US conducts nationwide raid on mod chip shops - bit-tech.net Forums

CardJoe · 2nd Aug 2007, 12:34

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2007/08...-chip_shops_/1

In the US, federal customs agents have raided more than 30 businesses across sixteen states in search of console mod chips which allow pirated games to run.

capnPedro · 2nd Aug 2007, 12:48

I can't believe somebody went and decided that mod chips should be illegal. What if I make a board that allows a drive to play any region of DVD, is that illegal? Even though I can buy a £20 DVD player in shops that will do the exact same thing. How about a chip that lets me power off m Xbox by infrared? That's the mod chip. Is that too illegal?

You aren't renting the console, you own it. You should be able to solder whatever you want in it. Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating the playing of pirated games, but it should be the games that are illegal, not the chips.

Disclaimer: I don't use consoles or mod them.

d3fiant · 2nd Aug 2007, 12:50

I spose thats the risk we take, I know some people will take the 'homebrew argument' but 99% of modchips are bought for 1 reason only and thats to play pirated material and while I totally agree that games are totally overpriced I feel that this tit-for-tat battle is going to be ongoing for the forseeable future

crazybob · 2nd Aug 2007, 13:38

I support their right to hunt for software piracy, but not if they're just going to attack modchips. Sure, there are more common illegal uses for a modchip than legal ones, but I bought the hardware and have every right to do with it as I please. If I choose to install a new operating system so I can watch movies, that should be fine even if it requires me to modify the console.

A very similar example is modifying your car to increase performance. Even though many of the potential uses for the extra power are illegal (speeding, reckless driving, street racing, etc.) there are still legal uses for the power (bragging rights, trackdays, etc.) and as such the modifications themselves are legal as long as they are used appropriately.

Lord_A · 2nd Aug 2007, 13:45

Don't agree with this at all.
I've got a chip in my XBOX (1 not 360) & use it just for XMBC - I don't have any pirated games on it.

LVMike · 2nd Aug 2007, 13:47

The raids probably took place under section 103 of the DMCA which added section 1201 to Title 17 of U.S. Code. From the Copyright .gov PDF on DMCA

Section 1201 proscribes devices or services that fall within any one of the
following three categories:
1. they are primarily designed or produced to circumvent;
2. they have only limited commercially significant purpose or use other
than to circumvent; or
3. they are marketed for use in circumventing.

It goes on further to ban the import of or sale of devices or services which are designed to circumvent copyright, or other IP protections.

You could still mod your console, so long as your intent was not copyright circumvention. If copy right circumvention was a "unintended consequence" of your modification you would be ok-ish. So long as you didn't advertise that that was a feature or intended use of your modification. So home brewers are still ok, as are people who mod with out trying to circumvent copyright.

whisperwolf · 2nd Aug 2007, 13:56

So if your a large company throwing a hissy fit over how much you lose to piracy (using the formula of 1 pirated disk is 1 lost sale) you get enough man power to research,coordinate and carry out 30 raids across 16 states, but if your an avergare joe and your home gets broken into you might get a policeman round at somepoint with a piece of paper for your insurance company. want justice then you'll have to be able to pay for it

Firehed · 2nd Aug 2007, 14:17

Bleh. I'm planning to eventually chip my Xbox so I can run XBMC on it. The system's so old at this point that it's much easier to just go buy the games for $3 used than to pirate them, and even new games are often cheap enough to not make it worth the effort. Of course with used games, MS isn't seeing any of the money, but it at least goes to prove Economics 101 to be true.

riggs · 2nd Aug 2007, 14:20

I own a chipped Xbox (running XBMC) and a soft-modded DS. I admit, I download the occasional game, but it's more of a 'try before I buy' situation. I'm more interested in the homebrew/emulation side of things tbh (which is another grey area in itself).

mmorgue · 2nd Aug 2007, 14:36

Would love to see the stats of the cost of this operation(s) vs the monetary gain/saved by these raids.

