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Old 13th May 2012, 19:06   #1
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Romney

with the presidential election coming up.. this kind of make me pause on romney (besides the mormon overlord thing)- think we need a change in the white house, but the way mitt handled this story- he basically said he didn't remember.. how the heck can you not remember something like that? link to a uk article on it.. it's all over the papers here

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ol-attack.html

is this the same kind of lying we're to expect if he takes office? it really makes me wonder.. obama is bad, but he's pretty consistent.. he does things to score political points all the time, but I realize that's the business he's in.. his birth certificate being layered made me laugh at the genius of his re-election team.. reminds me of the ultimate troll

*sigh* why can't we just get paul in there and be done with these idiots
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Old 13th May 2012, 19:10   #2
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Dude.

Capitals and proper punctuation next time please.

From my side of the pond it seems Obama is about 1000 times better than Romney, but I suppose it could be like when Reagan was elected, and Americans just want a change.
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Old 13th May 2012, 19:42   #3
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Firstly, I'd like to take issue with the idea that Obama needs to be kicked out in the first place; given that I'm, like Mankz, on the other side of the pond I may not have the best vantage point of his Presidency but it sure seems a lot more reasonable than what any of the Republican candidates have offered. Please, enlighten me?

Secondly, Ron Paul is excellent at identifying and even predicting problems but his solutions are always seem to verge on ultra-libertarian populism, and as nice as guy as he seems, I practice a certain degree of cynicism over someone who defends gun rights and opposes abortion.
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Old 13th May 2012, 20:50   #4
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well here.. jobs haven't grown enough under obama, that may not be his fault but you look at the economy and see it could be so much better.. small business is really hurting here

his cronies in his cabinet are all banks- and this energy secretary has flat out said- I'm keeping gas prices high because we use too much which is a ridiculous argument when too many businesses are pretty much broke.. just getting shafted on both ends- he's kind of out of touch with reality there

never really liked romney.. always said he's not the right guy.. but since he's the one on the ticket now- as predicted.. that's what we have to work with

the thing with obama on gay marriage plays a bit into what I was talking about.. he doesn't really stand for anything- he just goes where the money is.. he kind of makes me sick in that way- I'm happy we have his health plan (health care is too expensive.. we know all about that- even if it had 2k pages of earmarks it's a step forward) but I can see housing prices going even lower along with job growth until he's gone

like when jimmy carter was in office in a way
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Old 13th May 2012, 21:20   #5
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I haven't had the time to keep up that much on what's been going on over the pond, other than headline news, unfortunately. So how do you see Romney implementing improvements to the job situation, since that's what's (in simplistic terms) affecting housing values?
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Old 13th May 2012, 21:31   #6
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While I agreed the economy and people are still hurting, it seems so many neglect to acknowledge the depth of this recession (depression.) I believe we would be far, far worse off without the stimulus money put into the economy. Here's a chart of job gains since President Obama took office:

http://articles.businessinsider.com/...a-election-day

Yes, the number of jobs created is slower than we need. However, congress certainly has not cooperated with President Obama to actually pass legislation that would help, e.g. infrastructure rebuilding proposals. Romney proposes what he has referred to as George W. Bush's policies "updated." Isn't that in part what got us into this mess in the first place?

As far as fuel prices are concerned, that is more a function of oil speculators and the market in general. And as we know from participating here on Bit-tech, gasoline prices in the US are far better than what our brothers and sisters in the EU pay! Consumption of oil in the US is down *and* we are now net exporters.

As for gay marriage, Obama spent his political capital on the healthcare act in his first term. The tide of public opinion has shifted from against to for in any states. As for any benefit from his voicing the opinion gays should be able to get married, it remains to be seen whether that will gain or lose him actual votes.

Ron Paul has a couple good ideas, but many are anti-progress in my opinion. Doing away with the Environmental Protection Agency? Our resources are polluted as it is. Business has proven time and again that the "free market" does not dissuade greedy corporations from pushing environmental limits and beyond for the sake of profit.

Dr. Paul's mantra of "states rights" would include abolishing the Civil Rights Act of 1964, Social Security, and the so-called "Obamacare." It is not beyond imagination that some southern states in particular would no longer offer equal protection under the law for other races. I suspect too that Social Security is part of the reason this recession (depression) hasn't hit seniors as hard as other demographics. At least they have a steady income.

