Sony talks PS3 losses - bit-tech.net Forums

WilHarris · 31st Jul 2006, 15:15

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2006/07...ks_ps3_losses/

woodshop · 31st Jul 2006, 15:21

Huh still no word on per console loss then, a??

rupbert · 31st Jul 2006, 15:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by woodshop

Huh still no word on per console loss then, a??

I think I remember reading that to break even on a single unit, the PS3 would have to sell for around the $800 mark. And they will be selling at $499?

So $1.8 billion loss if they sell their predicted 6 million units?

DougEdey · 31st Jul 2006, 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by rupbert

I think I remember reading that to break even on a single unit, the PS3 would have to sell for around the $800 mark. And they will be selling at $499?

I think Bindi and me worked it out.

Quote:

Just actually looked at your calculations...
The yield % is for chips with 7+ cores (valid for PS3)

221mm2 core size.

300mm wafer = 150mm radius = pi x r x r
= 3.142 x 150mm x 150mm
= 70695mm2

Cores per wafer = 319.88 ~ 300 for those around the edge (circular wafer, square cores)

20% of 300 = 60 Chips/PS3s per wafer

Each wafer costs $3000 (typically) = $50 per PS3 JUST IN RAW Cells!

DXR_13KE · 31st Jul 2006, 19:53

DougEdey thats nice but what about the other components? the BRD drive, the graphics card.....etc.....and the payment for the people that make the console.

riggs · 31st Jul 2006, 23:14

Quote:

Punch Jump news posted an article Friday regarding Sony's manufacturing costs for the PS3 and the outcome, determined by analysts. Each PS3 unit, regardless of the SKU, costs Sony $750 dollars to manufacture. After a year, the analysts predict, Sony will get hit with a $2 billion deficit. To Sony, that may not be much, but that really is a damage dealing amount regardless of your company's current position.

olly_lewis · 31st Jul 2006, 23:23

This is going to ruin Sony, even if it goes well things aren't going to look good in the Sony offices, the PS3 might and i say again MIGHT do well, better than the 360 and perhaps, but probably not, outsell the Wii, it will take them year to recoup a profit from those losses...

Bladestorm · 31st Jul 2006, 23:49

I realize that the console companys have made it there business to turn a loss on the consoles and make money on the games .. but 5 years ? that strikes me as far too long, given there will surely be another 1-2 console generations around by then ? would that mean they never turn a profit in the end ?

TheoGeo · 1st Aug 2006, 00:11

not breaking even for 5 years... why did that make me smile a little?

I've thought for a long time that sony were pushing it with this console, the 'you would be honoured' marketing, the adventerous cell processors, forcing you to have an expensive blu-ray unit, the george foreman looks, the copy cat gyroscope controller, them being sued over their rumble feature and the fact that they still havnt changed the layout of the imo poor playstation controller.

edit: not to mention the fact that the ps2 is coming up to 6 years old, does that mean the ps3 will be replaced just after it breaks even, and thats if its still popular in 5 years time, isn't the time between console generations shrinking? im sure the ps1 generation lasted much longer than the ps2 generation and the one before that longer still.

boggsi · 1st Aug 2006, 05:14

bare in mind an article a few months back, i dont have a link, saying they expect the PS3/other current gen consoles to have a 10 year life span, that being the case they would more than make their money back. Not to mention knock on benifits of blu-ray, sony stands to gain a lot if their calculations are correct

The two things you can doubt are: its actual success in terms of sales and the 10 year life span

LVMike · 1st Aug 2006, 07:52

i can very easily doubt the 10 year life span...... there I just did it, did you see? No?! Ok Ok Ill do it again...... there.

You cant assume your product will last 10 and that your rivals will just sit by and wait to release new kit. Saying the PS3 is designed to have a 10year product life span tells me that sony is going to sit on their asses for 10 before they get around do designing the ps4. IN that time microsoft will have released at least one new box and nintendo will probably have had 4 different products launched.

Sathy · 1st Aug 2006, 15:56

Eventhough I wish no evil to any console companies, mainly because having competition is a good thing, the numbers are quite dreadful if you ask me...that's one massive risk they are taking. I don't think any - no matter how talented - market analyst can predict what's bound to happen in the next 10 years.

It's true that PS3 is (or atleast should be) in a way alot more "future-proof" for a lack of a better term in the way of performance - the more cores, the merrier - but...that's one hell of a dent in their profits for several years. I would be very interested in knowing some numbers about sony's annual income and how much they get from the game houses for lisences. I suppose someone knows where I might find something about these?

DLoney · 1st Aug 2006, 16:19

wow... 5yrs!
by that point, everyone will be ready to by the next system.

yahooadam · 1st Aug 2006, 23:01

console's used to live for about 5-6 years before (the ps1 was around there too) only recently has MS pushed a much faster console development cycle

(i believe the information in this post to be true, correct me if im wrong)

31st Jul 2006, 15:15	#1
WilHarris Just another nobody Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Oxford Posts: 2,671	Sony talks PS3 losses http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2006/07...ks_ps3_losses/

31st Jul 2006, 19:53	#5
DXR_13KE Madeira's banana is the best!!! Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Madeira ; Portugal Posts: 6,476	DougEdey thats nice but what about the other components? the BRD drive, the graphics card.....etc.....and the payment for the people that make the console. __________________ *Renegade X - 0.40 Release!* <---- CLICK!

