Howdy all. Firstly I'd like to say that having recently got back into the PC hardware scene and spent the last few days trawling the web, this website (forums and Bit-Tech itself) has popped up over and over again, full of serious awesomeness. Nice one! Now, it's about time for me to build a PC. I'm not new to the act of doing so, I've built 3 or 4 before over the years, but with pretty considerable span between so I am COMPLETELY out of the loop regarding sensible levels of things (hence the title.) I've put together two scan baskets for possible builds, throwing ideas out. I hope this is an acceptable format for sharing, it seems like a sensible solution from here. Budget: These builds come up at about £650, any reduction would be lovely. Main uses: Day to day crap, but yes gaming. I have my eye on Skyrim, Battlefield 3, Witcher 2, Shogun 2, Brotherhood. It will also be used for audio editing - but just editing, no critical listening. Power is the key here. Parts required: http://www.scan.co.uk/savedbasket/d07042641894494983b0ff3c15beeba0 http://www.scan.co.uk/savedbasket/302ad127fea743bf8b90bf7357cc7233 They've come out at the same price, which is a bit genius! Monitor Resolution: 1680x1050. Not averse to a shot at Eyefinity one day. Motherboard considerations: I'm likely to be moving pro audio work between here and my studio, so USB 3.0 or even better FW800 would be nice - the studio machine has the latter but not the former. Extra information: -I'm pretty set on the case. In my past experience, nothing pisses me off more than the little screws. Stripped threads, dropping them underneath motherboards, losing them, not being able to get a screwdriver in etc. Plus, it doesn't look too silly. The only other I've seen that I like is the 690 II - I prefer the look of it a tad and like that you can take out the surplus HD bays, but it does need more screws and comes with fewer fans. Would consider it if there's a problem with the K60. -I'm open to the idea of overclocking. Not averse, not essential - whatever hardware I get, I'll have a little go at tweaking some more out, but nothing crazy or risky. -I'm not going to go to the extent of trying for fully silent this time, but noise is a slight concern, hence the choice of cooler. -I'm really, really pushing the budget here, so I'd rather no suggestions that put the price up - and any ideas for "this is a little cheaper and not much worse" would be awesome. Key points I'm undecided or unsure about: -I've been looking between 6870 and 5870 at the same price point, I understand the raw power vs. tessellation issue between them. So the question is I suppose, does it look like the next lot of games coming out are likely to be heavy on tessellation or is it just a gimmick? Ie which card would see me wanting to upgrade/xfire sooner. Or alternatively, is it better value for the extra performance per £ to just jump up to the 6950? -Regarding motherboards, am I likely to notice any difference between these two in performance terms, or is it just a feature set thing? I'm unsure about the crossfire thing. By the time I consider this graphics card too slow (which may depend on the previous point) would I be better off just buying a newer single card, or would a second of the same be better value? The case and PSU can probably manage either way. -Back again to prioritising - The SSD. Are they coming down in price a lot still, to the extent that it's worth waiting another year or so to jump in? Or is it stable and I might as well go straight away. I'm aware of the performance effects, so really maybe the question is - is the step up to 6950/Asus mobo significant enough to warrant skipping the SSD or would the MSI/5870 combo be better bang for buck anyway? -Is there a better CPU cooler out for similar money? This thing seems to get a pretty good review write up, but not noticed much gossip around the forums. -Have I done anything dumb? Cooler that won't fit case, RAM that's not supported, etc. etc. Sorry it's a bit of an essay, but I figured if I'm detailed it'll stop a lot of to-ing and fro-ing before an answer comes out. Thanks for reading, Neil This guy reminds me of these guys http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhKhGyUnc2E&feature=relmfu
Oh yes, with regards to case appearance - if I could justify the cost, I'd go for something like the Lian Li 25 or 08 boxes. I prefer sleek expensive looking cases to plasticy blingy ones.
Find myself thinking "F the budget, save up and do it right" a little :-/ Certainly with regard to things like cases and PSUs. It seems like a case and a decent PSU will last for many builds in the future, rather than getting a new £50-er every time. Anyone had hands-on with a Fractal Arc?
I always think a case is a good investment! The last one housed about 4 PCs before I upgraded it. One thing to check on though is space for graphics cards. Much as I love this Lian Li (and the previous one), I have to check carefully on the sizes of a new graphics card before I invest - some of the top end ones really wouldn't fit. Don't know about the case you've selected, but since Lian Li's can be a bit ...bijou... it might be something to double-check. Caroline
Yeh, I have been checking that - good call. If I get an expensive case with the intent of it lasting for many years to come, I'd be gutted if cards two builds later were all 300mm and didn't fit in a 290mm case. Hence the mention of that Fractal - it has removable HD bays for huge space. I should add that I'm not the sort to rack up tons of drives - it's unlikely to ever have more than 1 HD, 1 SSD and 1 optical. Possibly with a fan controller or something. I don't keep lossless audio or videos - I listen to CDs/vinyl at home and 192 mp3s when commuting and get my films OD through cable so the single 1TB even is really overkill. Thanks for the reply!
I would reccomend a Fractal Define R3 for a case. I'm trying to think of a way to save money now, but is easily upgradable in the future. So far I can only come up with a GTX 460, adding another one later.
Thanks, I've been looking at the fractals today. Actually think I'm going to get the Arc - I have had annoyances with doors before, and the removable HD bay seems more futureproof just in case. With the 460 thing, are you saying that the 6950 is probably overkill? Also, wouldn't I have to switch to Intel to run two GTXs? Seems like that would undo any cost saving... I could be wrong though! Cheers for the input, Neil
A 6870 or 5870 is fine for 1680 x 1050, if you can pick up a 5870 for the same price as a 6870, i'd probably go for the 5870. A 6950 would mean that you are future proofed a bit and could move up to 1920 x 1080 or if you fancy some eyefinity gaming.
