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Ukraine Russian invasion

Discussion in 'Serious' started by Otis1337, 1 Mar 2014.

  1. Otis1337

    Otis1337 aka - Ripp3r

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    I know there is an "Protests in Ukraine" thread, but a protest and invasion are two very different things!

    Whats happening:
    Thousands of Russian troops and naval units are been prepared and deployed on the boarders of Ukraine.
    Russian forces have taken over parliament buildings
    Air units have crossed the boarder as of today.
    Russia practically has Crimea occupied.

    Are Russia simply securing there military interests within Ukraine, or is there more too it?
    Lots of news articles popping us as this is now an invasion.
     
  2. Pliqu3011

    Pliqu3011 all flowers in time bend towards the sun

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    I had a feeling something like this might happen after Yanukovych suddenly fled, as if he got a phonecall that things were about to get nasty. But that could just be me, being a bit paranoid... ;)

    The rest of Ukraine will certainly not like it if Russia takes over Crimea, but the Crimeans themselves are known to be very pro-Russian and are even patrolling in small militia groups together with the Russians. I have absolutely no idea what's going to happen.
     
  3. Pookie

    Pookie Illegitimi non carborundum

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    I saw this on the news this morning and the speech from obama. Not sure what anyone can do about it? No one is stupid enough to start a war with Russia.
     
  4. Guest-16

    Guest-16 Guest

    Lines will be drawn, Crimea region will become a Russian autonomous region cause not even NATO will want to **** with 150,000 troops + sea support.

    Putin has shown he's the right amount of Orwellian nut-job to do things for the show of power and he'll be very happy to show 'the EU' who is boss, then use the news in pro-Russian propaganda back at home to divert attention away from internal issues.
     
  5. AlienwareAndy

    AlienwareAndy What's a Dremel?

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    When all is said and done we have an awful lot in common with the Russians, as Putin pointed out in his letter to Obama. IE - a common enemy and so on.

    Why on earth we would go to war with them would be a mystery. They've pretty much sat back as we've invaded terrorist nations and only really got involved when the Iran drum was being beaten. However, as they were quick to point out, our common enemy hates them just as much as it hates us.
     
  6. faugusztin

    faugusztin I *am* the guy with two left hands

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    Prime minister of Criema, Sergej Aksenov is the Vasiľ Bilak of Ukraine. You might be asking, who is this Bilak guy. Well, he was one of the hard line communists who "invited" the Russians (no, i won't call them Soviets, because Soviets = Russians, even if they try to distance from their past) to Czechoslovakia... And then Russians were here for next 22 years until communism have fallen and we kicked them out back home. And 30 years before that, Germans in Sudeten (Czech Republic) requested the "peacekeeping forces" from Nazi Germany.

    I hope this Aksenov guy do realize that he pretty much confined himself to Russia & Crimea (in case Russia invades it) for rest of his life, as he will join Yanukovich in Interpol database.

    Also, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum_on_Security_Assurances .
     
    Last edited: 1 Mar 2014
  7. Otis1337

    Otis1337 aka - Ripp3r

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    I agree with Bindi, i think Russia are only interested in Crimea who are very pro Russian anyway.

    Ukraine have a decent military, but there far to small to want to start anything with Russia, they will just get steam rolled. So it will be down to NATO, and even with NATO been superior with tek and equipment no one wants to see that kick off! As it could spark much bigger things than just Ukraine.
     
  8. rollo

    rollo Modder

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    NATO units will already be in country I'd imagine in covert roles. Ukraine has a decent ish airforce with some borrowed laser targeting they could easily cause havok on Russia's ground units. If they continue in country towards the Capitol NATO and in essence ( USA UK) would be forced to do something about it.

    Otherwise it would put the whole NATO thing at risk as what's the point in joining if you are not gonna protect each other.

    Russia and USA start a war it would be the end of humanity as it would end in certain nuclear destruction.
     
  9. faugusztin

    faugusztin I *am* the guy with two left hands

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    Ukraine is not part of NATO.
     
  10. Otis1337

    Otis1337 aka - Ripp3r

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    No one said it was...
     
  11. specofdust

    specofdust Banned

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    It's all so depressingly predictable.

