News Microsoft knowingly deceived customers with Vista?

[Tim S]

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2008/02...s_with_vista/1

Plaintiffs in the "Windows Vista Capable" case have accused Microsoft of knowingly lying to customers in order to boost sales.

[FR34K]

typical

[Mister_Tad]

typical? Yes, MS is a big evil company and lies to everyone just to maximise its own profit

MS is a big fish to go after, with lots of cash. A class-action against MS is a lawyer's wet dream, and the only party that benefits out of it is the legal firm spearheading the lawsuit.

I don't see the issue personally. Vista capable is just that, capable of running Vista. Surely it matters not what version of Vista they're specifying.

I PERSONALLY got burnt. ... Are we seeing this from a lot of customers? ... I now have a $2,100 e-mail machine

Am I understanding that correctly? He bought a $2100 machine that doesn't run Vista Premium? He did get burnt, but not by MS, by whoever sold him the PC

[Delphium]

the machines DO run Vista, and drivers DO work etc, so it IS compatible, there is lots of documentation out stating that the extra features have minimum pc requirements, ie for Aero, a DirectX 9 gfx card with at least 64mb video ram is required.

Personally I dont see the issue, if you the user wants to skimp cash on a good system then they cant expect to have it running all extra features.

Kinda like how Crysis claims it would run on a low spec machine, sure, it will run on a low spec machine, but dont expect to see all the extra pritty bits.

[HourBeforeDawn]

lol M$ cant help it if its customers arent all that bright and cant work a computer ~_~ but anyone will sue for just about anything now and days.

[Sark.inc]

Originally Posted by Delphium

the machines DO run Vista, and drivers DO work etc, so it IS compatible, there is lots of documentation out stating that the extra features have minimum pc requirements, ie for Aero, a DirectX 9 gfx card with at least 64mb video ram is required.

Personally I dont see the issue, if you the user wants to skimp cash on a good system then they cant expect to have it running all extra features.

Kinda like how Crysis claims it would run on a low spec machine, sure, it will run on a low spec machine, but dont expect to see all the extra pritty bits.

Originally Posted by HourBeforeDawn

lol M$ cant help it if its customers arent all that bright and cant work a computer ~_~ but anyone will sue for just about anything now and days.

Both true, some customers are morons, my 133mhz computer can "run" xp, but the question is how well?
Christ do people even think?

Personally i think that if u can't read the fine print, you should not use a computer.
There is a difference between minimum and recommended.

[naokaji]

Originally Posted by Mister_Tad

typical? Yes, MS is a big evil company and lies to everyone just to maximise its own profit

companies exist to make money... ms is no worse than others.

did ms lie with the vista capable logo? dont think so and i also dont think they can be sued for it.
anyway, i'd put the blame on the retail shops, imagine someone who doesnt know **** about computers walking into a store, buying a computer, then asking if it will run vista and the sales person will remember the ever rising cost of living and his sell or starve pay scheme and tell the customer everything he wants to hear just to get the sales bonus at the end of the month.

[rjkoneill]

so i get home basic on my rig - which is basically a prettier version of xp with dx10 like i wanted
problem is that i like it like that as it takes up less resources than hp or ultimate

johnny average off the street will obviously expect a machine sporting a vista logo to anihilate vista

its just the same as seeing PC world selling "this amazing desktop with 2 GB of Ram"
and the consumer will see that and think "oh, that will kill vista vith everything turned up high!!!"
and then they realise they have 4 lanes of 512 cheapo ram that isnt actually as good as they thought

its a little misleading

but the computer industry always been about marketing
the point of it is to make something look desirable so that everybody gets it

[Phil Rhodes]

I'm sure I ranted a while ago about the "good, better, best" syndrome with which the computer industry seems to be hopelessly riddled.

Runs vista!
Really runs vista!
Really Really runs vista!

Ellipsis.

Phil

[rhuitron]

Heck. I can understand both sides of this case.

Yes Microsft is evil and does do that kinda ****.

But so are people. And america is filled to the brim with sue-trigger happy nuts.

