built-in high-definition DVD video player that comes with Sony's PS3.

Sony plans to sell a premium PS3 model for $599 when it debuts in North America on November 17, and Nintendo has not yet disclosed pricing for Wii.

Wii comes equipped with motion sensitive controllers to allow users to mimic the motion of wielding a sword or swinging a tennis racket.

Moore then turned pitchman for Nintendo's Wii, the latest offering from the Japanese company that once dominated the video game industry.

"People will always gravitate toward a competitively priced product -- like what I believe Wii will be -- with innovative new designs and great intellectual property like Mario, Zelda and Metroid," Moore told Reuters.

Sony currently dominates the worldwide video game market with a 66 percent share, while Microsoft and Nintendo each hold 17 percent, according to Strategy Analytics.

"We have 100 percent market share of the next-generation, and their job is to take that from us," said Moore.

"When I think on everything that we've got going right now that is real versus what Sony promises to do six, seven months from now, obviously we feel very good about where we stand."

LOST IN TRANSLATION

Despite Microsoft's head start with the Xbox 360, the software giant still faces an uphill climb in Sony and Nintendo's home turf.

Microsoft received a tepid response to its Xbox 360 debut in Japan and demand fell short of expectations during last year's holiday season when it sold about 100,000 machines.

The company introduced a competitively priced console in Japan, but some of its game titles did not appeal to Japanese gamers. Moore expects upcoming role-playing games like "Lost Odyssey" and "Blue Dragon" from the creator of the popular "Final Fantasy" series to do well in Japan.

"Quite frankly," said Moore, "if we're sitting here a year from now and things continue to fall flat, then we might say 'we don't know what to do anymore."'

 

PS3 = big yawn.

 

Not to sidetrack this thread too much, but really it just comes down to the original filming of the movie. Each DVD varies, but the vast majority of newer DVDs have 480p film resolution on them and a standard DVD player does the interlacing. Some older movies that are being reworked up to DVDs though are standard 480i and the DVD player is doing the deinterlacing.

There will be a minor difference in the display quality of a PS3 and a 360. The big difference you're going to see though is that you'll notice interlacing artifacts in 360 games and videos where you won't notice them in the PS3 with the 1080p upscaling and native 1080p for movies. If you're 360 is run through a decent decoder box that deinterlaces the 1080i output so it's displayed at 1080p, they'll be on par. CRT HDTVs will see the major problems with upscaling though but it's a bit hard to find CRT HDTVs above the 35" range right now and unless you have a massive screen, you really won't see any benefit from going from 720p to 1080p.

I have many problems with Sony marketing but you can read my fairly long post over in the Console subforum.

 

http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/top/e306-clips-e3-morning-stampede-173469.php
the crowd votes with their feet

 

^^ haha, sony are so gonna fail muahaha

 

i dont see what that video really shows

just a bunch of people stampeeding behind a barrier, we dont actually know where they went

 

What the hell are you talking about; you do realize Sony has control over MGM and Columbia pictures right. MGM and Columbia alone hold more quality titles than you shake a stick at. If you're telling me that you can live without ever owning another MGM or Columbia films fine, but please don't slam Sony with your BS list.
I wish people would stop trying to be such smart a$$es all the time. When it comes to these console and media wars nobody knows. Ok so you like Xbox and HD DVD good for you, I personally happen to like PS3 and BluRay good for me.
Neither you I nor David Blaine can magically predict the outcome of the console/media wars. Because if we could we wouldn't be wasting our time ranting on this site, we'd be making billions giving financial advices to fortune 500 companies.
So please spare me your mile long list and your self assuming predictions.
Some people will buy Bluray some people will buy HD DVD, some people will buy PS3 some will buy 360 and others will by Wii.
NOBODY can predict the final outcome, so please stop making all these self assured assumptions based on your own personal biases its very annoying.
ONLY TIME can tell who will be the victor.

P.S 1080p on an 1080p display looks 100 times better than 1080i, you must be blind. It's like saying a vga webcam with 1.3mega pixel interpolated 1280 image looks the same as a regular 1280 picture taken from a 6megapixel digi cam. Your one remark about 1080i looking the same as 1080p shows how little you know about media and honestly is enough for me to disregard anything you ever say regarding the media industry. And stop quoting every website in the universe for f sakes.
Holy I gotta give it to these Sony Haters, what lengths they will go through to spread rubbish is art form on it's own.

 

Don't think I'm singling you out but but a 1080p display doesn't look 100x better then a 1080i display. The only difference you're going to notice between them is interlacing artifacts on the 1080p display and a very large majority of the people won't even notice the difference unless it's pointed out to them. Now I'll gladly prove that there is only a marginal benefit to having a 1080p display over a 1080i display but that should be in the more suited Audio Visual sub forum.

