Seagate ships first 3.5-inch Perpendicular drive - bit-tech.net Forums

The_Pope · 18th Apr 2006, 10:51

I'll have two!

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2006/04...dicular_drive/

LAGMonkey · 18th Apr 2006, 11:13

RAID!!!! mmmmmmmmmm performance.
Is Bit-Tech going to have a review on these babies?

Almightyrastus · 18th Apr 2006, 11:32

I have really been debating going SCSI RAID on my next system, at least for the OS and programs if not for the storage side. These might have to feature if they are going to be viable.

Bindibadgi · 18th Apr 2006, 11:33

Is it just me or are those platters infantesimally small? I knew they were smaller in 10 and 15k drives, but wow.

friskies · 18th Apr 2006, 11:42

Nice.. Do they make a lot of noise compared to regular desktop drives?

The_Pope · 18th Apr 2006, 12:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bindibadgi

Is it just me or are those platters infantesimally small? I knew they were smaller in 10 and 15k drives, but wow.

Gosh, you're right mate - they're a smaller diameter than a regular 3.5-inch desktop SATA drive. Weird.

Almightyrastus: I can't imagine the performance boost will be worth the extra investment but by all means go for it

LAGMonkey: I can't say whether we'd be reviewing this specific drive in the future, but you can count on more articles about Perpendicular Recording in the future.

Bindibadgi · 18th Apr 2006, 13:38

Geoff, the WD Raptors are all 3" platters @ 10k rpm, so im wondering if those 15ks are 2.5"? It completely negates the point of a 15k spindle speed unless you need ultra fast random access. I'd imagine the forces when slinging a 3.5" platter @ 15k are pretty awesome though. Awesome in the destructive sense.

XUntitled · 18th Apr 2006, 16:00

Wow, impressive is all I can sound. I can't wait to see some reviews, and i'm curious too, like friskies, as to if they make a lot of noise.

On a side note, does anyone else remember this ? I instantly thought of it when I read perpendicular drive.

The_Pope · 18th Apr 2006, 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bindibadgi

Geoff, the WD Raptors are all 3" platters @ 10k rpm, so im wondering if those 15ks are 2.5"? It completely negates the point of a 15k spindle speed unless you need ultra fast random access. I'd imagine the forces when slinging a 3.5" platter @ 15k are pretty awesome though. Awesome in the destructive sense.

Yes and no - it's a bit like CD / DVD speed. Surely if the platter was larger, the read speed at the edge of the platter would be slower than if it was smaller. Plus, the smaller the platter, the denser the data, the higher the throughput...

I guess at the end of the day, RPM is just a bit of marketing spin (if you excuse the pun) - people want bigger = better, hence the enthusiast demand for 10k Raptors. If you boil things down to pure transfer rate, maybe a 7200rpm PR drive would be faster than a 10K LR drive...

Bindibadgi · 18th Apr 2006, 17:01

Density is linear, although more space with bigger platters allows more data to be read in a single revolution, that's why bigger platters = better. The read speeds are higher at the outer edge than inner. That's why under some situations the WD Raptors are similar speed throughputs to the fastest 7.2k drives because it's 3" vs 3.5".
It's only random access that benefits from smaller platters and faster spins, not throughput. If and when Seagate put this on a 7.2k drive with 3.5" platter then you'll still see faster access.

Hamish · 18th Apr 2006, 17:47

wheres my 1Tb sata drives already

Tulatin · 18th Apr 2006, 18:41

Seagate aptly named Cheetahs. These drives will get LOUD and HOT, i mean hell, how cool do you think a motor winding up to 15K RPM can be? What really made this a WOW point for me was having 300GB! being ripped at that speed. Needless to say, you can bend a pair of raptor x's over with this drive...

genesisofthesith · 18th Apr 2006, 20:00

noise and cooling concerns are fine for enterprise use, but home use would be terrifying.

Tulatin · 18th Apr 2006, 20:03

Ah c'mon, how bad can it be, we survived the "a 747 is quiet next to my deltas" phase of modding.

Mister_Tad · 18th Apr 2006, 20:05

impressive for that 300GB capacity out of a 15k (All of the other manufacturers will have 300GB 15k drives with their next models though, seagate is just the first to announce it), but seagates enterprise drives are, and this is a technical term here, "pants"

I can promise that these won't be much, if any faster than the Raptor ADFD in a desktop environment (the new raptor currently takes the crown for single-user performance, even when including 15k drives)

I'd also be very surprised if they managed to top either the Fujitsu MAU/MAX or Maxtor Atlas 15k2 in the enterprise sector (both getting on a bit now, and about due for a refresh, which will outrun the cheetah in the extreme.) The current Seagate 15k.4 even failed to surpass the performance of the Fujitsu MAS drives (which were a generation older, this would be akin to the nVidia 7800GTX not beating the ATI x850XT on release)