But hell, I have a Dell Inspiron 6000. With 512 mb. And I installed Vista ultimate on it, and it took it.

Not a champ, more like a serverly retareded bush.
But if you know how, you can do it.

[Mister_Tad]

Originally Posted by naokaji

companies exist to make money... ms is no worse than others.

You missed a pretty critical part of my quote:

for example: MS kill puppies for fun too - ie, indicating sarcasm

MS is no more "evil" than any other company. I have a feeling all of the quotes are taken grossly out of context as well.

[frontline]

Surely this is no different from the graphics card companies who were putting "vista ready" stickers on DX9 graphics card, but failing to point out that they wouln't be capable of rendering any DV10 effects?

[frontline]

DX10 even

[naokaji]

Originally Posted by Mister_Tad

You missed a pretty critical part of my quote:

for example: MS kill puppies for fun too - ie, indicating sarcasm

MS is no more "evil" than any other company. I have a feeling all of the quotes are taken grossly out of context as well.

my bad there with missing the smilie in the quote, but i think the what i said still applies (i.e. ms is no worse than others).

[TreeDude]

Then I guess people buying Vista Home Basic machines are not getting what they paid for either? I hate to back MS on this, but they did not lie to anyone. Vista capable means just that. A very small amount of research would have shown anyone that the sticker was referring to Vista Home Basic.

But hell, most people buying an XP machine don't have a use for Vista in any form. They want internet, email, and IM. Why spend another couple hundred dollars to upgrade your OS, when it won't gain you a damn thing?

At least when XP came out it had plug and play, which made it somewhat worth it from a consumer stand point. Other than DX10 Vista doesn't have anything that people need.

[zabe]

I also disagree, obviously the people at M$ aren't saints, they're in business to make money, but I don't see the unfairness. The sticker said Vista CAPABLE, which is completely true. Those pcs can install and run Vista. So where's the problem? If they expect to get the full experience, go get the powerful machines with a different label on them. M$ did make this clear from the beginning, and I've seen this reality in the shops.

The problem is, that people (apart from those who just don't understand a thing about computers) are cheap. They see a 500$ computer with Vista and they expect to get the same experience as a 2500$ pc. That is the real problem, and it is so retarded to my eyes. Personally, when I bought my Peugeot 206, I wasn't expecting the performance of a Mercedes SLK 320. Oh, why's that? Because the price is less than a third. Customers out there: be realistic with what you buy and stop whining.

ps: I REALLY doubt that a M$ employee bought a 2100$ pc which doesn't run Vista fully. First because I can't imagine a pc priced like that and not having a good amount of ram, nice gfx card, etc. For god's sake, my pc is a 1400$ Dell laptop and can run Vista perfectly fine and smooth. And second, because, well, he's working at M$. He surely should know how to buy a computer for the program his company is designing... if not, what is he really doing there?

[steveo_mcg]

Originally Posted by Mister_Tad

You missed a pretty critical part of my quote:

for example: MS kill puppies for fun too - ie, indicating sarcasm

MS is no more "evil" than any other company. I have a feeling all of the quotes are taken grossly out of context as well.

MS DOES kill puppies ...

[Firehed]

Originally Posted by Delphium

the machines DO run Vista, and drivers DO work etc, so it IS compatible, there is lots of documentation out stating that the extra features have minimum pc requirements, ie for Aero, a DirectX 9 gfx card with at least 64mb video ram is required.

This is true. However, you need to consider how Vista was marketed towards consumers. It was selling the shine, the polish, and the pointless 3d effects. Microsoft may have tried to write themselves a loophole with "well, it's technically running Vista, even if it's just a slightly more irritating version of XP since you aren't getting any of the features we were bragging about", but it's still arguably false advertising. The court case will determine if this is really the case.

[Mister_Tad]

As a side note, calling microsoft M$ isn't big or clever.

[DXR_13KE]

what bothers me is the way Vista with all of its "beauty" sucks so much resources and linux with compiz fusion beats it to a pulp with less resources.....

i think the interface was badly optimized in Vista.