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Old 14th Feb 2017, 21:58   #121
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I always thought 20% would be enough of a undercut if similar performance. At 600 euro it's 40% cheaper. That to me sounds like a lot of a undercut if the expected similar or better performance is true. Enough most of the single thread performance figures I have saw are quiet low. And in line with Intels 8 core chips.

The 7700k is massively clear of both in some of those tests at stock and even further when overclocked.
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Old 14th Feb 2017, 22:24   #122
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That's also because the 7 series benefits hugely from increased clocks. It's no faster than Skylake at the same clocks.
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Old 15th Feb 2017, 10:04   #123
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I always thought 20% would be enough of a undercut if similar performance. At 600 euro it's 40% cheaper. That to me sounds like a lot of a undercut if the expected similar or better performance is true. Enough most of the single thread performance figures I have saw are quiet low. And in line with Intels 8 core chips.

The 7700k is massively clear of both in some of those tests at stock and even further when overclocked.
I think you will find that Intel do not need to charge what they do for their CPUs to have a decent turnover. However, like a lot of things these days people are pushing as hard as they can and being as greedy as possible.

Look at chocolate bars. Some of them are now half the size they were or less. Manus claim that they are doing it to, and I quote "Reduce the sugar and calories". Then why are they charging the same price? They will continue until basically there's **** all left inside the wrapper.

Whatever people thought of Bulldozer and Vishera (I liked the latter, 15% for some general tweaking was awesome) they still cost AMD money to make. Yet for the most part they would be lucky to pull 120 from a customer (the 8320, the CPU of choice) and they continued making them for ages and ages and probably made a loss but they stayed afloat.

So if they don't "need" to charge a grand for an 8 core CPU then they probably won't. I'm pretty sure they are not stupid enough to sell them at a loss, so they must be turning a profit on what they are going to charge for them.

The second hand market is full of 8 core Xeons for 70 and up. These were once $2000 CPUs.

Intel are just far too precious of their cores and that is why you feel the way you do. But just because they are being greedy doesn't mean AMD need to follow the same business path. I would imagine AMD are going for "turn and burn" and will be planning on selling more at a lower price to come to the profit they need. They want back marketshare, and you don't get that from being a greedy twunt.
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Old 15th Feb 2017, 11:00   #124
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Originally Posted by Vault-Tec View Post
Intel are just far too precious of their cores and that is why you feel the way you do.
Just a thought and probably totally unrelated but could that be down to Intel owning their own fabs versus AMD not, does AMD pay per working chip whereas Intel pays for each wafer no matter how many working cores are on it?

Last edited by Corky42; 15th Feb 2017 at 11:09. Reason: Missed a T
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Old 15th Feb 2017, 11:03   #125
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Just a though and probably totally unrelated but could that be down to Intel owning their own fabs versus AMD not, does AMD pay per working chip whereas Intel pays for each wafer no matter how many working cores are on it?
I have absolutely no idea tbh dude !

Oh yeah, reviews are going live on the 28th apparently..

https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu...ebruary_28th/1
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Old 15th Feb 2017, 11:05   #126
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600 Euro is basically 600 which is still more cash than most will pay for a cpu. AMDs problem they could price them at 300 and still not gain market share.

Remember the market share gains are in the lower price brackets 100-150 probably at most. Intel sell a lot to OEM. There actual sales to people like us are very limited if what info they have provided before is accurate

AMD is the other way around, they sell nothing to OEM and a lot to people like us.

Look at the 480 gpu. Good chip better than nvidia equivalents ( in some titles) but Nvidia have sold more.
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Old 15th Feb 2017, 11:17   #127
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Isn't the 600 price for the top end 8c/16t chip though, i can't see many people wanting or needing that sort of chip, wouldn't most go for something like the R5 1400X that's priced around the 200 mark.
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Old 17th Feb 2017, 20:46   #128
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More Ryzen benchmarks leaked, this time from the 6-core version of the chip. Looks very promising indeed.
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Old 17th Feb 2017, 21:34   #129
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Hard to really know how good it is until we see the benchmark configuration etc, I saw some numbers of the high end Intel CPUs overclocked only doing 1800 single thread, but then I look at my old i5 Ivy and it does 2100, so really nothing will be truly known until review sites are putting together similarly configured machines under a solid test environment.