    Ethnic Russians have appealed for help from Russia, Russia hands out citizenship to anyone then uses the excuse that it's protecting it's citizens. An autonomous republic will be created, recognised by Russia only. Russian forces will be invited to this new republic. The UK and US will ignore our treaty obligations, Ukraine probably won't put up an actual fight due to the disparity in capability, and hence just for wanting rid of a murderous and corrupt president, the Ukranians have a portion of their territory stolen from them by the Russians, who will presumably integrate it into its federation within 5-25 years once things have calmed down a little.
     
  12. Guest-16

    Guest-16 Guest

    ^^

    Does anyone know how significant the Crimea region is to Ukraine's GDP? Since their economy is already down the *******..
     
  13. faugusztin

    faugusztin I *am* the guy with two left hands

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    Not really. Crimea pretty much equals to Russian Naval Base + tourism. Eastern Ukraine on other side is pretty important.
     
  14. specofdust

    specofdust Banned

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    Not that important in the grand scheme of things, but not irrelevant. It's a big tourist destination, and it grows a fair amount of crops too. The big problem is that the Russians won't just take Crimea as such, they'll take Sevastopol too, which while not a part of the Crimean Oblast, is a major Ukranian city and generates a lot of money.

    The economics won't be crippling as they would be if say the three most eastern oblasts of Ukraine split off (the vast majority of Ukranian industry is based in the far east of the country).

    In short, their economy won't suffer hugely from Crimea being lost, it'll be like a man who's been shot three times losing a couple of fingers.
     
  15. Weekly_Estimate

    Weekly_Estimate Random bird noises.

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    wait so

    ""In a joint statement on December 4, 2009 the presidents of the United States and Russia, Barack Obama and Dmitry Medvedev, confirmed the assurances of security to Ukraine, Kazakhstan and Belarus given on the heels of these countries' consent in 1994 to give up their nuclear weapons.""

    Then Russia invades them? wtf
     
    Last edited: 1 Mar 2014
  16. specofdust

    specofdust Banned

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    Russia doesn't honour treaties or international law. This only surprises people who don't understand how Russia approaches the world.
     
  17. TheBlackSwordsMan

    TheBlackSwordsMan Over the Hills and Far Away

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    I heard some Pro-Russian militia was singing the USSR athem, in Sevastopol : /
     
  18. Cthippo

    Cthippo Can't mod my way out of a paper bag

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    There is an element of self determination at work here too.

    A lot of the people living in the Crimea identify as being Russian and aren't going to give that up just because the rest of the country changes around them. Many of these people are members or support staff of the Russian Navy, or their families, or retirees who came to work and stayed. Their family ties are to Russia. It's easy to see this as "big bad Russia invading poor little Ukraine", but it's not that simple. Part of it also is people saying "hey, we live here too and we want no part of your revolution so please piss off and leave us in peace".

    In the grander scheme of things, it's kind of amazing that a country as big as the USSR / Russia got so badly screwed on seaports.
     
  19. faugusztin

    faugusztin I *am* the guy with two left hands

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    @Cthippo: that is why they have the broadest possible autonomy, the only step above their current status is separate state. Also the Russians clearly aren't planing to stop in Crimea, the parliament gave power to Putin to invade the whole of Ukraine.

    There are only two possible outcomes of any Russian invasion of Crimea & Ukraine - EU/UN sanctions against Russia if they succeed, or loss of Russian naval base in Crimea and EU/UN sanctions against Russia if Russia loses. There is no chance of positive outcome of this for Russia - in case of Georgia, Azerbaijan and Armenia this tactics of divide & conquer was relatively far from Europe, but this is Ukraine, on doorstep of EU & NATO, in a country which wants to be part of EU (at least the western part of it).
     
  20. Weekly_Estimate

    Weekly_Estimate Random bird noises.

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    Oh so big bad Country's can just flood areas with people, then claim it as their own? gtfo

    This is big bad Russia invading poor little Ukraine.

    Look a few comments up and you'll see Russian helicopters flying into little poor Ukraine.

    Invade (of an armed force) enter (a country or region) so as to subjugate or occupy it.
     

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