wolff000 · 2nd Aug 2007, 14:48

We no longer have any freedom. They tap our phones, they sniff packets and raid our homes and business whenever they like with no warrants. This is just another shining example of how the US is no longer for the people by the people. Our government preaches about freedom in other countries while they take it from us. I have several modded consoles and own 0 "pirated games". I modded my consoles to play with homebrew and linux yet I am still a criminal simply because I own a mod chip. They claim they are smuggled in which is a lie. Smuggling means you are hiding what is coming through, my first mod chip cam from overseas and the outside box was clearly labeled. The only reason they are going after these people is because some senators got a great big campaign "donation". It's disgusting and one of the very reasons I am looking forward to moving out of this place.

proxess · 2nd Aug 2007, 15:53

They should go back to using cartridges like in the NES, SNES, Megadrive, N64, Gameboy <3333333 ahh the good old days...

riggs · 2nd Aug 2007, 16:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by proxess

They should go back to using cartridges like in the NES, SNES, Megadrive, N64, Gameboy <3333333 ahh the good old days...

I like your thinking (especially since carts have virtually no load times), but it wouldn't work as an anti-piracy method - how to you think I run homebrew on the DS (and the GBA)? I suppose it would reduce figures, purely because it's more difficult getting games on a cart-based system...well, difficult for the average Joe.

What with falling prices and increasing size of RAM/ROM based memory, maybe we will eventually see consoles fall back on solid state media. Actually, scratch that, by the time it could (theoretically) happen, we'll probably have machines that stream game content direct from game servers. Even then, there'll be someone, somewhere, reverse engineering the process and figuring out how to run 'backup' copies streamed from their home PC.

At the end of the day, piracy will always exist, no matter how tough the copy protection system is.

wafflesomd · 2nd Aug 2007, 16:39

Could they be any more annoying?

DXR_13KE · 2nd Aug 2007, 23:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by proxess

They should go back to using cartridges like in the NES, SNES, Megadrive, N64, Gameboy <3333333 ahh the good old days...

they were fast... but they were expensive compared to optical disks........ not that it translates to reduced price to us consumers....

Copiedright · 3rd Aug 2007, 08:23

In Australia, Mod Chips are legal!
Makes me proud to be an Aussie!

completemadness · 3rd Aug 2007, 14:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord_A

Don't agree with this at all.
I've got a chip in my XBOX (1 not 360) & use it just for XMBC - I don't have any pirated games on it.

exactly, i have a chipped PS2, but i only use that to run games off the HDD (As the laser if failing) i still have the games, i haven't pirated anything
Just because you could pirate, doesn't mean you will

hell, every PC on the planet is capable of pirating music, does that mean we should all have our PC's taken away ?

elbarto241 · 3rd Aug 2007, 16:48

very good point madness, its sad to see ICE bust down on the little man with his soldering iron in his garage instead of the HUGE piraters outthere making a fortune off of bootlegging ....

DougEdey · 3rd Aug 2007, 16:56

I mod a lot of XBOXs hell, I've made entire Home Entertainment Networks based off them, silent machines, powerful, accurate, lots of decoders. What more do you want?

I don't use them for playing illegal copies of games, I do however, load owned games onto the consoles.

tech3312 · 10th Aug 2007, 15:33

why would they make a raid on mod chips? were all of us here on bit-tech are modders now it's "illegal to make mod chips?" they should ban all soldering gund and circuit boards if modding is illegal. and let me show another point why sould they ban download sites? once they knock one down another one is going to pop up and pop up again and the process is going to be the same. they alway's find stupid laws on technology to bind it to us like it's illegal to listen ipods on the streets man even if they approve that law i'll still listen music on the street

2nd Aug 2007, 12:34	#1
CardJoe Player Character bit-tech Staff Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 7,965	US conducts nationwide raid on mod chip shops http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2007/08...-chip_shops_/1 In the US, federal customs agents have raided more than 30 businesses across sixteen states in search of console mod chips which allow pirated games to run. __________________ this is joe's non-bit-tech blog

