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Old 28th Dec 2009, 00:25   #1
Vimesey
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Mixing Powerline networking with WiFi?

Hi my parents have moved into a new house, and its a netowrking nightmare. The walls are a feet thick and solid granite, only one place you can hook up a router to the line. Also its formed of two small housed joined by a conservatory.

So, I was wondering could I use a router at the adsl line like normal, attatch that by ethernet to one of those powerline network things, then attatch the other end of that to another wireless router and broadcast two wirless networks.

Also:

Are the powerthings even worth considering?
Would a wireless repeater or two be better?
Could I not have the first router and use the powerline to just go straight to the second router, as simply better positioning of the router may be enough?
If the two small houses forming the one home are on a seperate fuse box, does that mean the powerline would not work between them?
If so any way to work out which fuse box the conservatory is wired to without flicking switches til it stops working?

Thanks and rep to anyone who helps
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 00:30   #2
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repeaters would probably be the easiest, since all they require is minimal setup and external power.
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 00:37   #3
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Yes, Powerline is a viable option.
I would suggest something like, ADSL Router -> Powerline Adapter -> Powerline Adapter in Conservatory -> Wireless AP in the Conservatory.

You need to figure out what circuit feeds where as Powerline will only operate on 1 fuse box.

You're going to have to trip those fuses to find out if the Conservatory is on the same fuse box as where the router will be located.

I've never had much luck with repeaters, found them slow and laggy.
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 13:22   #4
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How would i go about setting the second router to source its internet from ethernet and broadcast wireessly?

Would i have t change anything on the first router, match settings ro anything?

Cheers
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 13:34   #5
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You need to disable the DHCP server on the second router.
Somewhere within the router setup pages, there should be an option to switch this off, thus making it, to all intents and purposes, act like a basic access point.

Clients will then connect wirelessly, or wired, if you wish, to the second router, but the DHCP server on the first router will allocate IP addresses, handle net access etc etc.

What model router are you going to use?
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Last edited by Fazed; 28th Dec 2009 at 13:38. Reason: Typos
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 13:44   #6
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For the first router, i.e. the one hooked up to the net directly, a Belkin N+ router (F5D8635-4 v1 i think)

For the second one a basic Netgear G (DG834G v4)

So only need to disable DHCP, none of the bridging and point to point client stuff, that confuses me.

Could i use a laptop in range of the first router using ICS to provide the net to the second router by ethernet to test things before getting powerline things, i.e. would it work the same?

Cheers again
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 14:00   #7
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the powerline option might fail here

Usually it should only work on one rig main, either upstairs or downstairs this is what i understand as the fuse box would cause a headache.

Next because there house is a ba*tard child of two, you need to figure out if teh whole place is re-wired onto a single fuse panel or if they both have there own fuse boxes. If the latter is involved then imagine the problem.

You would be pluging in and expecting to be able to access your network from 'next door'
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 14:05   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vimesey View Post

Could i use a laptop in range of the first router using ICS to provide the net to the second router by ethernet to test things before getting powerline things, i.e. would it work the same?

Cheers again
You lost me there a little

The easiest way to simulate, would be to take the second router into the room where the Primary router is located and connect them together directly via Ethernet.
Disable the DHCP on the second router, give the SSID on that router something completely different from the primary e.g. Netgear.

Try to connect wirelessly, solely to the Netgear and if you have internet access, jobs a good 'un

EDIT: Yes, As burnout, and I have previously stated, you need to be sure that the wiring where the Primary router, and where the secondary router will be located, are on the same fuse box.
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 14:13   #9
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Ok tried disabling DHCP on the netgear and can no longer connect, can see its wireless network, but windows says it gets no response when i try and connect.

Yeah the fuse box thing shouldn't be a problem i believe half the conservatory is on one box half on the other, but either way can get the second router in a good enough position.
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 14:32   #10
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Ok, not going to be straightforward. Need to change a few settings.

What is the Primary router's IP address? e.g. 192.168.1.1 192.168.1.254 etc etc
Within the setup pages of the Primary router, what is the DCHP server's IP Range? E.g. 192.168.1.100 -> 192.168.1.250
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 14:34   #11
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primiary router's IP is 192.168.2.1

its allocation for DHCP range from .2.2 through .2.100
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 14:44   #12
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Try changing the Netgears LAN IP address to 192.168.2.101
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 14:46   #13
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Ah ok had it as something within that range, will try that

Edit: no dice, still connection is instantly rejected
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 14:58   #14
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Ah ok had it as something within that range, will try that

Edit: no dice, still connection is instantly rejected
Hmmm.

Quick recap, both routers are connected via Ethernet cable? You've disabled the DHCP on the netgear, set it's LAN IP Address to 192.168.2.101 ?
You can wirelessly connect to the netgear, still have access to the setup pages but have no internet connection through it?

Have you tried rebooting both Routers?

Within the Belkins setup pages, is there an option to view what devices are connected to it? If so, does it show the Netgear as being connected?
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Last edited by Fazed; 28th Dec 2009 at 14:59. Reason: Additional Info
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 15:20   #15
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Sorry I meant connection as in the wireless connection, i can't connect wirelessly to the netgear, havn't got to check the net yet.

Cheers
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 15:26   #16
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Sorry I meant connection as in the wireless connection, i can't connect wirelessly to the netgear, havn't got to check the net yet.

Cheers
Ahh, ok. So, am I right in assuming you're connecting to the Netgear in order to access the configuration pages via Ethernet cable?

If you've set the default LAN IP fo rthe netgear to 192.168.2.101, log back into it, ensure that the Wireless Broadcast is switched on, and for the purpose of testing, switch off any wireless encryption. Then try to connect wirelessly
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 15:35   #17
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Right, tried removing security and that.

Windows still instantly rejects the connection, and after asking why, it cites it is getting no responce from the router.

So stressful

Cheers, you're being awesome helping me
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 15:41   #18
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It's stressing me now!!

Were you able to connect to this Netgear prior to changing any settings?
What standard is your notebook's wireless adapter? B, G, N etc etc?

OK, Start from scratch, do a full factory reset. On the back of the netgear, there should be a little recessed button, get a something small insert and hold until all the lights flash and it should reset to default, disconnnect the LAN cable before doing this.

Try to connect wirelessly with the default settings after it's rebooted and report back.
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 16:29   #19
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Ok good shout, some setting must have been causing a problem as i can connect to the internet through the second router now.

Though as i have to order the adapters to be able to put the second router in a useful position, i tried to use a spare laptop in a useful position and then connect the second router through ICS (internet connection sharing), but then i can't access the internet through the second wireless or the settings page of the primary router.

I'm still happy if i haver to wait to ge thte adapters, adding ICS in the middle may just be too complex a network, but any ideas would be great for the temporary fix

Cheers
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Old 28th Dec 2009, 17:34   #20
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Ok good shout, some setting must have been causing a problem as i can connect to the internet through the second router now.

Though as i have to order the adapters to be able to put the second router in a useful position, i tried to use a spare laptop in a useful position and then connect the second router through ICS (internet connection sharing), but then i can't access the internet through the second wireless or the settings page of the primary router.

I'm still happy if i haver to wait to ge thte adapters, adding ICS in the middle may just be too complex a network, but any ideas would be great for the temporary fix

Cheers
I know diddly about ICS, so can't comment.

But basically, the system works? Albeit with the second router not actually in the ideal location?
By that, I mean can you connect to either Wireless SSID, Netgear or Belkin and access the internet through both?

With regard to the Adapters, are you based in the UK or elsewhere?
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