News Xbox 360 Elite ripped open and examined

[The_Pope]

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2007/04..._and_examined/

[Krikkit]

Looks nice - I'm still in two minds about the processor though, I'd say it's just a revised die, with a new mobo version. If it were a 65nm part, I suspect, as you guys thought, that it'd be a lot smaller.

[Lazlow]

I've just this week purchased a Premium XBOX 360 (white) as I didn't see the point in waiting any longer for the Elite version.

Interesting to see it ripped apart though!

[will.]

I'll be getting one in September.

Its the black that does it for me, oh and when they finally crack it properly that 120gig hdd will come in handy.

[d3fiant]

if they could get an XMBC-type media player working on the 360 I would buy one tomorrow, my xbox1 struggles with some of the HD content that can be dl nowdays

[AcidJiles]

when its assured its a 65nm version i will get one in the summer

[mmorgue]

Sorry, stuck at work and most game sites are blocked., so - what's the UK release on the Elite edition? Plan to sell the old and get the new, merely for the 1080p. Sad huh?

[Warrior_Rocker]

I believe the release date for the elite in the uk is sometime in november. Seems you guys have to wait a little while for the elite across the pond huh?

In any event this is a good move by microsoft. It is almost like releasing a totally new console but rather they are just updating an existing one. Though they are used to just 'updating' things instead of starting from scratch anyway.

I dont see why whether or not this is a 65nm core would influence whether or not you buy one. Running cooler and taking less power are two great reasons. But the market for the elite seems to be a higher status and more involved gamer than just your average joe. So either you benifit from HDMI and the 120gb HDD or you don't. Either you think the new elites won't ring of death or you don't. The 65nm core wouldn't have added any new features or options.

Also have to comment on the inclusion of the HDMI cable with the elite. WOW. Finally some console stepped up to that plate. We all know the feeling of buying a new console and not having the right cables to hook it up to the tv. Composite, Componet, HDMI... Sounds good to me.

Just as a side note about the ring of death. Such a small percentage have that issue while a good many of those are covered under warranties. But what a cool feature for the xbox to almost diag itself and display some sort of problem code on the front. Think of earlier consoles that would just sit and stare at you with a blank screen. Nothing is perfect, but at least microsoft put in something to deal with problems and failures.


One question though, am I right to assume that the extra audio dongle that is included with the elite will mean that plugging in the other a/v cable set will disable the hdmi port? Or is it just there to save space by not having a million wires everywhere.... but who's home theatre doesn't.

[will.]

Last I heard we were getting it in August...

[LVMike]

Thanks to CostCo's very generous return policy, i will probably get one.

plugging the audio cable in to the analog port does not disable the hdmi. It just allows you a diferent audio output sorce insted of the hdmi audio, but you with it pluged in you still get video out from hdmi. there fore i would guess that pluging one of the analog video outs in would also not disable the hdmi output

[devdevil85]

Originally Posted by Warrior_Rocker

The 65nm core wouldn't have added any new features or options.

Also have to comment on the inclusion of the HDMI cable with the elite. WOW. Finally some console stepped up to that plate.

Just as a side note about the ring of death. Such a small percentage have that issue while a good many of those are covered under warranties. But what a cool feature for the xbox to almost diag itself and display some sort of problem code on the front. Think of earlier consoles that would just sit and stare at you with a blank screen. Nothing is perfect, but at least microsoft put in something to deal with problems and failures.

Of course 65nm would add new features. It's going to run cooler, which would first off allow for higher clock speed or more set instructions per clock or who knows maybe Microsoft would just run it as same clock speed and keep fan speed to a minimum for people to watch their movies. I can't stand watching movies on my friend's 360, it's just too loud for me, especially when it gets to the talking scenes or the quiet scenes, but then again it's like 10 feet away, but still....

As for the HDMI cable, Sony should have made it come standard on the PS3, maybe they'll catch on and understand that people expect it, so good job Microsoft.

For the system diag for the Elite, I think that it will help troubleshoot problems that could easily be resolved. My friend's 360, on certain games, will just freeze up when it's trying to load or when it's saving, and I think it's a HD issue, but I don't know when all it does is freeze up, so with this new diag feature, that would really help.