 

Trust me I work with interlaced and non interlaced media all the time. 1080i looks even worse than 720p. Take a WUXGA display at 1920x1200 res and run a high res film scan at 1080p then run the same scan at 1080i the difference clear as day and night. You don't even need a 50" TV to see it. I'm speaking from personal experience.
Spit the signal out of any Avid HD suite assuming you have good raw footage and you'll see the difference between the two standards. Personaly I would prefer 720p to 1080i. You don't even need a 50" display, any 24" LCD monitor is sufficient for the test

You know what I find odd, is that if someone hates something they will go out of there way to bash it. Even when its against common sense. For example Fresnono's hatred towards Sony stems so far that, 1080p in Fresnono's view can even be seen as almost a bad thing.
No matter how you look at it, whether or not you can notice the difference or if it takes a 50" TV or if Peter Pan needs to sprinkle pixie dust on you. The fact is 1080p is 1080p and it's better than 1080i. Doesn't mean you should all go out to buy PS3s but it is what it is, with or without pixie dust.

 

In all honesty, you can't really directly compare a 720 signal to a 1080 signal as the sheer amount of detail that is evident is quite different. A 720p is more suited for a smaller HDTV as a 1080i/p is more suited for a larger HDTV. Right below is an example I'll give you between what a 480i and a 480p resolution looks like. It's not 1080 but the same qualities transfer no matter what. These images were pulled from hometheaterhifi.com (IIRC) some months ago and I can't remember the exact context in which they were posted in but they do show the artifacts that appear in interlaced signals.


The image on the left shows common artifacts in an interlaced signal. I can't remember exactly what the black arrow is pointing to, but the blueish arrow is pointing to how the the lines of the bleachers have a curve to them instead of a straight line as it should be. Most people really won't notice this unless it's actually pointed out to them. In fact, I've seen several people see displays of the exact same film being shown in 720i and 720p on HDTVs beside of each other (the DVD was being upscaled by the player) and ask just what the difference was because they couldn't see it. If it was up to me, on a HDTV of 42" or less, I'd take a 720p signal over a 1080i signal any day. But once you get up into the further end of the size scale of 50" or greater, I'd take a 1080i signal over a 720p. I'll deal with the small artifacting issue that happens and take the higher resolution and greater detail.

Now to go on a bit to TVs. Current HDTVs with a 1080p resolution are still extremely high in price. You can find a handful of 1080p LCDs at or below the $3500 mark but I personally wouldn't recommend any of them. Some of the more expensive (and larger) models are around the $20,000 price mark at the time being. 1080p DLP HDTVs are fairly cheap though with some models hitting the $2500 mark and the majority around the $3500 mark. Rear Projection 1080p HDTVs are few and far between but average out to arouund $3500. I haven't seen a 1080p Plasma HDTV on the market but that doesn't mean there aren't a handful of them out there now. HDTVs of all type that display 1080i are substantially less at the time being.

Why did I go on to type all of this out? Simply put it to this. The average househole is going to buy the best bang for their buck. Right now, not many things cater to 1080p let alone 1080i signals and the average person isn't really going to notice the difference in them even if compared side by side. Had it not been for someone pointing it out the difference between a progressive and an interlaced signal many years ago, I'd probabbly never notice the difference now. It's one of those things that most people tend to over look until it's directly pointed out to them and after that, they notice it every time.

I can go on, but right now, I'm tired and I don't even feel like spell checking anything. Perhaps more tomorrow.

:Edit to your edit: I don't hate on 1080p at all, but my thing with the PS3 is that the games are simply rendered at 720 and upscaled to 1080p. There's simply not enough brute behind the machine to push out a native 1080p signal for games. There is also quite a noticable difference between an upscaled image and a native image and I'll take the native over the upscaled any day. Just remember also that beauty is in the eye of the beholder so if you don't notice the difference, there really isn't much of a difference, is there?

 

its from kotaku, the description is of nintendo being on the right, ps3 on the left. the opening to the ps3 area is clear and they just aren't going in.

as for interlace vs progressive..one reason 1080i and 720p are closer than one would think is the kell factor. there is actual resolution loss from interlacing.

 

wow, reading some of this seems to me that the ps3 is going to be a total failure.
id also like to mention that this 'war' about which HD dvd to get needs to be taken pretty seriously as if you go for sony's version and it doesnt quite work out as they were expecting then they will just cancel it and not make any new discs, look at whats happened with the UMD's for the psp, theyve put a stop to them being made now with a few still left to make the trasfer but after those they will stop them.

 

solid snake chimes in
http://www.gametrailers.com/umwatcher.php?id=2806

 

I wouldn't count Sony out anytime soon, you gotta realize that people in Japan are very loyal to their world dominating Kiretsus. It's gonna take a lot more than a few fanboys to win over Sony in the land of the rising sun.

 

you can interperate it that way

however, you dotn actually know whats going on

this could only be confirmed by somone who was at E3 (bit tech ?)

Ahahahahaha BURNEEED

 

These anti Sony fanboys really should get a life.