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Old 16th Apr 2017, 21:52   #6861
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theshadow2001 View Post
Sure and as they start voting the centrists in the generation above them will push more to the right and towards conservatism as old curmudgeons tend to do.
Not entirely --generations do change. This is why things that were acceptable even one generation ago are unacceptable now, and vice-versa.
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Old 16th Apr 2017, 22:05   #6862
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I think that just means conservatism will change rather than people's eventual gravitation towards it. I believe it was in this thread that someone posted old, racist, tory campaign posters that just wouldn't see the exit of someone's mind as an idea for a poster, let alone the light of day in present times. Yet you still have a conservative party spouting jingoism, anti-immigration and all that good conservative stuff. So yeah, sure things change but not that much.
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Old 16th Apr 2017, 22:30   #6863
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Conservatism changes because it is the product of new attitudes that subsequent generations introduce to it. Of course the ideology of the liberal left changes as well, so in comparison it will still appear rather conservative.

People change... but very slowly.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 09:01   #6864
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Is it just me that thinks it's a bit strange that Turkey has voted 52% to 48% in favor of major constitutional change and the amount of other similarities between their referendum and ours, neutering parliament, replacing a prime minster for a president, dividing the country, etc, etc.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 09:46   #6865
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlequin View Post
Lloyds Banking group - those who received something like 75 billion of taxpayers money will be moving their HQ to berlin
Sources please, for all of this.

The amount received from the government was 20.5bn, not 75bn (big damn difference there), and less than 1% of that - probably closer to 0.5% these days - has now been paid back.

It's not the "HQ" that will be moving to Berlin: Berlin will become their EU base of operations. Doesn't mean they're suddenly moving their registered office from London to Berlin.

This is probably going to fall on deaf ears/eyes, but please try to do some research before you post statements like that - or at least cite your sources.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 11:08   #6866
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UK: We don't want your EU regulations! We're leaving!
EU: OK, we'll relocate our EU regulatory bodies from London.
UK: How dare you try to punish us!
David Davis: That's a matter for negotiation, surely?

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Old 17th Apr 2017, 14:38   #6867
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Originally Posted by Byron C View Post
Sources please, for all of this.

The amount received from the government was 20.5bn, not 75bn (big damn difference there), and less than 1% of that - probably closer to 0.5% these days - has now been paid back.

It's not the "HQ" that will be moving to Berlin: Berlin will become their EU base of operations. Doesn't mean they're suddenly moving their registered office from London to Berlin.

This is probably going to fall on deaf ears/eyes, but please try to do some research before you post statements like that - or at least cite your sources.
https://www.theguardian.com/news/dat...-credit-crunch

Lloyds and rbs total combined is closer to 464 billion
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 15:14   #6868
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nexxo View Post
UK: We don't want your EU regulations! We're leaving!
EU: OK, we'll relocate our EU regulatory bodies from London.
UK: How dare you try to punish us!
David Davis: That's a matter for negotiation, surely?
UK: Leave means leave
EU Agencies: Ok then we're leaving...
UK: What!? why are you leaving? Leave didn't mean leave...
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 15:20   #6869
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlequin View Post
https://www.theguardian.com/news/dat...-credit-crunch

Lloyds and rbs total combined is closer to 464 billion
That still doesn't change the fact that they are only moving EU operations, which they won't be able to do after the Brexit from UK base of operations.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 15:58   #6870
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlequin View Post
https://www.theguardian.com/news/dat...-credit-crunch

Lloyds and rbs total combined is closer to 464 billion


Lloyds & RBS Combined total - you even said that in your post. RBS was not part of Lloyds as-was and it wasn't part of HBOS.

Lloyds bought out HBOS, which comprised (amongst other brands) Halifax and Bank of Scotland. Bank of Scotland and Royal Bank of Scotland are two different companies.

RBS has had a TON of money pumped into them because they were totally f'ed. LBG did receive government money (although not as a "bailout"), but since the s**t hit the fan LBG has largely stayed afloat by reducing operating costs and slashing jobs. In case it's not obvious, I work for LBG; I've been there since 2003 so I've watched this s**t happen.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 16:09   #6871
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Quote:
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UK: We don't want your EU regulations! We're leaving!
Have you seen the express article ? BREXIT PUNISHMENT.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 16:17   #6872
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It gets crazier than that.

