GE claims holographic data breakthrough - bit-tech.net Forums

CardJoe · 28th Apr 2009, 09:57

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardwar...breakthrough/1

General Electric has announced that it is close to commercialising a microholographic storage medium which retains compatibility with CDs, DVDS, and BDs.

p3n · 28th Apr 2009, 10:27

Who needs a disc that large? I certainly don't trust optical discs as 'backups' as they can be easily damaged/ seem to wear out over time (RIP jackass season 1) - Will be interesting to see if these discs are a tad more resilient.

Journeyer · 28th Apr 2009, 10:45

I agree with p3n in the sense that spinning optical media will always be at risk from wear and tear, and plain old maltreatment. However, this would obviously only be the first generation of holographic storage devices, and as such it is my firm belief that next-gen devices will not be built around spinning mediums. I'm still awaiting the Babylon 5-esque crystal storage devices, which in principle is the same thing.

johnnyboy700 · 28th Apr 2009, 11:11

Hang on, didn't the HAL 9000 from 2001 use holographic storage?

Life imitating art again?

Paradigm Shifter · 28th Apr 2009, 11:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Journeyer

I'm still awaiting the Babylon 5-esque crystal storage devices, which in principle is the same thing.

Sort of a holographic SSD?

Yeah, the capacity of holographic discs, with the resilience of solid state media.

Do want.

More storage is always a good thing... but 500GB... if the data read/write rates haven't improved a lot, writing 500GB will take forever. Two things stop me from using Blu-ray as a secondary backup medium - the cost of the discs (the writer drives themselves aren't too bad - about half the price of my first CD writer) and the fact that they write so slowly.

Yemerich · 28th Apr 2009, 12:02

@Paradigm: Agreed

But backwards compatible? this seems folklore to me...

Burnout21 · 28th Apr 2009, 12:06

I actually want this capacity 500GB disc, yeah i would invest them, even 1TB.

I could backup my HDD's and archive them each month or every two months. Ghosting the whole drive.

When you backup all your DVD's on HDD, plus hunderds of CD's and then loose it all, there is nothing worse than doing it all again!

Something to which i might be faced to have to do!

Also now HD-DVD and blue offer, loseless audio, maybe the video wont be compressed down to 1080p, allowing a much closer res to that of 35mm film which the films are shot on. This would then lead to what i would call true HD, 1080p is still too small! Newer flat panels, or projectors. Cinema quality, but digital! yay!

Paradigm Shifter · 28th Apr 2009, 12:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burnout21

Also now HD-DVD and blue offer, loseless audio, maybe the video wont be compressed down to 1080p, allowing a much closer res to that of 35mm film which the films are shot on. This would then lead to what i would call true HD, 1080p is still too small! Newer flat panels, or projectors. Cinema quality, but digital! yay!

I shudder to think how much the film industry will want to charge for totally uncompressed audio and video on discs for films. The price premium on Blu-ray is already significant, and HD-DVD wasn't exactly cheap. My local Comet is still trying to sell off the HD-DVD drives for the XBox 360 and HD-DVD films... they want £150 for the drive and £35 a film! At least, they did just before Easter. They might have pulled them now.

brave758 · 28th Apr 2009, 14:45

Looking forward to seeing them. Man the speed this stuff is moving now is scary

Jordan Wise · 28th Apr 2009, 16:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnyboy700

Hang on, didn't the HAL 9000 from 2001 use holographic storage?

Yeah, and we all know how well that turned out

Omnituens · 28th Apr 2009, 17:53

Holographic storage was also used in the backstory to the MMO Neocron.... that didn't turn out well either.

DESTROY IT BEFORE IT DESTROYS US!

StephenK · 28th Apr 2009, 17:54

Who needs this much space on a disc?

'The world will only need 5 computers' 'Nobody will ever need more than 128k of memory' ' Etc etc.

Perhaps we don't need this much space on a disc at this point in time but that's really not the point.

Optical media are indeed subject to wear and tear and mistreatment but so are all other physical forms of storage. Perhaps the optical discs can be made less prone to scratching,etc. Either way, you just make sure to back them up every few years. Or, more likely, you back up for 8 year old 1TB holodiscs onto newer 200TB cubes or 500TB wafers or whatever.

perplekks45 · 28th Apr 2009, 19:20

I don't know why we wouldn't welcome this.
I totally agree with StephenK: We might not need it today, but what about in 10 years? 20? 50? 100? Seeing how fast HDDs grew in size within the last 5 years I wouldn't say 500GB is OTT.

Also, about the uncompressed movie thing: What about some Super Hi-Vision/Ultra-HD @ 7680 × 4320 pixel?

