E.U: Leave or Stay? Your thoughts.

It can show the data as percentage of gross national income. In that case the UK is in second place from the bottom.

 

That's gross contributions. You need to find net contribution, but I can't find figures from 2014 on .

 

Well lets look at that Link Corky sent us (telegraph article 2013) these charts
It states:

In that same graph, the NL was 5th Place with €4.29bn.

UK ~64 million residents, NL ~17 million residents, you do the math

Still wouldn't be right though, I'd look at % spent of national GDP. (doesnt look better though)


But really, this plucking at figures and bickering about who-suffers-most that we do on a small scale here is what is hampering the EU, only they do it on a large scale.
For me, the EU-discussion should be about the grand scale of things, where are we, where do we want to go.
Leave the bickering to the bean-counters.


My initial point was:

We agree you have a rebate (never mind how high), but at the same time there's no rebate in influence.

 

I love the logic: somehow being outside of it is supposed to give the UK more power and influence over its relationship with the EU, than being part of it. Yeah, sure.

Wake up and smell it: the UK is not the Empire anymore. It's not even the most powerful economy in the Commonwealth anymore. It depends economically on being part of the EEC more than the EEC depends on the UK (those Mercedes and BMWs are going to India and China, not the UK). And the US? If Trump attains power, he will not give a rat's ass about the UK.

The UK will spend the next decade renegotiating trade agreements with the EU, with the US, and adjusting all its national legislation and regulation at a time when the UK is in full austerity, the global economy is decidedly shaky and tip-toeing through a minefield of recession towards a fragile, hopeful recovery and the US may be facing the next decade with a madman at the helm.

The timing of this is so utterly catastrophic I have no words for it. Leave the EU? The UK simply can't afford it --especially not now. The UK will be so screwed even Ireland will be laughing at it.

 

If there is any upside to this mess it's the fact it'll end or ruin a few political careers... Particularly in the blue corner...

 

Sorry to pull you up on this but some of that isn't correct, yes the UK isn't the most powerful economy in the Commonwealth but we aren't discussing the Commonwealth, this is about the EU.
Among the EEC we are apparently the 3rd strongest economy and worldwide we're 5th (not researched that myself), those Mercedes and BMWs are mainly going to France, followed by the USA and then the UK.

Yea well don't blame me. I wasn't the idiot that decided an in/out referendum would be a good idea, it makes me laugh though when i hear Mr Cameron basically say what you just said when he was the one that proposed this in the first place.

 

I would agree with you that a return to a ETC would be (largely) desirable, but that is better achieved within the EU than outside of it.

Meanwhile what worries me most is that ordinary voters don't understand the issue at all. On Radio 4 (Any Answers) a woman was bristling with rage that the EU imposed a law on the UK that oven gloves had to pass a test to resist temperatures of up to 200°C. What a ludicrous rule! They are dictating what oven gloves we can sell in this country! Not realising that in fact this rule protects her from unwittingly buying oven gloves that will melt themselves to her skin as soon as she takes her roast out of the oven.

 

still voting to leave.......

 

Still voting definitely to leave.

 

Don't want to be part of the European project, you can't change what is slowly taking away the power to change it.

In the 70s we where sold a trading union and got a greater EU. They outright lied and now want us to trust them again!

Sorry but no. Would rather hard years than being part of something you can't control.



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That's just emotive defiance, not rational decision making.

 

No trust has to be earned and I don't trust them going of their previous history.

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I'd prefer the U.S.of E

 

The problem is: Who else do you trust? The UK cannot stand alone --it needs allies.

 

I thought that was part of the job description for being an MP.

 

People like to be lied to. Politicians oblige.

 

Stay.

We're not the country we think we are, we need them more than they need us.

Until we harness British Cynicism as a power source, we don't really contribute much to the world any more.

 

How do i know you're not lying.

 

As i stated before if we knew where the EU was going as opposed to a sort of this and that I would be more in favor, but as it stands it's a no.

I am sorry you feel that the only option for the UK is to be slowly consumed by the EU, leaving Westminster as a local enforcer of eu law. leading to a system where your say will mean even less than it does now.

But don't worry the EU has a history of not accepting referendum that come back with the "wrong" answer. (watch EU democracy at work lol).

 

Leave. Its turned into an unelected nightmare, and we have lost control of our borders. I think that bit is far too late but the quicker we are out the better.

I couldn't give a toss about being able to travel and work in Europe. The human rights act is a joke and being hidden behind for a million different reasons. It needs simplifying and enshrined into British Law.

I have no problem, with immigration, far from it, but it needs to be controlled. When you go to where I was born (East London) and find it totally gone, and whole areas riddled with crime from foreigners, its a problem thats totally uneccesary. We should be allowed to deport them. The influx of Poles and Lithuanians in that area is just incredible. Of course British citizens will commit crimes and that is our repsonsiblity, but gangs of foreign criminals are not.

The benefit claiming for child benefit so money can be sent back 'home' just HAS to stop. Again simple legislation that was vetoed by Europe.

Asylum seeking needs to be brought under control and our hands are tied by European legislation.

Our fishing and farming industry has been totaly screwed over, our NHS can't cope although I do appreciate the irony that without foreign staffing levels, especially at doctor levels we would be stuffed, but it needs to be controlled.

When circumstances get to like they are now, is allows people like Hitler to rise to power. The origins of his rise to power and evenyually World War II started over less than what's gone on now and its brewing up all over again.

We need to have a policy like Australia where only skilled people can enter the country to live and work, in jobs where there is a shortage of labour.

Definately OUT.