If you're unsure about whether or not you will overclock, why don't you just use the stock cooler for now, and then upgrade to an aftermarket cooler should you feel the need? Therefore saving yourself 25 quid right there.
Graphics cards: XFX non ref 5870 for £150, Asus 6950OC £200. Cooler: I guess when I used to build more often, the stock coolers used to be HELLA loud. Is that not the case anymore? I get a little bit confused when peopel talk about different models of graphics for different resolutions. I mean... isn't there so much more to it than that? Like... a 1080p display with the details turned down would come out at the same FPS as a 1680/1050 with the details cranked. as in... there's just power, for different things - like if I get a 6950, in a year or so's time that'll be "alright for 1680x1050 but you'll need the 7xxx for 1080p" just like when I bought it, my 8800 was more than adequate for 1650 but clearly isn't now. Or is there something I'm missing these days, like the bottlenecking is different or memory levels are kinda maxed out? I'm just thinking out loud here, lol. I suppose what I'm asking is... is resolution really the governing factor, as opposed to just general graphics power over time? Like even if I never plan on going higher res than 1680x1050 and won't eyefinity, would the 6950 still last me longer before the next upgrade, or will they both start to feel sluggish and need replacing at the same kinda time?
Thing is at your native res, vast majority of games will run at 30+ FPS at highest settings even on something like an overclocked 460 1GB. A few titles out today, and certainly more in the future will need a faster card to run smoothly at 1680x1050. Buying a faster and more expensive card makes sense if you want to be ready a) for future titles that will push hardware even at 1680x1050 b) when you upgrade to a higher res display c) when you give eyefinity a go effectively tripling the amount of pixels pushed by the GPU. The 6950 should have you covered for all these possibilities. To answer your question, yes the 6950 would last you longer, but it would be overkill for your screen and modern games. It would definitely delay a need for an upgrade. I'd still go for the 6950, since you can flash the bios of the card to run it like a 6970 and that is massive power for the money you pay. My 4890 is capable of running almost any game at close to max details (most recently BFBC2 and Shogun 2, though never tried Metro 2033 or Crysis) at 1080p. And the 6950 obliterates my card in every benchmark, won't even describe the performance gap when it's running on 6970 settings. This card will last you a long time. I know that Intel stock coolers are ok if you want to run the CPU at stock or apply a mild overclock. Actually they are pretty good for cooling even pretty high overclocks, but this might result in your ears bleeding. I have no idea whether the same is true for the AMD stock coolers. As for the case, I thought of this: http://www.youtube.com/user/TimeToLiveCustoms#p/search/1/ZPxQ7r94fSM Though it seems Scan only have the R2 version which sports red powder coating. The vid is for the black R1 version with a red interior finish, but Scan don't sell them I like Lancool cases though.
Wicked, thanks. So I'm pretty set on the 6950. With regard to CPU cooler, I actually have the down firing thermalright 120 on my current skt 939 build. Are the fittings still the same? They look like the same mechanism but sizes could be different.
Yeh the red lancool is pretty cool looking, just not the kinda thing I'd leave in my home, lol. I really like the internal though. I have considered the equivalent loan li models with the same toolless stuff and classier looks, but they're actually a really tight fit to a 6950 do don't seem very future proof for £150! The Arc seems great in that regard though with the removable HD bays plus it has the same amount of main fans. Style wise, the design of the Arc is pretty much perfect to my taste - I just wish it was £30 more and real Al rather than Al-effect, lol. Not a dealbreaker though! I guess now then it's mainly about the mobo. Seems like full crossfire capable will save money later when I can buy a second 6950 rather than the latest new card... Is that Asus the best choice? PS It'll be next to orange painted walls - red would not be pleasant :-D
All the reports of unlocked 6950s were with the 2GB version of the card, like this one http://www.scan.co.uk/products/2gb-...ddr5-gpu-810mhz-1408-cores-2x-mdp-2x-dvi-hdmi Maybe the 1GB unlock as well, but I have no idea.
I like it too Looks like a reference design, so more likely to unlock. Think it's worth the £20 up to this http://www.scan.co.uk/products/2gb-...z-gddr5-gpu-810mhz-1408-cores-dvi-displayport one, or the MSI Frozr bad boy? Or get the basic and stick an aftermarket cooler on. I can't help but feel like the diddy blower OC ones not only make a lot of noise, but don't fully take advantage of existing airflow in the case. Particularly if I go with the Arc, which has the ability to have 3 140s and a 180mm all pointing at the GPU. If I'm going to try unlocking, it certainly seems like cooling is a good idea. I'm also using an x-fi in there which might interfere with airflow approaching. P.S. Updated basket, clearly ignoring my "don't want to stretch the budget any further" requirements, haha. Just thought of some more stuff I can sell to bring funds. The Lian Li is just there because scan aren't listing the Arc (yet?) - from what I can see it may be short on GPU space, although it's gorgeous looking. http://www.scan.co.uk/savedbasket/c38d209289b640fa9bf858e207fb47f9
Having looked at how you've ramped your budget up i'd say look at the 2500k combo on today only for £462 which would leave you (from your updated baskets budget) nearly £400 for a GPU and SSD. Massively improved performance CPU wise and could net you a GTX570 and a C300 SSD with cash to spare. Just a thought, maybe not as nice a case but its still a very good unit.
Just put the extras in the cart and you're right, would be about £30 more once I'd put on a CPU cooler but obviously quick - or could go with a 560 and be actually a little cheaper. I'm putting a few things on ebay next week, and once they're all gone I can watch the today onlies and then pull the trigger. After all, I could always sell on the 690 and the Arc instead. Cheers for the input
