E.U: Leave or Stay? Your thoughts.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...nts-residency-rights-during-brexit-transition

Which is rather funny considering Rudd already said pretty much the same thing last summer:

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...rexit-says-immigration-minister-brandon-lewis

So after countless uturns they've come full circle.

 

​

To be fair, David Cameron is the worst PM in history. To outdo him May would have to... Actually no, she could never outdo him.

 

Not through lack of trying though.

Actually no... it's precisely her lack of trying that means she's in contention.

 

Round,
Like a circle in a spiral
Like a wheel within a wheel
Never ending or beginning
On an ever-spinning reel
Like a snowball down a mountain
Or a carnival balloon
Like a carousel that's turning
Running rings around the moon
Like a clock whose hands are sweeping
Past the minutes of its face
And the world is like an apple
Whirling silently in space
Like the circles that you find
In the windmills of your mind

Like a tunnel that you follow
To a tunnel of its own
Down a hollow to a cavern
Where the sun has never shone
Like a door that keeps revolving
In a half-forgotten dream
Like the ripples from a pebble
Someone tosses in a stream​

Like a clock whose hands are sweeping​

Past the minutes of its face

And the world is like an apple
Whirling silently in space
Like the circles that you find
In the windmills of your mind

Keys that jingle in your pocket
Words that jangle in your head
Why did summer go so quickly?
Was it something that you said?
Lovers walk along a shore
And leave their footprints in the sand
Is the sound of distant drumming
Just the fingers of your hand?
Pictures hanging in a hallway
And the fragment of a song
Half-remembered names and faces
But to whom do they belong?
When you knew that it was over
You were suddenly aware
That the autumn leaves were turning
To the color of his hair?
Like a circle in a spiral
Like a wheel within a wheel
Never ending or beginning
On an ever-spinning reel
As the images unwind
Like the circles that you find
In the windmills of your mind...​

 

At her next weekly audience, Theresa May would have to climb in the queen's lap, squat over her head and take a dump to outdo Dave.

She's already crapping on the country figuratively, she may as well do it symbolically.

 

...only to find Boris already has.

 

Yeah, that guy spreads his **** everywhere...

 

Remain. Being from Scotland whisky is sold 93% overseas. And oil exports are important. These count for over a quarter of the entire UK's food and drink exports and about 100% of it's oil
The majority South of the border export much less in terms of these kind of physical goods. So seem less concerned.
We are so different i feel that we need different things and need to leave the Union and work out a new deal with the rest of the UK as two partner independent nations.
We also by a landslide voted to remain in the EU up here. It's not democratic to take a country from the EU against it's democratic will.

 

@Slizza, With the gift of hindsight and as much as i love Scotland and its people i think the result of your independence referendum was a mistake, your politicians seem a lot more clued up than ours, I mean they even published a proper whitepaper setting out what an Independent Scotland would look like before the vote, our lot jotted down a few notes on the back of an envelope and published it months after we'd voted.
.........................
I think I've just wet myself, apparently JRM said imposing a border would be a choice of the UK government alone and if they choose to do that it would harm the republic of Ireland because of massive tariffs.

I'm going to guess he's not heard of the European social fund that the UK played and instrumental part in getting the EU to adopt and wasn't it less than 24hrs ago that people were saying the UK government isn't responsible for imposing a border?

 

Don't get me wrong, I agree, if Scotland could leave then I would say do it.

That said, as I understand it technically Scotland isn't in the EU, nor are England, Wales or NI. The UK is. So in that sense it's not undemocratic.

Now one way around this would be for England and Wales to leave the UK, Scotland & NI could remain in the EU as the UK.

That won't happen.

We've been stuffed though. Scotland twice over, I mean how many would have listened to 'better together' arguments if they knew not so long after some of those same people would say 'better apart' from the EU?

 

Don't get your hopes up - the only reason this lot up here published a white paper was because it was a 'done thing' already.
Before they had a significant presence in government they were idealistic and rebellious. Once they started to get some MP's they needed to up their stance if they were to grow, so in that sense, yes, they are bit more clued up. Where UKIP and their Conservative allies are still following the idealistic trail because they are not actually in government haven't really needed to come up with anything more substantial.

The other reason the SNP produced much more substance for their referendum was the two years before the actual vote, compared to few months for the EU Referendum. This gave them lots of time to tweak what they already had (independence is their whole reason for being, and given they're in government, they need to have some proposal that looks realistic). They also had the opportunity over this time to add to it from public concerns, though there were some obvious issues that still didn't get through.

 

True but the same could be said of the Brexit supporting MPs down south, they were idealistic and rebellious (Farage) and have had elected MPs for decades (May, Boris, Davis, Mogg, Hannan) but didn't, and still don't, have anything substantial.

You'd expect if someone involved in politics advocated a particular policy that they'd at least put some thought into that policy and could come up with a robust plan on how to carry it out, that they'd spent a lot of time tweaking their policy, that they'd have a realistic proposal.

From my perspective the similarities between the two referendums are both remarkably similar and demonstrate the stark differences between how they were conducted, the leave side for the Scottish referendum come away looking like they actual knew what they were doing whereas the leave side of Brexit, and by extension all of the UK now, look like prepubescent teens throwing a strop because they've not thought through the consequences of their actions.

 

'Quit remoaning, Brexit will be fine...'


...meanwhile in reality, 3 days of snow and the country is basically closed and running out of gas

 

You can blame most of that on the Green Lobby obsession with closing fossil fuel power stations for wind..

 

Sorry, I d'not follow the discussion, however, do you think, why Eastern European countries so want in E. U.?

 

Mostly... because it's not Russia.

 

And they'd probably receive more in development grants that they'd put in.

 

Not Russia... Yes I think its true. But why not to make own union? In E.U. enough of their problems.

 

For many reasons, chiefly amongst which I'd say would be stability (the USSR had recently collapsed), long term prosperity (historically they'd been rather neglected by the USSR), having a say in their own affairs (the USSR was a communist authoritarian regime).

 

Thank you. I have food for reflection for now. Thanks again.