2nd Aug 2007, 12:48	#2
capnPedro Deaf forever to the battle's din Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: North-East England Posts: 2,983	I can't believe somebody went and decided that mod chips should be illegal. What if I make a board that allows a drive to play any region of DVD, is that illegal? Even though I can buy a £20 DVD player in shops that will do the exact same thing. How about a chip that lets me power off m Xbox by infrared? That's the mod chip. Is that too illegal? You aren't renting the console, you own it. You should be able to solder whatever you want in it. Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating the playing of pirated games, but it should be the games that are illegal, not the chips. Disclaimer: I don't use consoles or mod them. __________________ ASUS M4A785TD-M Evo \| AMD Phenom II x4 955 BE \| D-Tek FuZion 4GB Corsair XMMS3-10666 \| Corsair TX650 Point Of View 8800GTX \| EK FC-8800

2nd Aug 2007, 12:50	#3
d3fiant Modder Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: UK Posts: 51	I spose thats the risk we take, I know some people will take the 'homebrew argument' but 99% of modchips are bought for 1 reason only and thats to play pirated material and while I totally agree that games are totally overpriced I feel that this tit-for-tat battle is going to be ongoing for the forseeable future __________________ AB9 Pro C2D E6600 - 512MB 8800GT - Xfi - 4GB and 800GB of SATA storage

2nd Aug 2007, 13:45	#5
Lord_A Boom baby! Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Leicester, UK Posts: 3,467	Don't agree with this at all. I've got a chip in my XBOX (1 not 360) & use it just for XMBC - I don't have any pirated games on it. __________________ God is a trap. God is the answer when we don't know the answer. That means, when your brain is not enough big, when you don't understand, you go, "Ah, it's God, it's God." - Philippe Starck nothing to see here, move along...

2nd Aug 2007, 13:56	#7
whisperwolf Ultramodder Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 1,194	So if your a large company throwing a hissy fit over how much you lose to piracy (using the formula of 1 pirated disk is 1 lost sale) you get enough man power to research,coordinate and carry out 30 raids across 16 states, but if your an avergare joe and your home gets broken into you might get a policeman round at somepoint with a piece of paper for your insurance company. want justice then you'll have to be able to pay for it __________________ "I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it. " Voltaire. My Flickr

2nd Aug 2007, 13:38	#4
crazybob Voice of Reason Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,120	I support their right to hunt for software piracy, but not if they're just going to attack modchips. Sure, there are more common illegal uses for a modchip than legal ones, but I bought the hardware and have every right to do with it as I please. If I choose to install a new operating system so I can watch movies, that should be fine even if it requires me to modify the console. A very similar example is modifying your car to increase performance. Even though many of the potential uses for the extra power are illegal (speeding, reckless driving, street racing, etc.) there are still legal uses for the power (bragging rights, trackdays, etc.) and as such the modifications themselves are legal as long as they are used appropriately.

2nd Aug 2007, 13:47	#6
LVMike Supermodder Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Las Vegas NV & Rolla MO Posts: 412	The raids probably took place under section 103 of the DMCA which added section 1201 to Title 17 of U.S. Code. From the Copyright .gov PDF on DMCA Section 1201 proscribes devices or services that fall within any one of the following three categories: 1. they are primarily designed or produced to circumvent; 2. they have only limited commercially significant purpose or use other than to circumvent; or 3. they are marketed for use in circumventing. It goes on further to ban the import of or sale of devices or services which are designed to circumvent copyright, or other IP protections. You could still mod your console, so long as your intent was not copyright circumvention. If copy right circumvention was a "unintended consequence" of your modification you would be ok-ish. So long as you didn't advertise that that was a feature or intended use of your modification. So home brewers are still ok, as are people who mod with out trying to circumvent copyright.

2nd Aug 2007, 14:17	#8
Firehed Why not? I own a domain to match. Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: An hour north of Boston Posts: 12,576	Bleh. I'm planning to eventually chip my Xbox so I can run XBMC on it. The system's so old at this point that it's much easier to just go buy the games for $3 used than to pirate them, and even new games are often cheap enough to not make it worth the effort. Of course with used games, MS isn't seeing any of the money, but it at least goes to prove Economics 101 to be true. __________________ hire me @ eric-stern.com - web developer and php ninja pics @ my smugmug :: Twitter @firehed :: blog @ firehed.net 40D\|580EXII\|285HV\|AB800\|70-200f/4LIS\|17-50f/2.8\|150f/2.8Macro\|50f/1.8 MacPro @ 8x2.8GHz, 10GB FBDDR2, 3TB HD :: MBP @ 2x2.2GHz, 4GB DDR2, 320GB HD