[Veles]

Originally Posted by mmorgue

Sorry, stuck at work and most game sites are blocked., so - what's the UK release on the Elite edition? Plan to sell the old and get the new, merely for the 1080p. Sad huh?

The current 360 does 1080p just fine, unlike many people think, you don't need HDMI for 1080p, and the 360 has been 1080p capable for quite some time via component cables.

[devdevil85]

Originally Posted by Veles

The current 360 does 1080p just fine, unlike many people think, you don't need HDMI for 1080p, and the 360 has been 1080p capable for quite some time via component cables.

That is true. Sadly, only certain games will be able to offer 1080p due to the size contraint on the DL DVD-R's, but there is no reason to buy an Elite just to use HDMI. Component can easily do 1080p.

[Krikkit]

Originally Posted by devdevil85

Of course 65nm would add new features. It's going to run cooler, which would first off allow for higher clock speed or more set instructions per clock or who knows maybe Microsoft would just run it as same clock speed and keep fan speed to a minimum for people to watch their movies. I can't stand watching movies on my friend's 360, it's just too loud for me, especially when it gets to the talking scenes or the quiet scenes, but then again it's like 10 feet away, but still...

MS won't be changing clock speeds anytime - why bother? Normal X360 games run at one speed perfectly well. Why waste dies by trying to enforce higher clock speeds which will just produce more heat and be wasted by the software?
The fan speed will probably be the same too, in fact, reading the article linked in the news post, it's exactly the same, but with a 3-pin connector instead of 4.

The real reason for switching down to 65nm is to create a cooler-running console (so less heat-deaths), with a cheaper die.

[devdevil85]

Originally Posted by Krikkit

MS won't be changing clock speeds anytime - why bother? Normal X360 games run at one speed perfectly well. Why waste dies by trying to enforce higher clock speeds which will just produce more heat and be wasted by the software?
The fan speed will probably be the same too, in fact, reading the article linked in the news post, it's exactly the same, but with a 3-pin connector instead of 4.

The real reason for switching down to 65nm is to create a cooler-running console (so less heat-deaths), with a cheaper die.

Who says newer games wouldn't be able to take advantage of higher clock speeds? Secondly, I do agree that Microsoft will keep the same clock speed because of the heat-death issues. Also, changing clock speeds would only piss off developers, especially when they do all they can to make the game look/play as good as possible on one specific configuration, but still... increasing the clock wouldn't be a bad thing would it? I mean it's just like 65nm to 45nm: more headroom for overclocking due to the lower running temp on 45nm.... do you see the connection here? Because I can tell you it needs it for Oblivion because whenever I walk out into the open from inside a building or cave, my friend's 360 is really taxed and there is some noticable lag. That's all I'm saying.....

[JaredC01]

Originally Posted by devdevil85

Of course 65nm would add new features. It's going to run cooler, which would first off allow for higher clock speed or more set instructions per clock or who knows maybe Microsoft would just run it as same clock speed and keep fan speed to a minimum for people to watch their movies. I can't stand watching movies on my friend's 360, it's just too loud for me, especially when it gets to the talking scenes or the quiet scenes, but then again it's like 10 feet away, but still....

As for the HDMI cable, Sony should have made it come standard on the PS3, maybe they'll catch on and understand that people expect it, so good job Microsoft.

For the system diag for the Elite, I think that it will help troubleshoot problems that could easily be resolved. My friend's 360, on certain games, will just freeze up when it's trying to load or when it's saving, and I think it's a HD issue, but I don't know when all it does is freeze up, so with this new diag feature, that would really help.

The issue your friend is having isn't a hard drive issue. It's a graphics issue, or a DVD drive issue. There are quite a few people with the same problem. It comes down to either too much heat, or a dirty / faulty DVD laser.

