Hi there, (i think this is gonna be a looooong post, but please bear with) I've currently got a P4 1.8 Northwood, Abit TH7-II, 1Gig of RDRAM, Geforce 4 Ti4400, lots of hdd space, Audigy 5.1 Platinum + other perphirerals. Basically i'm still very happy with this computer and intended to keep it another year but my parents old computer is on its last legs and they are looking into buying a new one, but all's they do is wordprocessing, browsing, some accounting programs etc so they don't need anything fancy. So i struck upon the idea of stripping this computer down and giving it to them, and getting myself a nice shiny new one My first question was about selling some of the parts from this comp as they don't need the gig of ram, the sound card (mobo has simple ac'97 thing) the graphics card etc. So whats the easiest method to sell the below components and what price should i be aiming for (i'm thinking ebay but i've never used it before) 2x256mb Samsung PC800 RDRAM Abit Siluro Geforce 4 Ti4400 SB Audigy 5.1 Platinum (with the 5" drive bay thing and remote control) So, that would leave them with a p4 1.8, 512mb ram, some old ATI gfx card i have and a 40gig drive. Which is perfect for what they want. Now thats them sorted, i was looking at components for the new computer. I was thinking the below spec. New spec: ------------ CPU: P4 3.2Ghz 'Prescott' Mobo: Asus P4C800 Deluxe or Abit IC7-G RAM: 2x512mb Crucial DDR PC3200 GFX: ATI x800 or x800 XT If anyone can see any major problems or give any advice i would be most greatful, i've not really followed the hardware scene in ages. My main query is about the 'Prescott' core, what exactly are the advantages of having one, i know it has the 1MB cache but from benchmarks i've seen there is no real improvement. The computer will mainly be used for 3D graphics work and the odd game and also whats the sound like out of the onboard 5.1 chipset? The other problem i was having figuring out is the AGP port on the new mobo's, the abit and asus board both say 0.8V, 1.5V only, would i still be able to use my current Geforce 4 on there for a few months until the price of the x800's drops? I think thats about it, Cheers for any adivce offered Martin ----------------------------- Some more questions i just thought of Whats the prescott like for overclocking, i've had the old p4 1.8 running at 2.2 for ages with no problems, i don't know if i will be over clocking the new rig but was just wondering has it got much more to give over 3.2. And also can anyone recomend a good cooling solution, the Gigabyte's 3D Cooler-PRO looks interesting after reading that article, i'm more bothered about noise now than getting that extra 5% performance increase. Thanks again, Martin
Northwood chips would be probably better to overclock as they run cooler so do not need so much cooling and you could use a quieter fan. edit:: as for a heatsink then theThermalright's SP-94 or the Thermaltake's Silent Tower did well in the review you can put the Geforce 4 Ti4400 in to all mother boards with 4x or 8x agp slot not shore about 2x as that is old so should not be relevant. some one will say if im not right, and i will feel silly.
Off topic: If you decide to sell those bits I may be interested in the: Contact me mail(at)jdandcoke.net if you sell. Also try the price check forum to get an idea of what your bits are worth. Anyway as everyone has said above depends if your wanting to upgrade again when everything changes.
Ok, some things ill quickly highlight: 1. Dunno how easily youll sell your RDRAM, or for how much (supply and demand - i havent seen any "WTD: RDRAM" threads lately) 2. What about an AMD rig? If you're considering on spending that much on a 3.2 prescott - what's wrong with a skt939 AMD/nforce3 or via setup? 3. Go for a northwood, itll be less of an inferno in your case 4. For cooling - check the recent review of the pentathlon of p4 coolers on the front page if you wanna stay aircooled. 5. I would go for the Ati X800 pro, then some faster memory - crucial are a good brand but not known for their uber fast and hardcore ocing anymore. Depends how much of a hardcore gamer you are.
i suggest for the new spec MSI K8N Nforce 3 250 mobo AMD A64 3200 2 x geil golden dragon 512mb pc3500 (if you plan on overclocking the chip, you will probably get a better clock with pc3500) Sapphire X800XT (only £50 more than a x800pro, so you would be silly not to get the XT) OR if you have the money Asus A8V Deluxe (Socket 939) mobo ( this mobo includes a wifi G card and antenna for FREE) AMD A64 3800 (socket 939) 2 x geil golden dragon 512mb pc3500 X800XT if you want help on what case, HDs, psu, etc etc, we will be happy to help TI4400 will be FINE in any new mobo the onboard 5.1 is excellent on nforce boards, dont know about intel. if you really do have your heart set on a P4 (bit a waste of money, but still) dont get a prescott, 1mb cache in theory = good, BUT it has longer pipelines = slower than northwood, and it pumps out something silly like 150watts (please correct me if im wrong) Northwood runs at 100watts (so is cooler) overclocks better and faster
one word dual processor, well 2 words but it's friday so my brains is in standby. either xeon or opteron. and as much ram as possible, since 3d stuff is fairly taxing on cpu and memory resources.
yep but there are not alot of programs that can use the 2 processors and would only be good if you were using 2 or more apps at a time.
