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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 10:56   #1
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Molyneux: PC gaming is 'in tatters'

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2008/10...s-in-tatters/1

Peter Molyneux obviously isn't all to keen on PCs these days and in the run-up to the Fable 2 launch has been sharing his views on the PC market.

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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 11:06   #2
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If PC gaming is in "tatters", then perhaps he'd like to spruce the platform up a bit with Fable 2, no?
I hope so...

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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 11:13   #3
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I find myself agreeing with him, to be quite honest.

DRM is retarded, super-mega-stupid even, but I can see why it's done. How can we, as a PC gaming collective, ask for the publishers trust when half of the PC users world wide are pirating whatever the hell they feel like, because they're too lazy to go out and buy it.

Too 'poor' to buy a PC game? Stop paying for the best service your ISP offers, you half-wit.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 11:18   #4
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I agree its in tatters, it is. However i strong disagree with his accersion that drm is necessary since it doesn't stop a single copy right infringement it is NOT fit for purpose.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 11:35   #5
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I understand why they would want to use DRM for games but I don't understand why are they using it? Games come cracked days before official release. It's obvious that the stuff does not work. Then why struggle to use it and drive even more to pirating?
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 11:51   #6
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Yes, obviously this has all been covered ad infinitum already, but to say 'I can see why they do it.... give them more confidence on the PC' is just lazy and ill-informed, since DRM in its current incarnation manifestly does not do that at all. That's what it is *supposed* to do.

A shame that someone like Molyneux would make such a throwaway comment about what is, after all, a very important topic. I suppose that now that he's no longer involved in PC gaming he doesn't really care/know about the issues involved there anymore. Still, he could at least just say that instead of giving the pro-DRM mob more ammunition....
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 11:55   #7
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not been funny but what the **** is he talking about, demigod, blackshark, iracing, dawn of war 2, starcraft 2, warhammer online, stalker clear skies, diablo 3, cryostasis,empire total war, new x3 game, gtr evolution, and these are just the PC exclusives i quickly thought off.
I mean 90% of all the good console games come out on the PC anyway. I mean who would have though burnout would come to the PC.
Why is it, its my PS3 that sits all alone and my two PCs are getting all the gaming done.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 11:56   #8
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PC gaming isn't dying. Anyone who says otherwise is an idiot.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 11:57   #9
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I believe the PC market is still very much alive for the publishers that make the effort to support it. That's Blizzard and that's Valve.

Ignoring the PC platform because of piracy is silly, as is overloading products with DRM. I know some Sony DVD's won't copy easily, designed purposely to give CRC errors if you try. This and the old CD key system is enough to stop Bob Public from copying the disk for their mates. Anything else is just punishing genuine customers.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 12:20   #10
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Must say i agree mostly that the PC industry is in bad shape right now. not really dying, but not as good as it used to be.

Personally i put a great deal of blame on EA for this. with their double-whammy of buying out half the industry then running them into the ground, followed by their massively excessive and totally ineffectual DRM schemes

It's left developers so completely paranoid about piracy that they've started moving to consoles, even though piracy levels are pretty much the same as they've always been in the past.
It's the gaming equivalent of health scares / terrorism levels and so on
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 12:35   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver51 View Post
...This and the old CD key system is enough to stop Bob Public from copying the disk for their mates. Anything else is just punishing genuine customers.
+1
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 12:36   #12
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IIRC Oblivion didn't have any copy protection, or if it did it wasn't very strong.
i think that game did pretty well on the PC didn't it ?

I've never owned a console, and i've been gaming since the 80's....
Piracy is a problem, but adding restrictive measures for those who purchase the game is wrong.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 12:41   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver51 View Post
I believe the PC market is still very much alive for the publishers that make the effort to support it. That's Blizzard and that's Valve.

Ignoring the PC platform because of piracy is silly, as is overloading products with DRM. I know some Sony DVD's won't copy easily, designed purposely to give CRC errors if you try. This and the old CD key system is enough to stop Bob Public from copying the disk for their mates. Anything else is just punishing genuine customers.
That isn't enough though in a community of sharers. It only takes one person who isn't bob public to make a rip and then that can be shared a billion times.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 12:43   #14
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Hes partially right but I still think most of this recent PC bashing is by people trying to justify to themselves that turning their back on the industry that gave birth to their careers so they can make a bit more money on console exclusives isnt a morral problem. To be honest I wish theyd put up or shut up, your either part of the problem or part of the solution, whinging about a platform whilst doing nothing to help is doing more harm than good.