I could ramble on more, but I think you get the idea. Don't believe all the negatives you may have heard about President Obama's policies. Some of them are downright lies which keep getting repeated. What he needs is a Congress who will work with him more than the present obstructionist one has. Then, I think, we will see a real recovery begin to take hold.
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Old 13th May 2012, 23:34   #7
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with the presidential election coming up.. this kind of make me pause on romney (besides the mormon overlord thing)- think we need a change in the white house.
Not sure that is the sort of "change" you really want as it will be nothing but going back to something that has ONLY failed you before (Hi Bush), atop of this of the Europeans like Obama because he unlike the republicans have some sense in his foreign policy. Atop of this while many in the US seem to have been disappointed that the economy didn't make a one week miraculous recovery from after Bush, why blame this solely on Obama? if someone smears shite all over the toilet you don't blame the one who was sent to clean it up.

Trickle down effect DOES NOT WORK, why was anyone ever fooled by this? giving the rich more money does not create jobs, on the contrary it is directly destructive to the economy.

More environmental laws does not destroy jobs, again take this lesson from Denmark, the more laws you make in this area the more jobs have historically been created.

Essentially all of the politics of the republicans are prone to failure and unfortunately the foreign policy of America has a huge influence on all other western countries, and really no one over here likes the republican foreign policy.

If you didn't catch it I am not a big fan of Romney or the republicans


And I am considered a "republican" voter here in DK
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Old 13th May 2012, 23:39   #8
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I genuinely believe Obama has been one of the unluckiest prezzies of the US so far. Almost everything has been working against him. Sadly I fear he promised too much, things which were technically possible but realistically not, especially when Congress were shoving two fingers up at him every time there was an effort to do something sensible.

Mitt Romney is a colossal douche and serves as another step backwards. How someone who genuinely believes mormon/moron faith can come that close to being the most powerful person in the world is staggering.

I very much like Ron Paul - 90% of his policies make great sense, but as Scirocco says, there are some glaring holes, for me that is. His views on abortion for one, is something that I disagree with, and secondly he seems a bit too aligned to Christianity for anyone in power of a multi-faith nation in my opinion, but that can be said about many leaders to be fair. His healthcare methods are very very interesting indeed, and his books are well worth reading to get a grasp on the style he has. Theoretical free market could do wonders for the US - bringing it to fruition is just unlikely though, hence why the guy won't get anywhere serious this term. Nevertheless he has had massive gains this time compared to his last presidential run, but I fear his age will get the better of him for next time.
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Old 14th May 2012, 00:08   #9
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I very much like Ron Paul - 90% of his policies make great sense, but as Scirocco says, there are some glaring holes, for me that is. His views on abortion for one, is something that I disagree with, and secondly he seems a bit too aligned to Christianity for anyone in power of a multi-faith nation in my opinion, but that can be said about many leaders to be fair. His healthcare methods are very very interesting indeed, and his books are well worth reading to get a grasp on the style he has. Theoretical free market could do wonders for the US - bringing it to fruition is just unlikely though, hence why the guy won't get anywhere serious this term. Nevertheless he has had massive gains this time compared to his last presidential run, but I fear his age will get the better of him for next time.
I think he wants to just leave it to the states even though he's personally against it. Similarly he wants to get rid of the federal death penalty which definitely puts him in my good books.

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I believe we would be far, far worse off without the stimulus money put into the economy. Here's a chart of job gains since President Obama took office:
Compared to what though? What about the number of jobs that might have been created if there was no stimulus? That's a figure you can never find out.
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Old 14th May 2012, 00:11   #10
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Old 14th May 2012, 05:44   #11
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I haven't had the time to keep up that much on what's been going on over the pond, other than headline news, unfortunately. So how do you see Romney implementing improvements to the job situation, since that's what's (in simplistic terms) affecting housing values?
less people working.. less people buying homes- unoccupied homes in a bad economy = copper thieves.. it just trickles down from there

was hoping someone like romney could use his business savvy to kick the right people in the ass- because they need a good kicking, they got obama sucking all the nipples.. but after hearing this- makes me question his honesty =| I was definitely going to vote for him even though he was mormon.

yeah I've read ron pauls views julian, on the fed reserve printing money and how they keep inflation under control.. it's really interesting.. he had a good interview on the price of gold and silver too not long ago- he would make a good president imo if given a chance

I'm a gun guy so.. that stuff doesn't bother me

not sure right now.. I really don't want 4 more years of either of these guys
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Old 14th May 2012, 10:46   #12
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not sure right now.. I really don't want 4 more years of either of these guys
Just what do you think Romney can do better ?
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Old 14th May 2012, 11:37   #13
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was hoping someone like romney could use his business savvy
Wait what? As far as i know he kills almost everything he gets his hands on...
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Old 14th May 2012, 17:38   #14
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I practice a certain degree of cynicism over someone who defends gun rights and opposes abortion.
Once you stop legalised abortions you will need those guns for the increase in crime rates 18 years later.