Thanks for all the replies everyone. My preferences would be for an Intel system, i've had 2 AMD computers, a 800Mhz Athlon which died after about 7 months or so and a 1.4 which i had no end of trouble with, incompatabilites, crashes, unstable, dodgy VIA usb chipsets etc. My parents current computer is a P2-333Mhz that was mine before the 800Mhz Athlon and it's still going, and i've not had one single problem with this P4. I know lots of people that have had no problems with AMD computers but they just seem to not like me. Overclocking isn't of massive concern (i know this is in the overclocking forum, sorry) it would be nice to get a few extra Mhz for free but stability is more important really. Kenco: As for future upgrading, i really don't know, i've not been following any of the hardware developments for a year or so, when/what is BTX, will DD2 be worth waiting for? etc and how long till these become the norm. I assume they're gonna cost an arm and leg when they first come out. A duel processor system would be sweet but i think it'd be a little steep for my wallet, 2 x 2.8Ghz Xeon would be around £380 and then another £200 for a motherboard Most of the software i use would love the second processor but i don't think its gonna happen. So the general consensus is to avoid the 'Prescott' and go for a northwood. (Is that from a purely overclocking standpoint, or just generally) Cheers for the replies Martin
ya i know, but oh what a system, drools, but seriosuly if any one is looking at the price of a P4EE look atht he cost of xeons. Tomshardware recently did a article on that the cost of a P4EE baswd system is about the same as a Dual Xeon System. or if your really taxed for money, cluster a bunch of gamecubes together.
because he said he needs a giant rendering farm If intel is what you like then just go with it, when you get to the high performance end of the spectrum then there really is sod all real world difference between intel and amd imo. both are plenty fast enough. The extra heat dumped out by the prescott core is far to great to justify the minimal performance increase. The Asus P4C800 mobos are great and you won't go far wrong with one. However, afaik, it's pretty much the end of the line for socket 478 and Intel will be integrating over to the next platform in the coming months so be aware you will have an extremely limited upgrade path with P4s.
as i said, prescott is a lot hotter,slower,will blow the capacitors on non prescoot compatible boards,its hot enough at stock, imagine overclocking, a northwood will beat it in every single aspect. you would be a bit silly not to get a AMD rig really, you have just been unlucky, dont let that put you off a VERY fast A64 cpu. and dual processors would just be pointless for you, so dont waste ya money on em mate
there is no performance increase... its slower in everything, i saw it be like 00.1 percent faster in about one benchmark, but its just crap in everything else, dont even consider the prescott
Ok, i've had a look about various sites and done abit of reading, and i'm even more confused -------------------- Edited - I was just asking pzr to suggest an amd setup but he already did, cheers.
Well, Here is my big arse reply to this entire system... 1. If you are truly after a good value system, you do not want to get a Pentium 4. I know that you have had bad experiences with AMD in the past-but it looks like its your own fault-no offense or anything. Compatibility was most likely the cause; I dont suppose it helps that AMD processors were a little buggy back in the day. 2. The Athlon 64 processors are unbeleivably good. Intel is totally owned by these things. Unless you are in desperate need of the extra 15 seconds gained from encoding movies and are willing to spend an extra $90 for it, dont get a Pentium 4. The 64 processors are quite simply the most powerful CPUs (available to consumers) on the planet. 3. The new technologies that everyone is holding off on are PCI Express and DDR II. For Intel fans, and LGA 775 and BTX. PCI Express is a new standard for expansion. It replaces the current PCI BUS with a much faster system, and included in the specification is a replacement for AGP: PCI Express X16. It can deliver twice the bandwidth as AGP 8X, and all the new video cards are being designed primarily for this new system. DDR II is the replacement for current DDR RAM. It is at stock, just as quick as the fastest DDR Memory modules. It is meant to replace the now limited DDR, which will allow for even faster memory read/write times, etc etc etc. LGA (Land Grid Array) 775 is Intel's new socket for CPUs. The pins have been moved to the motherboard in order to allow for a stronger CPU, as well as better efficiency with the new BTX standard. Unfortunately, the Pins on the board are sucky. They are often bent right out of the box. The warranty only garuntees that your processor is good for ONE insertion. Any more and your warranty is void. This is due to the frailty of this inherently faulty system. Finally, BTX is a new motherboard form factor meant to "improve themal dissipation abilities of computer systems." Translated, it means that Intel doesnt want to deal with the heat problems that were caused by their horrifically inefficient architectures for which they compensated with ludicrous clock speeds, sacrificing heat and cost effectiveness for Ghz bragging rights. No companies like BTX; it is forcing the developement of new Cases, Power supplies, and building new PCBs. Very few companies are stepping into the forefront of the new technology so far as I have seen. This concludes my big arsed opinion on the topic. I dont mind if you disagree; I am just trying to provide you with both sides of the spectrum. Intel has been making a lot of poor choices lately; One of their recent intelligent choices was to abandon further Pentium 4 architecture developement, and make new desktop CPUs based off of the Pentium M, which is a much more efficient CPU. The stage has been set for a titanic dual between the major technological powers. Right now, its up to the final benchmark and price numbers to decide which company will be dominant when all is said and done. At this point however, I think it is safe to say that AMD has one hell of a lead in the tech department at this point in time.