As for the noise and heat from a 15k drive, its not as bad as you may think (seeks are definitely audible, but thats it)

Once my 15k has warmed up theres no idle noise, and a little airflow is all it needs to stay cool.
When you're talking hundreds of these in a single enclosure (which is where the majority of them will live) you need serious airflow (and serious noise) to keep them cool

Aankhen · 19th Apr 2006, 16:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mister_Tad

impressive for that 300GB capacity out of a 15k (All of the other manufacturers will have 300GB 15k drives with their next models though, seagate is just the first to announce it), but seagates enterprise drives are, and this is a technical term here, "pants"

I would very much like to see evidence for the statements you've made in that post. I was not aware that Seagate drives had such abysmal performance.

Mister_Tad · 19th Apr 2006, 16:24

15k.4 vs competing 15k units from Maxtor and Fujitsu link
15k.4 vs previous generation 15k fujitsu MAS link
These are all real-world benchmarks, nothing synthetic like drive manufacturers sometimes like to pimp

seagate have never really been at the leading edge of performance
typically, they're first off the mark to announce and release a drive (ie, the 15k.5), it comes out, is about as fast or a little bit faster than whats around at the time, then its completely over-taken when competing units are availible

also, keep in mind that "The Cheetah 15K.5 will ship in June" means that we'll be lucky to see it in volume by september

Aankhen · 19th Apr 2006, 19:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mister_Tad

15k.4 vs competing 15k units from Maxtor and Fujitsu link
15k.4 vs previous generation 15k fujitsu MAS link

Interesting reading. Thanks for the links.

I never realized Seagate was so far behind in terms of real-world performance.

JADS · 20th Apr 2006, 08:12

Seagate is going to launch the Barracuda 7200.10 shortly that will include a 750GB hard drive! 1TB here we come

!

Seagate Barracude 7200.10 750GB HDD

For the curious it is likely to cost $520.00 in the USA and around £300 in the U.K.

18th Apr 2006, 10:51	#1
The_Pope Geoff Richards Moderator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: UK Posts: 2,089	Seagate ships first 3.5-inch Perpendicular drive I'll have two! http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2006/04...dicular_drive/

18th Apr 2006, 11:13	#2
LAGMonkey Group 7 error Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada/Saudi Posts: 1,449	RAID!!!! mmmmmmmmmm performance. Is Bit-Tech going to have a review on these babies? __________________ ---------------LAG out!--------------- http://www.ctrlaltdel-online.com 100% Brainless]

18th Apr 2006, 11:32	#3
Almightyrastus Heathen Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Nottingham, England Posts: 442	I have really been debating going SCSI RAID on my next system, at least for the OS and programs if not for the storage side. These might have to feature if they are going to be viable. __________________ Lo there do I see my Father. Lo there do I see my Mother, and my Sisters and my Brothers. Lo there do I see the line of my people, back to the beginning. Lo they do call to me. They bid me take my place among them, in the halls of Valhalla where the brave may live forever.

18th Apr 2006, 11:33	#4
Bindibadgi Richard Swinburne bit-tech Staff Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Omnipwntent Posts: 28,275	Is it just me or are those platters infantesimally small? I knew they were smaller in 10 and 15k drives, but wow. __________________ Made you look, made you stare, made you clicked this in your underwear! Den of Geek!

18th Apr 2006, 11:42	#5
friskies Fuzzy fuzz Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Norway Posts: 393	Nice.. Do they make a lot of noise compared to regular desktop drives? __________________ "what does your robot do, sam?" "It collects data about the surrounding environment, then discards it and drives into walls"

18th Apr 2006, 13:38	#7
Bindibadgi Richard Swinburne bit-tech Staff Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Omnipwntent Posts: 28,275	Geoff, the WD Raptors are all 3" platters @ 10k rpm, so im wondering if those 15ks are 2.5"? It completely negates the point of a 15k spindle speed unless you need ultra fast random access. I'd imagine the forces when slinging a 3.5" platter @ 15k are pretty awesome though. Awesome in the destructive sense. __________________ Made you look, made you stare, made you clicked this in your underwear! Den of Geek!

18th Apr 2006, 16:00	#8
XUntitled Supermodder Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: PA Posts: 454	Wow, impressive is all I can sound. I can't wait to see some reviews, and i'm curious too, like friskies, as to if they make a lot of noise. On a side note, does anyone else remember this ? I instantly thought of it when I read perpendicular drive.

18th Apr 2006, 17:01	#10
Bindibadgi Richard Swinburne bit-tech Staff Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Omnipwntent Posts: 28,275	Density is linear, although more space with bigger platters allows more data to be read in a single revolution, that's why bigger platters = better. The read speeds are higher at the outer edge than inner. That's why under some situations the WD Raptors are similar speed throughputs to the fastest 7.2k drives because it's 3" vs 3.5". It's only random access that benefits from smaller platters and faster spins, not throughput. If and when Seagate put this on a 7.2k drive with 3.5" platter then you'll still see faster access. __________________ Made you look, made you stare, made you clicked this in your underwear! Den of Geek!

