Why Web 2.0 will end your privacy - bit-tech.net Forums

WilHarris · 3rd Jun 2006, 13:07

http://www.bit-tech.net/columns/2006...privacy/1.html

jezmck · 3rd Jun 2006, 13:42

So how long until bubble2.0 bursts?
And will it be as dramatic as the first burst?

saeghwin · 3rd Jun 2006, 13:44

Wow, nicely written. They'll never know anything about me though--I don't use any services like that.

Skutbag · 3rd Jun 2006, 14:02

So what if the man is going to know everything about you?

At least we'll be getting slightly more relevant junk mail.

Maybe they'll even start listening to us.

eddtox · 3rd Jun 2006, 14:10

Disturbing. [deletes google cookies]

-ed out

ch424 · 3rd Jun 2006, 14:11

Quote:

Most people will take Web 2.0 to mean the rise of bloggers.

Whenever I hear "Web 2.0" I think of Maddox's article on blogs.

ch424

specofdust · 3rd Jun 2006, 14:42

I seem to remember someone vaguely connected to google or one of those slightly less evil IT companies saying something along the lines of "Face it, on the internet, your privacy level is zero".

I think that's probably the case, and I think that's probably always been the case. The difference is that whereas a few years ago getting data out of people was complicated, you had to hack their computer(slow and inefficient) or or offer them prizes(can become expensive, and doesn't rake in that many people) to complete questionaires that are invariably misinterpreted and can give utterly useless data if made poorly, that sorta thing. Where-as with these modern services, it's easy, people are basicly saying "Here are my details, you can get more off me on the fly, gimme gimme gimme".

I think what you talk of is completely understandable, and for most people it's actually a very good thing.

Faulk_Wulf · 3rd Jun 2006, 16:43

Great article. Really makes you think. Loved the ending.

Quote:

When the Web 2.0 bubble bursts - when the massive buyouts are done, the millionaires are made and the sites we love today are in the hands of big business - the innovation will grind to a halt, and what's left will be the endless grinding of the marketeering machine.

But hey - at least you'll be closer to your friends. And you'll have free photo hosting, too.

g3n3tiX · 3rd Jun 2006, 16:57

Same thing...
Big brother is watching you, and then slapping you in the back

With all the Web 2.0 hype, there's GOT to be something behind it, some kind of goal.
And you found it.

I'm still using my gmail account though.
Google anonymising
There you'll find a tool to zero out your google cookie : better than deleting it.
Works with FF and IE. You've got to be on one of googlel's pages for it to work.

ocha · 3rd Jun 2006, 17:06

i thought you tube was doing a million dollars a month, not a day. Perhaps I am wrong though, I'm not sure I was listening properly.

Great article though, I have been thinking along these lines for a while.

RotoSequence · 3rd Jun 2006, 18:14

Interesting points. Yet more reinforcement to the idea that information services are becoming more valuable than physical products. This is truly the information age - yet, its not the end users that have access to the information - at least, not anywhere near what News Corp, Yahoo!, and Google have.

Da Dego · 3rd Jun 2006, 18:16

The question becomes...is this all that bad a thing?

All this marketing and the like...actual companies don't care about the individuals behind all this, we're simply helping them better understand trends. The data collected is not anonymous...but to the companies, it might as well be. They don't care about what one user is doing, they care about how users relate to other users to better understand effective advertising and target audiences. This simply helps them release better products to gain more market share.

So let's look at this for a minute...better products, better and more useful advertising that I might not be so annoyed at, and all for me getting to sign up for a free piece of software that is insanely useful for me. Wait, they're providing me a free product so they can release products that better deserve my money in the future, all whilst annoying me less in the process...

where do we lose, here?

AJB2K3 · 3rd Jun 2006, 18:43

If you have a personal web address i can get your home address without much effort?

specofdust · 3rd Jun 2006, 19:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by AJB2K3

If you have a personal web address i can get your home address without much effort?

Well not really no, marketing companies generally sell peoples details in huge numbers, I very much doubt they'd bother to look up that sort of information, for the ammount of money that'd make it worthwhile asking them and not just getting a very high grade PI to do it.

Firehed · 3rd Jun 2006, 19:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Da Dego

The question becomes...is this all that bad a thing?

All this marketing and the like...actual companies don't care about the individuals behind all this, we're simply helping them better understand trends. The data collected is not anonymous...but to the companies, it might as well be. They don't care about what one user is doing, they care about how users relate to other users to better understand effective advertising and target audiences. This simply helps them release better products to gain more market share.

So let's look at this for a minute...better products, better and more useful advertising that I might not be so annoyed at, and all for me getting to sign up for a free piece of software that is insanely useful for me. Wait, they're providing me a free product so they can release products that better deserve my money in the future, all whilst annoying me less in the process...

where do we lose, here?