Originally Posted by devdevil85

Who says newer games wouldn't be able to take advantage of higher clock speeds? Secondly, I do agree that Microsoft will keep the same clock speed because of the heat-death issues. Also, changing clock speeds would only piss off developers, especially when they do all they can to make the game look/play as good as possible on one specific configuration, but still... increasing the clock wouldn't be a bad thing would it? I mean it's just like 65nm to 45nm: more headroom for overclocking due to the lower running temp on 45nm.... do you see the connection here? Because I can tell you it needs it for Oblivion because whenever I walk out into the open from inside a building or cave, my friend's 360 is really taxed and there is some noticable lag. That's all I'm saying.....

Who says newer games wouldn't take advantage of it? The millions of consoles already sold. Microsoft would have to recall EVERY Xbox360 they've sold, and replace them with the faster models. There is no point at all in doing that to increase the speed a couple MHz.

The 'lag' is a graphics related issue. The decreased processor die size will have nothing to do with how well the graphics processor works. The processor speed on the 360 is more than enough to handle what games throw at it. Think about it this way... Does a dual core processor in a computer ever get 100% used up by a single game running at a max of 1920 x 1080? I've not found one yet that uses so much CPU the game lags. The 360 has a triple core 3GHz+ processor, which is better than most PC's these days, and it's ONLY used for games.

If you're getting more lag once the console heats up a bit, then more than likely you've having heat related issues. Be glad it's only lag though, as most people with heat issues get the 3 red lights.



For the record, the three red lights is caused by the X clamps used to hold the heatsinks down putting pressure on the motherboard, making it want to arch. When the graphics chip overheats, it melts the solder connecting the chip to the motherboard, and due to the pressure put on the motherboard by the clamps, the chip partially separates from the motherboard.

There are some home remedy fixes for the problem that can be found on Xbox-Scene.

[Denied]

I was extremely excited when they first came out with the Elite details but that has since been blown away. I'm in Australia and I went to pre-order the x360 Elite and I was quoted $AU1,000 which is the same price as the PS3...

So i'm really in two minds now, it's not like Microsoft have really ADDED that much to the Elite, HDMI, 120gig HDD and black casing... that's hardly bringing it into competitive line with the PS3.

[Iago]

Originally Posted by devdevil85

That is true. Sadly, only certain games will be able to offer 1080p due to the size contraint on the DL DVD-R's, but there is no reason to buy an Elite just to use HDMI. Component can easily do 1080p.

If your TV accepts a 1080p signal over component, which is quite a big if.

Originally Posted by devdevil85

increasing the clock wouldn't be a bad thing would it?

It isn't happening. In fact, it would be a very bad idea. The worst thing you can do with consoles is having several different specifications and requirements for games. It's one thing to have or lack HDD, but having games that run worse (or don't run at all) in older SKUs it's a recipe for disaster.

[devdevil85]

Originally Posted by Iago

If your TV accepts a 1080p signal over component, which is quite a big if.



It isn't happening. In fact, it would be a very bad idea. The worst thing you can do with consoles is having several different specifications and requirements for games. It's one thing to have or lack HDD, but having games that run worse (or don't run at all) in older SKUs it's a recipe for disaster.

As of right now, most people that own an HDTV can display 720p, but once HD becomes the standard for TV, everyone is going to buy one and every one of those TV's will do 1080p which is a good thing that PS3 allows every game to support it. Of course, I own a 720p HDTV, but my friend does own a 1080p and VF5 looks phenomenal.

As for the clock increase, I didn't put much thought into it, but it's true that it will never happen and that most lag problems are from heat or they're from the graphics card. I never really expected anyone to agree with me on that anyway so....anyways, back to Guitar Hero II

[mclean007]

Originally Posted by devdevil85

That is true. Sadly, only certain games will be able to offer 1080p due to the size contraint on the DL DVD-R's, but there is no reason to buy an Elite just to use HDMI. Component can easily do 1080p.

You are correct that component can do 1080p, and that only some X360 games support it. However, this has nothing to do with the capacity of dual layer DVD, everything to do with games being written with support for 1080p and hardware with enough power to render approximately twice as many pixels as 720p/1080i.

Because X360 originally offered only 720p and 1080i, with 1080p support being added later by a firmware update, few early games support 1080p. However, I'd expect it is more commonly supported now. I don't know if X360 is capable of internally upscaling 720p and 1080i to 1080p, but if not, your 1080p TV will happily do so.