As mentioned DRM is only a problem for legitimate users, punishing them for daring to pay for a game rather than downloading one with the copy protection stripped off. If it worked I would have no problem with it but since it only causes problems for legitimate users it is farcical.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 12:49   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evildead666 View Post
IIRC Oblivion didn't have any copy protection, or if it did it wasn't very strong.
i think that game did pretty well on the PC didn't it ?

I've never owned a console, and i've been gaming since the 80's....
Piracy is a problem, but adding restrictive measures for those who purchase the game is wrong.
You install it and it works. Just how a game should work.

Bizarrely I don't know anybody who has pirated oblivion. I own it twice for some bizarre reason. (One for PC and one for XBox 360)

Spore on the other hand... or in fact anything by EA. TBH I play Kane's Wrath every day and don't mind the bugs and the imbalances and having to have the CD in the drive because it's fun. But I couldn't say the same for games like spore where it's not that fun and it really is restrictive.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 12:49   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liratheal View Post
I find myself agreeing with him, to be quite honest.

DRM is retarded, super-mega-stupid even, but I can see why it's done. How can we, as a PC gaming collective, ask for the publishers trust when half of the PC users world wide are pirating whatever the hell they feel like, because they're too lazy to go out and buy it.

Too 'poor' to buy a PC game? Stop paying for the best service your ISP offers, you half-wit.
+1. Piracy might not actually be killing the PC games market, but it's killing the big dev's enthusiasm for it, which is tantamount to the same thing imo.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 12:59   #17
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I say what is dying is creativity. There's no doubt that PC are much more versatile than consoles, but still, everybody insists in FPS games. They are as fun as fastfood. You play, you have fun, but after you leave the game, you don't even remember what was you playing.

Good games sell, average games get pirated and bad games, who cares?...
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 12:59   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liratheal View Post
I find myself agreeing with him, to be quite honest.

DRM is retarded, super-mega-stupid even, but I can see why it's done. How can we, as a PC gaming collective, ask for the publishers trust when half of the PC users world wide are pirating whatever the hell they feel like, because they're too lazy to go out and buy it.

Too 'poor' to buy a PC game? Stop paying for the best service your ISP offers, you half-wit.
Because even when you put DRM on a game it will still get pirated. This has been gone over in many threads here, DRM =/= an end to piracy, all it does is anger customers who bought the game, and it also pushes people to pirate the game as well so they can bypass it.

While I agree that developers should be able protect their IP, look at companies like Stardock, no DRM there at all, the only thing is you need to register a CD key to an account to play online. Are they getting stung by pirates? Yeah, they are, but not really any more so that other companies who put this DRM in place. What EA is saying when they put DRM in place is, "Hey all you paying customers, we don't trust you, you little criminal shits"

Whereas Stardock go, "Hey, here's the game you paid for, oh you criminals, sure go ahead and steal it, it's not like we could stop you anyway."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yemerich View Post
I say what is dying is creativity. There's no doubt that PC are much more versatile than consoles, but still, everybody insists in FPS games. They are as fun as fastfood. You play, you have fun, but after you leave the game, you don't even remember what was you playing.

Good games sell, average games get pirated and bad games, who cares?...
QFT

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That isn't enough though in a community of sharers. It only takes one person who isn't bob public to make a rip and then that can be shared a billion times.
But it's going to happen anyway, so why even bother wasting money on stuff like SecureROM, it's like building a little garden fence around a dragon. It's just gonna fly away anyway.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 13:00   #19
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Quote:
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+1. Piracy might not actually be killing the PC games market, but it's killing the big dev's enthusiasm for it, which is tantamount to the same thing imo.
Piracy has nothing to do with the big dev's enthusiasm. It's been there all the time and it only become problem when it's easier to download and play pirated game than to buy it and have endless problems with the game or realise that it does not worth the money.
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Old 3rd Oct 2008, 13:19   #20
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Quote:
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That isn't enough though in a community of sharers. It only takes one person who isn't bob public to make a rip and then that can be shared a billion times.
But it's going to happen anyway, so why even bother wasting money on stuff like SecureROM, it's like building a little garden fence around a dragon. It's just gonna fly away anyway.
Yes.

If it can be played or viewed, it can be pirated. Pirates have to be dealt with separately from your paying customers. All DRM does is annoy your customer base, or in the case of Spore, stop people buying the game in the first place.
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