Looking forward to the challenge on tinkering with a new chip/platform when it comes to overclocks etc. but is there enough there to tempt me.
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Old 17th Feb 2017, 23:46   #130
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I really don't know where 600 came from. Apparently the RRP for the top end chip is $499. It's likely there will be gouging at launch if there is low supply but eventually the chip will cost whatever $499 works out to be. I did see it at almost 600 euro on a foreign site but that was one instance.

From what I can see of the 1600x I could not catch it with my 5820k, even at 4.5ghz. I know it's a pretty basic benchmark and will of course do more tests once it's actually here in the metal but right now it is looking like you can get the 1600x for around 260 or so.

I can see a lot of them being sold.
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Old 17th Feb 2017, 23:56   #131
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More Ryzen benchmarks leaked, this time from the 6-core version of the chip. Looks very promising indeed.
I fervently hope they are every bit as good as these unofficial benchmarks claim.

We're not going to see CPUs suddenly get much cheaper, but we might get better value for our money in the future. I won't be upgrading anytime soon but, when I eventually do, I'd like to think I will have a choice.
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Old 18th Feb 2017, 01:15   #132
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I fervently hope they are every bit as good as these unofficial benchmarks claim... *snip*
Me too, Dave. However, we've been here before (as I know you're aware).

I'm holding back judgement until after launch. It's the only way these days (again, as I know you're aware ).
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Old 18th Feb 2017, 07:57   #133
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And thanks to this hype train , we all know the etailers will ramp prices way above rrp
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Old 18th Feb 2017, 08:15   #134
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I really don't know where 600 came from. Apparently the RRP for the top end chip is $499. It's likely there will be gouging at launch if there is low supply but eventually the chip will cost whatever $499 works out to be. I did see it at almost 600 euro on a foreign site but that was one instance.
$499 is approx 400, add 20% VAT to get 480.

Historically, however, when setting a UK MSRP, manufacturers tended to use a 1:1 exchange rate, meaning they'd start at $499 = 499 THEN add the VAT to get 600.

(This why there was a 1080 in my carryon, when returning from LA last Oct).
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Old 18th Feb 2017, 08:49   #135
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Is there something wrong with the forum's automatic picture resizer, because VT's screenshots in post #114 have suddenly become enormous and are breaking the page somewhat This seems to be happening a lot recently...
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Old 18th Feb 2017, 10:20   #136
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Honestly at this point UK pricing could be anywhere. If the prices we have been shown are distribution they could be up to 40% in on top for a rrp.

$499 if so could become 499 before vat with the way the has been all $ based products have saw price rises

Could the 600 Euro be a retailer price for example including Vat. Was on a retailer site.
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Old 18th Feb 2017, 10:37   #137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vault-Tec
From what I can see of the 1600x I could not catch it with my 5820k, even at 4.5ghz.
Really? My 5820K @ 4.6GHz destroys the Ryzen result.



Two factors remain: overclocking headroom, and price. We won't know any of this until the end of this month after reviews start surfacing and products hit the shelves.
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Old 18th Feb 2017, 10:49   #138
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Waiting on reviews but I'm quite interested in the 1600x
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Old 18th Feb 2017, 11:50   #139
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Is there something wrong with the forum's automatic picture resizer
Yep, unfortunately it has been broken for a couple weeks.
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Old 18th Feb 2017, 12:30   #140
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Really? My 5820K @ 4.6GHz destroys the Ryzen result.



Two factors remain: overclocking headroom, and price. We won't know any of this until the end of this month after reviews start surfacing and products hit the shelves.
Because you have faster memory than I do, we've already established that chap. You know what memory costs, do you think I would bother?

And 800 points over what could be a stock 1600x isn't destroying it. That's probably as high as your chip can go, too.
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