Size comparison:

FullHD is the little turquoise thing in the top left while UHD is "big blue".

thehippoz · 28th Apr 2009, 19:41

I would like to see fast 1TB flash sticks someday for regular backups.. with 1tb usb harddrives going for under a hundred bucks, thats the way to go currently.. this would be nice for media archives though, store it in a dark place.. it looks like thats what they're targeting first

the 1tb harddrive for weekly and these disks for permanent storage would be a very nice setup to have.. only downside is like was mentioned.. what if you scratched one of these discs and it held important data on it- roid rages

knutjb · 29th Apr 2009, 00:13

I think it's brilliant. The ability to store that much on a small plastic disc is amazing. Can they make it bigger and cheaper with fast transfer rates before its' old tech? If it's the same size as a cd/dvd/bluray backward compatibility is pretty easy but it's a moot point if there is an equally large or larger capacity that comes in a physically smaller/more convenient platform. Perhaps they can make it in a different shape or size...

perplekks45 · 29th Apr 2009, 03:17

Backwards compatibility is not pretty easy just because it's the same size/format. The process behind it is pretty different, actually.

Spaceraver · 29th Apr 2009, 08:24

And que the external harddrive for backup folks.. If you are so worried about your data you would be running raid 5 with some external drives to go with it anyways.. almost nothing beats the hdd for storage capacity and the amount of read writes it can endure.

Paradigm Shifter · 29th Apr 2009, 10:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by perplekks45

Backwards compatibility is not pretty easy just because it's the same size/format. The process behind it is pretty different, actually.

That is certainly true - but the Blu-ray drive I had in a laptop had two different lenses - one for reading Blu-ray and one for reading CD/DVD. Chances are the 'backwards compatibility' would be something like that.

If, on the other hand, they made these holographic discs... I dunno, square, or mini-CD sized... or changed the size of the spindle hole, or tripled the thickness of the discs... backwards compatibility would go right out the window.

Vimesey · 29th Apr 2009, 12:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paradigm Shifter

or mini-CD sized...

See that's where the exciting potential lies, if we don't need 500GB, you could fit a Blu-Ray disk level of capacity on a tiny format. Which would be amazing for netbooks etc.

perplekks45 · 29th Apr 2009, 13:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paradigm Shifter

That is certainly true - but the Blu-ray drive I had in a laptop had two different lenses - one for reading Blu-ray and one for reading CD/DVD. Chances are the 'backwards compatibility' would be something like that.

If, on the other hand, they made these holographic discs... I dunno, square, or mini-CD sized... or changed the size of the spindle hole, or tripled the thickness of the discs... backwards compatibility would go right out the window.

And... you have a point.

28th Apr 2009, 09:57	#1
CardJoe Player Character bit-tech Staff Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 8,011	GE claims holographic data breakthrough http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardwar...breakthrough/1 General Electric has announced that it is close to commercialising a microholographic storage medium which retains compatibility with CDs, DVDS, and BDs. __________________ this is joe's non-bit-tech blog

28th Apr 2009, 10:45	#3
Journeyer Ultramodder Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Norway Posts: 1,109	I agree with p3n in the sense that spinning optical media will always be at risk from wear and tear, and plain old maltreatment. However, this would obviously only be the first generation of holographic storage devices, and as such it is my firm belief that next-gen devices will not be built around spinning mediums. I'm still awaiting the Babylon 5-esque crystal storage devices, which in principle is the same thing. __________________ When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth. MSI 790FX-GD70 \|\| PhenomII X4 955 \|\| 8Gb Crucial DDR3 1333Mhz \|\| Gigabyte GTX285\|\| OCZ EliteXstream 1KW

28th Apr 2009, 12:02	#6
Yemerich What's a rebimboca da parafuseta? Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Sao Paulo - Brazil Posts: 714	@Paradigm: Agreed But backwards compatible? this seems folklore to me... __________________ Bit Tech is more than games and hardware - check out the mods too. Don't let modding die in Bit-Tech.net.

28th Apr 2009, 12:06	#7
Burnout21 is true bit-techer! Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Nott's Posts: 4,862	I actually want this capacity 500GB disc, yeah i would invest them, even 1TB. I could backup my HDD's and archive them each month or every two months. Ghosting the whole drive. When you backup all your DVD's on HDD, plus hunderds of CD's and then loose it all, there is nothing worse than doing it all again! Something to which i might be faced to have to do! Also now HD-DVD and blue offer, loseless audio, maybe the video wont be compressed down to 1080p, allowing a much closer res to that of 35mm film which the films are shot on. This would then lead to what i would call true HD, 1080p is still too small! Newer flat panels, or projectors. Cinema quality, but digital! yay! __________________ DFI P45-T2RS Plus, Q6600, 4GB Reaper HPC, GTX280 & FX3450, X-Fi Xtreme Music, 1570GB Storage

28th Apr 2009, 17:53	#11
Omnituens Supermodder Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Stockport Posts: 413	Holographic storage was also used in the backstory to the MMO Neocron.... that didn't turn out well either. DESTROY IT BEFORE IT DESTROYS US! __________________ Current Rig: i7 D0 2.66GHz, 6GB 1066MHz Corsair "Dominator", 285 GTX.

