Windows Windows 8 Marmite thread... Because you either love it or hate it.

[faugusztin]

Originally Posted by pilsner72

Yeah I suppose it will take time, Day of Defeat source stopped working for some reason but BF3 runs great.

It has nothing to do with W8 and it has a tons to do with Valve :
http://steamcommunity.com/app/300/di...6056593498567/

[theshadow2001]

Originally Posted by Nexxo

Yup: people did not see the need for Windows or a mouse. Now people couldn't imagine doing without them. Now they don't see the need for live Tiles or a touch screen... plus ca change...

I can take or leave a mouse frankly, or even a gui. I prefer to stick with a keyboard when data entry and minor navigation is required. Touchs forte is pointing at a low number of large buttons. There needs to be major improvement in gui and device design to bring touch up to the same speed and precision offered by a keyboard and mouse. What that improvement is I have no idea

[GoodBytes]

Originally Posted by longweight

Awesome thank you!

If you have the paid subscription, it will also work with the Zune desktop software (same music library as the XBox Music service). However it must be noted that due to the different DRM, XBox Music can't play downloaded Zune music, and vise versa. And o course, Windows Phone 8 won't work with the Zune. Zune software also works under Windows XP, Vista and 7. So if you are at work and can install the Zune client app, you can still get your music.
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/Live/Partners/Zune

[Jehla]

Has anyone had any luck getting the movies app to see ripped (mp4) dvds as movies/TV shows rather than just "other"?

Also, I can't add files from my NAS (DLNA) /rage.

P.S. It also seems silly that you can't watch trailers from the movies app.

[GoodBytes]

Originally Posted by Jehla

Also, I can't add files from my NAS (DLNA) /rage.

Windows 8 apps uses your library folder to show content. Sadly the library folder structure has not been updated in Windows 8 since 7. So it doesn't support locations that can't be index, or detected as removable (although a work around can be done for this last point). So as you NAS isn't using Windows, it can't index the location, therefore it can't be added.

P.S. It also seems silly that you can't watch trailers from the movies app.

That's the movie industry for you. They are the ones pushing these laws. I guess they think that you'll collect all the trailers and make movie out of it and pirate it, and people wont' go out and get the movie. Every time Microsoft shows a trailer of a movie in a press conference, and you are watching from a live video feed, the video cuts during this time, because Microsoft needs to pay licensing cost to show a trailer of a movie.

[RichCreedy]

I've fixed my metadata(tag) issue for the music app, because my music folder is on a small business server, I changed the folder permissions so that the computer/laptop had access as apposed to user accounts, and low and behold my library of music now works flawlessly, with all the tag data as well

[pilsner72]

Originally Posted by faugusztin

It has nothing to do with W8 and it has a tons to do with Valve :
http://steamcommunity.com/app/300/di...6056593498567/

Yeah valves PSOD

[DragunovHUN]

Originally Posted by pilsner72

Yeah valves PSOD

That actually looks like a not-metro live tile, lol.

[impar]

Greetings!

Originally Posted by Nexxo

Interestingly, despite the anticipated drama and reluctance to adopt the new Windows GUI and its accompanying input device, it later became the de facto industry standard. Hmmm... we may be there again.

There is a slight difference of ergonomics between a mouse and a touchscreen. You could add a mouse to your work environment without major problems, turning to touchscreen forces an adpatation.
But in the end its all about the programs.
I still use a "DOS-inside -window" program at work and using it keyboard beats mouse, no contest really.
Another program was updated from "DOS-inside-window" to normal windows back in 2008-09, it is impossible to use just the beyboard, mouse is needed. Funny thing is that the old program was faster on some tasks. Same thing still happens with text editing, using keyboard to select and edit text is way faster than using the mouse.

In a way touch seems more directed to passive media consumption or quick consults not creation or prolonged work. It has its use but the same way mouse didnt make keyboards obsolete, just complemented it, touch will be another alternative not a substitution of keyboard or mouse at a desk, if/when touch is available.
Small touch gadgets will be pretty common but work will be made at desk, using KB+M, for a long time still.

[faugusztin]

Originally Posted by theshadow2001

There needs to be major improvement in gui and device design to bring touch up to the same speed and precision offered by a keyboard and mouse. What that improvement is I have no idea

You can't. The issue is not at the device side, but at your - human side. You can't achieve mouse precision with a big chunk of flesh called finger.

[Nexxo]

Originally Posted by impar

Greetings!

There is a slight difference of ergonomics between a mouse and a touchscreen. You could add a mouse to your work environment without major problems, turning to touchscreen forces an adpatation.
But in the end its all about the programs.
I still use a "DOS-inside -window" program at work and using it keyboard beats mouse, no contest really.
Another program was updated from "DOS-inside-window" to normal windows back in 2008-09, it is impossible to use just the beyboard, mouse is needed. Funny thing is that the old program was faster on some tasks. Same thing still happens with text editing, using keyboard to select and edit text is way faster than using the mouse.