Well, when Big Brother demands the information, it's there for them. Personally, my only reaction to advertising - however relavent - is negative. I know what I want and where I want it from. I block every ad I see (except Bit's, out of loyalty, but still largely ignore them). I had a layover at JFK airport the other day, and it was like sensory overload, a continuous babble of ads being slewn at me left and right, which accomplished nothing but giving me a pretty severe headache. I avoid sites with even the slightest bit of intrusive advertising, and avoid companies that use that intrusive advertising with extreme prejudice.

I don't care what I get out of it or whether I have nothing to hide; I don't want me out there.

cpemma · 3rd Jun 2006, 20:59

Re "Privacy", not just the internet though. I use my Loyalty card in the supermarket and in return for 1% discount Tesco know just what I've bought, how often I shop, what might tempt me to spend more. Apparently with the coming RFID chips they'll also know what I've thought of buying and rejected.

Provided we have a choice of supplier it can only be good for me, they get my business when the price is right. They get my return business when the service is good.

unrealhippie · 3rd Jun 2006, 21:19

Nice disturbing article, i'll sleep soundly tonight - thanks!

BlueDemon · 3rd Jun 2006, 22:28

Nice article, and probably right on the mark.

I was a bit surprised and disappointed that Microsoft didn't get a mention. I mean, they have been inventorising user's demographics for years upon years now. The "convenience" of the Passport login system is actually a potent way of uniquely identifying and tracking users in just about every online move they make: Hotmail (for gathering addresses, mail topics, social fabric), MSN (same thing, only more of it), Xbox Live (mapping online gaming communities, creating game rankings and statistics). The scary thing is, they "own" you from the operating system upwards. For all I know they could be linking your real name (from your mail contents) to the speed of your CPU (reported by the OS) or to the websites you visit or to the fact that your copy of Windows does not meet WGA standards...

Nature · 3rd Jun 2006, 23:15

I've always assumed that "privacy" is an falacy! Especially on computer's.

Because I live in America, my phone can be tapped, my house can be raided, I can be pulled over in my vehichle, I can be imprisoned in a military facility indeffinetly for the sake of national secuirity, and with out probable cause or justification!!!!

I think the Internet will be policed and maintained by big bussiness and government....... like everything else!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I just came back from China and you can't blog like you can in our western nations, so have at it while you can willard!!!!!

To quote Strong Bad: "The Internet is a place where absolutly nothing happens"

julianmartin · 3rd Jun 2006, 23:28

This sort of thing makes me consider turning into a hermit. Maybe we should all unplug our computers and go back to entertaining ourselves by carving random statues out of wood?!

3rd Jun 2006, 13:07	#1
WilHarris Just another nobody Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Oxford Posts: 2,671	Why Web 2.0 will end your privacy http://www.bit-tech.net/columns/2006...privacy/1.html

3rd Jun 2006, 13:42	#2
jezmck ____ Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Whiteley, Hants Posts: 4,091	So how long until bubble2.0 bursts? And will it be as dramatic as the first burst? __________________ Have you seen The SketchUp Components Collection's latest items? Interested in a DXF Blueprints Collection? Discuss it here.

3rd Jun 2006, 13:44	#3
saeghwin Multimodder Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: US Posts: 87	Wow, nicely written. They'll never know anything about me though--I don't use any services like that. __________________ ExpirationDate.info - Forums for dramatic conclusions. Life, philosophy, games, lucid dreaming, music, etc.

3rd Jun 2006, 14:02	#4
Skutbag Supermodder Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: England Posts: 308	So what if the man is going to know everything about you? At least we'll be getting slightly more relevant junk mail. Maybe they'll even start listening to us. __________________ I'll take this opportunity to list some great games that may have missed your attention: Alpha Centauri, Max Payne 2, XCOM 1, Supreme Commander, a Rogue-alike of some description, Open Transport Tycoon, Psychonauts, Beyond Good and Evil, Homeworld 2. At least Google one- It'll be worth it.

3rd Jun 2006, 14:42	#7
specofdust Banned Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Aberdeen, UK, EU Posts: 7,614	I seem to remember someone vaguely connected to google or one of those slightly less evil IT companies saying something along the lines of "Face it, on the internet, your privacy level is zero". I think that's probably the case, and I think that's probably always been the case. The difference is that whereas a few years ago getting data out of people was complicated, you had to hack their computer(slow and inefficient) or or offer them prizes(can become expensive, and doesn't rake in that many people) to complete questionaires that are invariably misinterpreted and can give utterly useless data if made poorly, that sorta thing. Where-as with these modern services, it's easy, people are basicly saying "Here are my details, you can get more off me on the fly, gimme gimme gimme". I think what you talk of is completely understandable, and for most people it's actually a very good thing. __________________ Like marmite, only no-one hates it Mmm bop!