2nd Aug 2007, 14:20	#9
riggs ^_^ Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Lincs. Posts: 1,643	I own a chipped Xbox (running XBMC) and a soft-modded DS. I admit, I download the occasional game, but it's more of a 'try before I buy' situation. I'm more interested in the homebrew/emulation side of things tbh (which is another grey area in itself). __________________ Hell hath no fury like a hippo with a machine gun PSN ID: buster2006

2nd Aug 2007, 14:36	#10
mmorgue Supermodder Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Mos Eisley, in the bar... Posts: 378	Would love to see the stats of the cost of this operation(s) vs the monetary gain/saved by these raids.

2nd Aug 2007, 14:48	#11
wolff000 I am here to steal your secrets. Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Never-never Land Posts: 196	The US Has Gone To **** We no longer have any freedom. They tap our phones, they sniff packets and raid our homes and business whenever they like with no warrants. This is just another shining example of how the US is no longer for the people by the people. Our government preaches about freedom in other countries while they take it from us. I have several modded consoles and own 0 "pirated games". I modded my consoles to play with homebrew and linux yet I am still a criminal simply because I own a mod chip. They claim they are smuggled in which is a lie. Smuggling means you are hiding what is coming through, my first mod chip cam from overseas and the outside box was clearly labeled. The only reason they are going after these people is because some senators got a great big campaign "donation". It's disgusting and one of the very reasons I am looking forward to moving out of this place. __________________ The gospel accordong to Myamoto, Chatper three, verse six..."And it is written that the gaming of man will die, and rest silent for two years. But on the eighty-fifth year of the twentieth century, it shall rise again. And its triumphant return shall be heralded by two great plumbers and thou will know gaming has been born again."

2nd Aug 2007, 15:53	#12
proxess Victim of AdvancedModernCapitalism Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The town of Love, Funchal Posts: 600	They should go back to using cartridges like in the NES, SNES, Megadrive, N64, Gameboy <3333333 ahh the good old days... __________________ Netbook: Asus eeePC 901; 12Gb SDD; Custom Ubuntu 9.04 Minimal Compiz Standalone. Laptop: Intel Centrino Duo T5500 1.66ghz; 2048mb RAM; ATI Mobility Radeon x2300; Hitachi 120gb iPod Classic 120GB; Maxtor 160GB External; Ubuntu 9.10 x64 and Windows 7 x64.

2nd Aug 2007, 16:39	#14
wafflesomd Hypermodder Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 992	Could they be any more annoying? __________________ http://img195.imageshack.us/img195/1466/goldie.gif

3rd Aug 2007, 08:23	#16
Copiedright What's a Dremel? Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Nowra, Australia Posts: 5	In Australia, Mod Chips are legal! Makes me proud to be an Aussie!

3rd Aug 2007, 16:48	#18
elbarto241 Multimodder Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 149	very good point madness, its sad to see ICE bust down on the little man with his soldering iron in his garage instead of the HUGE piraters outthere making a fortune off of bootlegging ....

3rd Aug 2007, 16:56	#19
DougEdey I pwn all your storage Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Southampton Posts: 13,933	I mod a lot of XBOXs hell, I've made entire Home Entertainment Networks based off them, silent machines, powerful, accurate, lots of decoders. What more do you want? I don't use them for playing illegal copies of games, I do however, load owned games onto the consoles. __________________ Burnout: Paradise Stats!XBL: DougEdey Bindi PSN ID: DougEdey Twitter

10th Aug 2007, 15:33	#20
tech3312 Where's my dremel o.0 Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hialeah Posts: 177	why would they make a raid on mod chips? were all of us here on bit-tech are modders now it's "illegal to make mod chips?" they should ban all soldering gund and circuit boards if modding is illegal. and let me show another point why sould they ban download sites? once they knock one down another one is going to pop up and pop up again and the process is going to be the same. they alway's find stupid laws on technology to bind it to us like it's illegal to listen ipods on the streets man even if they approve that law i'll still listen music on the street