In a way touch seems more directed to passive media consumption or quick consults not creation or prolonged work. It has its use but the same way mouse didnt make keyboards obsolete, just complemented it, touch will be another alternative not a substitution of keyboard or mouse at a desk, if/when touch is available.
Small touch gadgets will be pretty common but work will be made at desk, using KB+M, for a long time still.

It is important to consider how computer use has evolved over time with the technology. Tablets are so popular because they allow most people (not just geeks like us) to use computers in the way they want to use them --casually, simply and intuitively, for casual and simple tasks. Touch is good for that. Most people don't program, code, do complex spreadsheets or write theses, so don't need to sit at a desk with a 101-key keyboard and mouse.

Touch is not a passing fad. It is here to stay because computer use has changed. And this use will carry on changing towards becoming a consumer device like toasters, dish washers and TVs. The days of having to solder circuit boards (bring your own case, keyboard and PSU) and writing code are in the past. Only hard-core geeks still do that, and they are not the target audience --for Apple, Google or Microsoft.

[GoodBytes]

Originally Posted by impar

There is a slight difference of ergonomics between a mouse and a touchscreen. You could add a mouse to your work environment without major problems, turning to touchscreen forces an adpatation.
But in the end its all about the programs.
I still use a "DOS-inside -window" program at work and using it keyboard beats mouse, no contest really.
Another program was updated from "DOS-inside-window" to normal windows back in 2008-09, it is impossible to use just the beyboard, mouse is needed. Funny thing is that the old program was faster on some tasks. Same thing still happens with text editing, using keyboard to select and edit text is way faster than using the mouse.

Ok, so get a video convertion utility that only works in Command Prompt, I'll give you 10 videos to convert. I want you to convert them into MKV, with 500 kb/s bit rate, at 60fps, at half resolution, where the audio is compressed in MP4, at 128kb/s, with 2 channels, at a sample rate of 44100, and I want you to set a subtitile file with them. I also want that video 5, has 3 sec cut out form the start, 5 sec at the end cut out, and there is a black section somewhere in the middle of the video, I want that cut out too.

Try doing that in Command Line. You'll pass half an hour typing all the arguments, making sure that you are typing them well, and it follows the supported format of the argument. While with an UI, you have default settings, and usually remembers last settings you put, and you can edit the video with precision, and see the results instantly.

Another example.
Check you e-mail. Outlook in command line... good luck. Oh by the way, don't think you can do an interface with the command line prompt, that is cheating. As I can also easily make my own makeshift mouse and use that to switch between calendar, todo list, search my e-mail at the same time as seeing a preview, and see any new RSS and e-mail feeds all together.

It makes me laugh people using Vim on Linux to program C/C++ Fully command line, and for the simple things you do in Visual Studio, takes a very long time in command line. Not to mention to always close and load files, and start editing make file, as a user add source code files, and there is like 3 keyboard shortcuts to do to simply save a file. And this is suppose to be a super advance, keyboard optimize text editor, the so call the best of the best. Yyyeeeaaaa... I used that thing, it doesn't deserve to be called a thing. You need a manual next to you filled with keyboard shortcuts and several step keyboard shortcuts to do things.

Thanks but no thanks.

[theshadow2001]

Originally Posted by GoodBytes

Ok, so get a video convertion utility that only works in Command Prompt, I'll give you 10 videos to convert. I want you to convert them into MKV, with 500 kb/s bit rate, at 60fps, at half resolution, where the audio is compressed in MP4, at 128kb/s, with 2 channels, at a sample rate of 44100, and I want you to set a subtitile file with them. I also want that video 5, has 3 sec cut out form the start, 5 sec at the end cut out, and there is a black section somewhere in the middle of the video, I want that cut out too.

Surely once you do the first one you can just copy and paste the commands for the other 9 which would save you a bit of time, as opposed to doing each one with a mouse.

Originally Posted by GoodBytes

Another example.
Check you e-mail. Outlook in command line... good luck. Oh by the way, don't think you can do an interface with the command line prompt, that is cheating. As I can also easily make my own makeshift mouse and use that to switch between calendar, todo list, search my e-mail at the same time as seeing a preview, and see any new RSS and e-mail feeds all together.

Outlook is designed to be used with a mouse. It would be like trying to type in the command line using a mouse.