3rd Jun 2006, 14:10	#5
eddtox Supermodder Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Medway Posts: 345	Disturbing. [deletes google cookies] -ed out

3rd Jun 2006, 16:57	#9
g3n3tiX Resident frenchie Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: localhost Posts: 591	Same thing... Big brother is watching you, and then slapping you in the back With all the Web 2.0 hype, there's GOT to be something behind it, some kind of goal. And you found it. I'm still using my gmail account though. Google anonymising There you'll find a tool to zero out your google cookie : better than deleting it. Works with FF and IE. You've got to be on one of googlel's pages for it to work.

3rd Jun 2006, 17:06	#10
ocha Supermodder Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: England, Kent Posts: 450	i thought you tube was doing a million dollars a month, not a day. Perhaps I am wrong though, I'm not sure I was listening properly. Great article though, I have been thinking along these lines for a while.

3rd Jun 2006, 18:14	#11
RotoSequence Lazy Lurker Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: 'States Posts: 4,529	Interesting points. Yet more reinforcement to the idea that information services are becoming more valuable than physical products. This is truly the information age - yet, its not the end users that have access to the information - at least, not anywhere near what News Corp, Yahoo!, and Google have. __________________ Technology Schmecnology

3rd Jun 2006, 18:16	#12
Da Dego Brett Thomas Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Cleveland, OH USA Posts: 3,906	The question becomes...is this all that bad a thing? All this marketing and the like...actual companies don't care about the individuals behind all this, we're simply helping them better understand trends. The data collected is not anonymous...but to the companies, it might as well be. They don't care about what one user is doing, they care about how users relate to other users to better understand effective advertising and target audiences. This simply helps them release better products to gain more market share. So let's look at this for a minute...better products, better and more useful advertising that I might not be so annoyed at, and all for me getting to sign up for a free piece of software that is insanely useful for me. Wait, they're providing me a free product so they can release products that better deserve my money in the future, all whilst annoying me less in the process... where do we lose, here? __________________ "Frankly that seems overkill. iluvtrees2 arguing with spec is the intellectual equivalent of a bunny rabbit taking on a pissed-off lion." - Nexxo

3rd Jun 2006, 18:43	#13
AJB2K3 I am a Dremel Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Around there Posts: 1,558	If you have a personal web address i can get your home address without much effort? __________________ 4 Men went to mow, Went to mow a meadow, 4 Men went to mow, Went to mow a meadow,

3rd Jun 2006, 20:59	#16
cpemma Ecky thump Moderator Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: S.Yorkshire, OK Posts: 12,333	Re "Privacy", not just the internet though. I use my Loyalty card in the supermarket and in return for 1% discount Tesco know just what I've bought, how often I shop, what might tempt me to spend more. Apparently with the coming RFID chips they'll also know what I've thought of buying and rejected. Provided we have a choice of supplier it can only be good for me, they get my business when the price is right. They get my return business when the service is good. __________________ Nobody's perfect. But being a Yorkshireman is as close as you can get.

3rd Jun 2006, 21:19	#17
unrealhippie Ultramodder Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Sheffield, UK Posts: 1,219	Nice disturbing article, i'll sleep soundly tonight - thanks!

3rd Jun 2006, 22:28	#18
BlueDemon Modder Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 58	Nice article, and probably right on the mark. I was a bit surprised and disappointed that Microsoft didn't get a mention. I mean, they have been inventorising user's demographics for years upon years now. The "convenience" of the Passport login system is actually a potent way of uniquely identifying and tracking users in just about every online move they make: Hotmail (for gathering addresses, mail topics, social fabric), MSN (same thing, only more of it), Xbox Live (mapping online gaming communities, creating game rankings and statistics). The scary thing is, they "own" you from the operating system upwards. For all I know they could be linking your real name (from your mail contents) to the speed of your CPU (reported by the OS) or to the websites you visit or to the fact that your copy of Windows does not meet WGA standards... __________________ ..:: Now, and always ::..

3rd Jun 2006, 23:15	#19
Nature Supermodder Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Jinan, China Posts: 417	I've always assumed that "privacy" is an falacy! Especially on computer's. Because I live in America, my phone can be tapped, my house can be raided, I can be pulled over in my vehichle, I can be imprisoned in a military facility indeffinetly for the sake of national secuirity, and with out probable cause or justification!!!! I think the Internet will be policed and maintained by big bussiness and government....... like everything else!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I just came back from China and you can't blog like you can in our western nations, so have at it while you can willard!!!!! To quote Strong Bad: "The Internet is a place where absolutly nothing happens" __________________ Peace, Love, Empathy, Respect, Generosity, Smiles, and Hugs

3rd Jun 2006, 23:28	#20
julianmartin It's good to see you John Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Guildford Massive Posts: 1,231	This sort of thing makes me consider turning into a hermit. Maybe we should all unplug our computers and go back to entertaining ourselves by carving random statues out of wood?! __________________ work play