18th Apr 2006, 17:47	#11
Hamish I Mod, Therefore I Own Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: London Posts: 3,587	wheres my 1Tb sata drives already

18th Apr 2006, 18:41	#12
Tulatin The Froggy Poster Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 2,942	Seagate aptly named Cheetahs. These drives will get LOUD and HOT, i mean hell, how cool do you think a motor winding up to 15K RPM can be? What really made this a WOW point for me was having 300GB! being ripped at that speed. Needless to say, you can bend a pair of raptor x's over with this drive... __________________ Desky E8400 @ 4.0 1.42v; P5K-E WiFi; 4x1 Kingmax Mars 1066 @ 1129 CAS 5; 2x [TOO CHEAP TO SPONSOR] 4850 @ 675/1050; Enermax Liberty; WCing in a CM690

18th Apr 2006, 20:00	#13
genesisofthesith complete spanner Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: swansea, wales Posts: 533	noise and cooling concerns are fine for enterprise use, but home use would be terrifying.

18th Apr 2006, 20:03	#14
Tulatin The Froggy Poster Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 2,942	Ah c'mon, how bad can it be, we survived the "a 747 is quiet next to my deltas" phase of modding. __________________ Desky E8400 @ 4.0 1.42v; P5K-E WiFi; 4x1 Kingmax Mars 1066 @ 1129 CAS 5; 2x [TOO CHEAP TO SPONSOR] 4850 @ 675/1050; Enermax Liberty; WCing in a CM690

18th Apr 2006, 20:05	#15
Mister_Tad Serious about coffee Moderator Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Nottingham Posts: 7,556	impressive for that 300GB capacity out of a 15k (All of the other manufacturers will have 300GB 15k drives with their next models though, seagate is just the first to announce it), but seagates enterprise drives are, and this is a technical term here, "pants" I can promise that these won't be much, if any faster than the Raptor ADFD in a desktop environment (the new raptor currently takes the crown for single-user performance, even when including 15k drives) I'd also be very surprised if they managed to top either the Fujitsu MAU/MAX or Maxtor Atlas 15k2 in the enterprise sector (both getting on a bit now, and about due for a refresh, which will outrun the cheetah in the extreme.) The current Seagate 15k.4 even failed to surpass the performance of the Fujitsu MAS drives (which were a generation older, this would be akin to the nVidia 7800GTX not beating the ATI x850XT on release) As for the noise and heat from a 15k drive, its not as bad as you may think (seeks are definitely audible, but thats it) Once my 15k has warmed up theres no idle noise, and a little airflow is all it needs to stay cool. When you're talking hundreds of these in a single enclosure (which is where the majority of them will live) you need serious airflow (and serious noise) to keep them cool Last edited by Mister_Tad; 18th Apr 2006 at 20:11.

19th Apr 2006, 16:24	#17
Mister_Tad Serious about coffee Moderator Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Nottingham Posts: 7,556	15k.4 vs competing 15k units from Maxtor and Fujitsu link 15k.4 vs previous generation 15k fujitsu MAS link These are all real-world benchmarks, nothing synthetic like drive manufacturers sometimes like to pimp seagate have never really been at the leading edge of performance typically, they're first off the mark to announce and release a drive (ie, the 15k.5), it comes out, is about as fast or a little bit faster than whats around at the time, then its completely over-taken when competing units are availible also, keep in mind that "The Cheetah 15K.5 will ship in June" means that we'll be lucky to see it in volume by september Last edited by Mister_Tad; 19th Apr 2006 at 17:14.

20th Apr 2006, 08:12	#19
JADS Et arma et verba vulnerant Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Portsmouth, UK Posts: 2,919	Seagate is going to launch the Barracuda 7200.10 shortly that will include a 750GB hard drive! 1TB here we come ! Seagate Barracude 7200.10 750GB HDD For the curious it is likely to cost $520.00 in the USA and around £300 in the U.K. __________________ [AMD A64 2800+ + Zalman 7700][MSI K8N Neo Platinum][1GB Corsair PC3200][Leadtek Geforce 6600GT][Seagate Barracuda 7200.7 80GB + Maxtor Diamond Max Plus10 200GB + Maxtor Diamond Max16 120GB][Plextor PX-716 DVD-RW + 2x Plextor Premium 52x32x52 CD-RW + 16x Samsung DVD][Coolermaster ATC-201 BXT][Antec TruePower 430][Dell 2405FPW + Mitsubishi Diamond Pro 2070u][Logitech MX1000][Matias Tactile Pro][Griffin Technology PowerMate Black] Email Me