28th Apr 2009, 10:27	#2
p3n Hypermodder Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 737	Who needs a disc that large? I certainly don't trust optical discs as 'backups' as they can be easily damaged/ seem to wear out over time (RIP jackass season 1) - Will be interesting to see if these discs are a tad more resilient.

28th Apr 2009, 11:11	#4
johnnyboy700 Hypermodder Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 789	Hang on, didn't the HAL 9000 from 2001 use holographic storage? Life imitating art again?

28th Apr 2009, 14:45	#9
brave758 Minimodder Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 20	Looking forward to seeing them. Man the speed this stuff is moving now is scary

28th Apr 2009, 17:54	#12
StephenK Nanomodder Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 224	Who needs this much space on a disc? 'The world will only need 5 computers' 'Nobody will ever need more than 128k of memory' ' Etc etc. Perhaps we don't need this much space on a disc at this point in time but that's really not the point. Optical media are indeed subject to wear and tear and mistreatment but so are all other physical forms of storage. Perhaps the optical discs can be made less prone to scratching,etc. Either way, you just make sure to back them up every few years. Or, more likely, you back up for 8 year old 1TB holodiscs onto newer 200TB cubes or 500TB wafers or whatever. __________________ Intel e6600 @ 2.4ghz \| 4gb Corsair Twin2X 6400C4 DDR2 \| Arctic Cooling Freezer 7 Pro + Silver 5 \| Gainward 7950GT 256MB \| iiyama ProLite E2200WS \| Black Coolermaster Mystique 631 \| Corsair HX620 PSU \| Asus P5B Deluxe \| 1tb SpinPoint F1 Desktop + 320gb Samsung T166 \| X-Fi Xtreme Gamer \| Creative Inspire T6100 \| Samsung DVD±RW SH-S183A \| LG DVD ROM \| Logitech Mx5000 \|

28th Apr 2009, 19:20	#13
perplekks45 BSc... finally Join Date: May 2004 Location: Vienna, Austria Posts: 3,353	I don't know why we wouldn't welcome this. I totally agree with StephenK: We might not need it today, but what about in 10 years? 20? 50? 100? Seeing how fast HDDs grew in size within the last 5 years I wouldn't say 500GB is OTT. Also, about the uncompressed movie thing: What about some Super Hi-Vision/Ultra-HD @ 7680 × 4320 pixel? Size comparison: FullHD is the little turquoise thing in the top left while UHD is "big blue". __________________ "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far." Blame it on Cheaps! [now a social group]

28th Apr 2009, 19:41	#14
thehippoz sea grogin Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Fresno, CA Posts: 1,740	I would like to see fast 1TB flash sticks someday for regular backups.. with 1tb usb harddrives going for under a hundred bucks, thats the way to go currently.. this would be nice for media archives though, store it in a dark place.. it looks like thats what they're targeting first the 1tb harddrive for weekly and these disks for permanent storage would be a very nice setup to have.. only downside is like was mentioned.. what if you scratched one of these discs and it held important data on it- roid rages

29th Apr 2009, 00:13	#15
knutjb Minimodder Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 26	I think it's brilliant. The ability to store that much on a small plastic disc is amazing. Can they make it bigger and cheaper with fast transfer rates before its' old tech? If it's the same size as a cd/dvd/bluray backward compatibility is pretty easy but it's a moot point if there is an equally large or larger capacity that comes in a physically smaller/more convenient platform. Perhaps they can make it in a different shape or size...

29th Apr 2009, 03:17	#16
perplekks45 BSc... finally Join Date: May 2004 Location: Vienna, Austria Posts: 3,353	Backwards compatibility is not pretty easy just because it's the same size/format. The process behind it is pretty different, actually. __________________ "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far." Blame it on Cheaps! [now a social group]

29th Apr 2009, 08:24	#17
Spaceraver Weekend Junkie Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kolding, Denmark Posts: 1,307	And que the external harddrive for backup folks.. If you are so worried about your data you would be running raid 5 with some external drives to go with it anyways.. almost nothing beats the hdd for storage capacity and the amount of read writes it can endure. __________________ "Faith: not wanting to know what is true." - Friedrich Nietzsche. "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful." - Seneca Last thing I remember, I was drinking this glowing green sht out of a test tube and dancing like a bstard.