Originally Posted by GoodBytes

It makes me laugh people using Vim on Linux to program C/C++ Fully command line, and for the simple things you do in Visual Studio, takes a very long time in command line. Not to mention to always close and load files, and start editing make file, as a user add source code files, and there is like 3 keyboard shortcuts to do to simply save a file. And this is suppose to be a super advance, keyboard optimize text editor, the so call the best of the best. Yyyeeeaaaa... I used that thing, it doesn't deserve to be called a thing. You need a manual next to you filled with keyboard shortcuts and several step keyboard shortcuts to do things.

Thanks but no thanks.

It could well take the VIM guys longer to do the same thing in Visual Studio its all a matter of what your used to.

[faugusztin]

Originally Posted by GoodBytes

It makes me laugh people using Vim on Linux to program C/C++ Fully command line, and for the simple things you do in Visual Studio, takes a very long time in command line. Not to mention to always close and load files, and start editing make file, as a user add source code files, and there is like 3 keyboard shortcuts to do to simply save a file. And this is suppose to be a super advance, keyboard optimize text editor, the so call the best of the best. Yyyeeeaaaa... I used that thing, it doesn't deserve to be called a thing. You need a manual next to you filled with keyboard shortcuts and several step keyboard shortcuts to do things.

That is why sane non-Windows developers use KDevelop or Eclipse/CDT .

Anyway, for people who like to use keyboard for navigating Windows, W8 is actually a blessing and many, many miles ahead of Windows 7.

Originally Posted by theshadow2001

It could well take the VIM guys longer to do the same thing in Visual Studio its all a matter of what your used to.

VIM can't do stuff like background compiling, project-wide error checking while you type etc. Seriously, VIM, Emacs etc are only for quick edits or for people enjoying torturing themselves.

[theshadow2001]

Originally Posted by faugusztin

VIM can't do stuff like background compiling, project-wide error checking while you type etc. Seriously, VIM, Emacs etc are only for quick edits or for people enjoying torturing themselves.

Indeed, I freely admit I don't have much of a notion when it comes to those editors. But as you say useful for a quick edit. A bit like when I use notepad, who needs a full functioning word processor when I need to write and save about two lines of text

I think we're straying from the topic of touch screen being the new mice.

[GoodBytes]

Originally Posted by theshadow2001

Surely once you do the first one you can just copy and paste the commands for the other 9 which would save you a bit of time, as opposed to doing each one with a mouse.

Assuming you are not using a crap software, it usually keeps your last setting on the UI, so you save yourself to even have the need to copy and paste your code. Also GUI programs can also support batch process. So everything could be done in one shot.
While in command prompt, sure you can copy and paste files, but what if each video is at different paths or the same but the file names are complex and long, you have to first write all 10 paths/filename of each videos on paper first, than type all the command line to do this.
Sure in Linux you can create multiple command prompt window, and go back and forth, but that is still time consuming.

Command prompt are great for simple things. Anything complex or using a program that requires a lot of info, is cumbersome. Back in the old days, everything was simple, mostly due to lack of processing power. Later it became no longer the case. I can give you a lot more examples, but they are based on programs I use, and not common to you, so you guys won't know what I am talking about. I could show pictures of what I am talking about, but Bit-tech.net blocked my domain name for the img tag for some reason (I was not informed of any issues, nor nothing goes against forum rules.. it just doesn't work anymore)

[theshadow2001]

Originally Posted by GoodBytes

but what if each video is at different paths or the same but the file names are complex and long, you have to first write all 10 paths/filename of each videos on paper first, than type all the command line to do this.
Sure in Linux you can create multiple command prompt window, and go back and forth, but that is still time consuming.

Generally you hit the first one or two letters of what your looking for then tab and it fills out the rest of the info for you. Depending on the number of files and folders it can be quicker than searching for and then clicking on a folder.

Originally Posted by GoodBytes

I can give you a lot more examples...

And I'm sure some linux guru's can show you alternative examples of the benefits of non gui. The debate between command line and GUI has been done to death.

The bottoms line is I'm not saying that GUI's are bad. I just wouldn't fall apart without one. I don't mind working in a command line and sometimes I prefer not to use the mouse.

[RichCreedy]

Originally Posted by theshadow2001

Indeed, I freely admit I don't have much of a notion when it comes to those editors. But as you say useful for a quick edit. A bit like when I use notepad, who needs a full functioning word processor when I need to write and save about two lines of text

I think we're straying from the topic of touch screen being the new mice.

ha, I use notepad to make minor edits to my websites, lol

[Nexxo]

Originally Posted by GoodBytes

I could show pictures of what I am talking about, but Bit-tech.net blocked my domain name for the img tag for some reason (I was not informed of any issues, nor nothing goes against forum rules.. it just doesn't work anymore)

Not intentional, I assure you. Must be a glitch. What domain name is blocked?

[icemanTM]

Blazing fast to start but painful to shut down... the shut down button should be changed to an easier position... Thats the only glitch I've found with windows 8