31st Jul 2006, 23:23	#7
olly_lewis Hypermodder Join Date: May 2006 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 756	This is going to ruin Sony, even if it goes well things aren't going to look good in the Sony offices, the PS3 might and i say again MIGHT do well, better than the 360 and perhaps, but probably not, outsell the Wii, it will take them year to recoup a profit from those losses... __________________ My signature dumped me... ___________

31st Jul 2006, 23:49	#8
Bladestorm Hypermodder Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 682	I realize that the console companys have made it there business to turn a loss on the consoles and make money on the games .. but 5 years ? that strikes me as far too long, given there will surely be another 1-2 console generations around by then ? would that mean they never turn a profit in the end ? __________________ Athlon 64 X2 3800+ @ 250x10 (1.475v) \| EVGA GTX 260 55nm SSC \| A8N-SLI Premium \| 2x(4GB) Corsair Twinx2048-PC3200C2 \| Asus Xonar DX \| Antec truepower 550w \| Akasa Eclipse-62 DDC12VPlus1, DD TDX, 3/8 tygon r3603 tubing, PA120.2, DD double floppy bay res

1st Aug 2006, 00:11	#9
TheoGeo What are these goddamn animals?! Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Reading Posts: 2,205	not breaking even for 5 years... why did that make me smile a little? I've thought for a long time that sony were pushing it with this console, the 'you would be honoured' marketing, the adventerous cell processors, forcing you to have an expensive blu-ray unit, the george foreman looks, the copy cat gyroscope controller, them being sued over their rumble feature and the fact that they still havnt changed the layout of the imo poor playstation controller. edit: not to mention the fact that the ps2 is coming up to 6 years old, does that mean the ps3 will be replaced just after it breaks even, and thats if its still popular in 5 years time, isn't the time between console generations shrinking? im sure the ps1 generation lasted much longer than the ps2 generation and the one before that longer still. __________________ My Deviance -- My Music Athlon X2 4400+ -- 2GB Corsair XMS -- Geforce 7800GT -- Abit AN8-SLI -- 24" BenQ fp241w -- 74 gig raptor -- 1.6TB total storage -- 530w tagan psu Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there. Last edited by TheoGeo; 1st Aug 2006 at 00:18.

31st Jul 2006, 15:21	#2
woodshop UnSeenly Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: The Depths Of Hades Posts: 1,381	Huh still no word on per console loss then, a??

1st Aug 2006, 05:14	#10
boggsi Multimodder Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 105	bare in mind an article a few months back, i dont have a link, saying they expect the PS3/other current gen consoles to have a 10 year life span, that being the case they would more than make their money back. Not to mention knock on benifits of blu-ray, sony stands to gain a lot if their calculations are correct The two things you can doubt are: its actual success in terms of sales and the 10 year life span

1st Aug 2006, 07:52	#11
LVMike Supermodder Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Las Vegas NV & Rolla MO Posts: 412	i can very easily doubt the 10 year life span...... there I just did it, did you see? No?! Ok Ok Ill do it again...... there. You cant assume your product will last 10 and that your rivals will just sit by and wait to release new kit. Saying the PS3 is designed to have a 10year product life span tells me that sony is going to sit on their asses for 10 before they get around do designing the ps4. IN that time microsoft will have released at least one new box and nintendo will probably have had 4 different products launched.

1st Aug 2006, 15:56	#12
Sathy Multimodder Join Date: May 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 163	Eventhough I wish no evil to any console companies, mainly because having competition is a good thing, the numbers are quite dreadful if you ask me...that's one massive risk they are taking. I don't think any - no matter how talented - market analyst can predict what's bound to happen in the next 10 years. It's true that PS3 is (or atleast should be) in a way alot more "future-proof" for a lack of a better term in the way of performance - the more cores, the merrier - but...that's one hell of a dent in their profits for several years. I would be very interested in knowing some numbers about sony's annual income and how much they get from the game houses for lisences. I suppose someone knows where I might find something about these? __________________ Using: Core 2 Q6600 \| 2GB Corsair XMS \| GeForce 8800 GTS 512\| Antec Phantom 500

1st Aug 2006, 16:19	#13
DLoney Multimodder Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: The Great State of TEXAS Posts: 208	wow... 5yrs! by that point, everyone will be ready to by the next system.

1st Aug 2006, 23:01	#14
yahooadam Ultra csavarkulcs Banned Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: UK Posts: 1,323	console's used to live for about 5-6 years before (the ps1 was around there too) only recently has MS pushed a much faster console development cycle (i believe the information in this post to be true, correct me if im wrong)