Yeah, that's right:

Quote:
Britain is fighting to remain the home of two of the EU’s most prestigious agencies covering medicines and banking after Brexit, in a move that is likely to cause astonishment in European capitals.

David Davis, Brexit secretary, does not accept that the two agencies and roughly 1,000 staff will have to move from London’s Canary Wharf, even though the EU is about to run a competition to relocate them.A UK Brexit department spokesman said: “No decisions have been taken about the location of the European Banking Authority or the European Medicines Agency — these will be subject to the exit negotiations.”

The government has left open the possibility of keeping part of some EU agencies, at least in the short term, but the idea of the UK hosting key institutions after Brexit is unacceptable in Brussels. “The government will discuss with the EU and member states how best to continue co-operation in the fields of banking and medicines regulation in the best interests of both the UK and the EU,” the spokesman said.

Mr Davis may simply be putting the agencies into the wider Brexit negotiation in the expectation that they can be traded for a concession elsewhere; EU officials say there is no question they must move.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 16:36   #6873
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Have you seen the express article ? BREXIT PUNISHMENT.
No surprise at all.

The express is so far to the right of the spectrum that they would still think England is being modest and generous when it defines what cake is, pays nothing for it, eats it, still has it and denies others the right to even sniff at the crumbs.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 16:41   #6874
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I think EU will agree to keep those two institutions in UK - if Frankfurt gets Bank Of England. Same logic.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 18:50   #6875
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Have you seen the express article ? BREXIT PUNISHMENT.
Not that i know for sure as I've yet to come across what i consider a valid reason for leaving the EU, however from what I've read they're upset because they were either expecting things like that to be part of the negotiations, and/or because they weren't expecting them to move until after we've left the EU, the logic of that seem a bit daft to me but then again it fits in with most of what we've heard from brexiteers IMO.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 19:09   #6876
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To be fair, they are not moving it right now. They are starting the moving process. Which means selecting the country/city, getting all the necessary things in order like buying or leasing the buildings, setting up the infrastructure, hiring people... and only then, when all is ready and in working order will it be moved. Which might as well take most of the 2 years. But i guess Brexiters will have hard time explaining the loss of those ~2k jobs plus all the connected services which mean even more jobs lost. And not on the low end of payment scale.

In any case, how did they expect EU HQ for anything to be outside of EU territory ?
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 19:35   #6877
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Yea that's why their indignation made no sense to me, i mean it takes a long time to organise the moving of offices even for a small company, it would probably take even longer to move offices when it's a hub for 27 countries.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 20:34   #6878
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I guess it's a bit like this: when you split up with your partner, how do you expect that to work?

Many people want to indulge in the fantasy that their partner will be all distraught, clinging to their legs begging them not to go as they manfully walk away; that their partner will be truly sorry once they're gone and wish that they'd tried harder to please, that their life will henceforth be in tatters as they contemplate a bleak and lonely future over a tear-stained photograph of them as a couple in happier times.

What people don't want to imagine is that their spurned partner brightly says: "OK, I'll be off then!" and purposefully packs their bags and grabs their plane tickets (booked in advance) and walks away with the bounce of determination in their stride, off to a better life that they had already been planning for months.

For many people, when you dump your partner, you want the rejection, the loss, the pain to be all theirs. Only mature and sensible people realise that in a breakup, no matter who initiates it, the loss is inevitably mutual, and that nobody is so important and meaningful that they can't be got over.
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 21:07   #6879
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Actually - in a break up , 1 side usually has gone through those emotions and feelings before the real end of the relationship , then comes realisation and determination. Usually because they either have a PLAN or someone else to go to....
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Old 17th Apr 2017, 21:16   #6880
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Sure, but only an idiot expects their partner not to have one as well. Because they have worked through their own set of emotions too.

Brexit Britain, it turns out, didn't have a plan. It was the equivalent of having a stand-up row with the missus and angrily walking out the door --only to realise later that it has to go back to pack its bags, get the car keys and find a new place to live. Upon which return it finds that the missus has already cleared out the house and moved on.
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