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...and secondly he seems a bit too aligned to Christianity for anyone in power of a multi-faith nation in my opinion, but that can be said about many leaders to be fair.
Unfortunately you have to be overtly Christian to get the republican vote. The founding fathers kept religion and politics separate for a reason, it's a shame the US is forgetting the lessons from the past.
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Old 14th May 2012, 17:39   #15
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he's bought and sold off companies to get wealthy.. very educated on that end of things- and I was thinking he might know how to handle the banks, not just doing everything they ask.. deal with the fed and our debt- on the wars, I'm not sure where he stands there..

thing with obama is he doesn't really know much about business.. that was pretty clear when he gave every big bank 25 billion dollars each.. yeah 25 billion each with no strings attached

of course they just gave themselves raises and said thanks.. probably had a big laugh about it.. he has this cabinet that's very wasteful- sure they saved jobs and their own asses but at a huge cost.. they got everything they wanted

bush wasn't any better.. he actually started the bailout not to mention two wars- but I was kind of shocked to see obama just go crazy with the pursestrings

he did get osama but then goes into libya.. but now he's pulling out of afghanistan- it's confusing with him you know.. he doesn't really make the decisions I'm thinking.. the debt we incurred under bush and obama might not be reversible with someone who understands business and how money works

those bankers don't care about this country- they care about their bottom line.. look at jp morgan recently.. they live like drunk gamblers really- just pawning the problems off on the next generation instead of dealing with them

caught between a puppet and a liar.. just worried you know
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Old 14th May 2012, 19:13   #16
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The debt we incurred under Bush and Obama might not be reversible with someone who understands business and how money works
This is again my problem with Romney, he is going to continue the republican policies, which are completely off base when it comes to macro economics. As a small example I am a business student and to me their policies seem completely idiotic and not even remotely based on what is good for the nation. To add to this I have yet to talk to any one of my professors that consider the republican economic line anything less than disastrous. You have to remember that there is a major difference between micro and macro economics a difference the entire republican side seem to forget.
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Old 14th May 2012, 19:18   #17
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[Obama] he doesn't really make the decisions I'm thinking...
He's getting something right then.
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Old 14th May 2012, 19:31   #18
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What are Romney's main policies anyway apart from the core republican ones they seem to change depending on what state he is campaigning in and what his opponents say.
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Old 14th May 2012, 20:10   #19
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This is again my problem with Romney, he is going to continue the republican policies, which are completely off base when it comes to macro economics. As a small example I am a business student and to me their policies seem completely idiotic and not even remotely based on what is good for the nation. To add to this I have yet to talk to any one of my professors that consider the republican economic line anything less than disastrous. You have to remember that there is a major difference between micro and macro economics a difference the entire republican side seem to forget.

Most voters don't understand the difference between macro and micro economics either - or even basic economics for that matter. Nor necessarily should/need/or have the time to. But, they just know what they see:

New home sales at all time low

6 Million less jobs than when the recession started with a record threatening duration (which is, ironically, one of the only factors for the "unemployment rate" going down). And only 23% of companies confident they will be hiring next year

Obama tells a tale of a fictitious economy of thriving "green" companies (I'll spare you the countless links to articles on Solyndra and others that received billions of dollars of taxpayer money only to fail.)

But voters live in the real world and are paying the price for such policies. Your anecdote didn't share any specifics on the "Obama-line" vs "republican-line" (I don't even know what the "republican-line" on economics is and I spend more time looking into current and historical economics than most voters). So to me, that translates to me more of the political ideology than their thoughts on economics.

If Romney can:

Repeal the ACA (Obamacare) - although we will find out soon from the Supreme Court if he even needs to
Establish equity in, and simplify the federal tax structure
Even a moderate control in spending - even if he just flattens increases

Whatever remaining time he has left in office after accomplishing just these things, he can spend the rest of his time in office at home watching TV as far as I'm concerned.

I cite the Harding/Coolige era after the 1921 crash, the Kennedy reforms of 62, Reagan in 81-86 and Bush 01-02 (Which Obama extended).
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Last edited by eddie_dane; 14th May 2012 at 20:17.
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Old 14th May 2012, 21:29   #20
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Obama's care policy seems very unpopular if the US media is to be believed....why is this?

It basically boils down to free healthcare paid for by taxation, the same as in the UK, Australia, Canada (all of which are widely regarded to have the beast health in the world), in-fact most western countries have state health care to some extent...I always find ti remarkable that the US doesn't...and doesn't seem to like the idea of it?
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