1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Build Advice £1000ish new build, with lots of questions

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by down18, 27 Feb 2012.

  1. down18

    down18 What's a Dremel?

    Joined:
    27 Feb 2012
    Posts:
    34
    Likes Received:
    0
    Budget:
    £1000ish, maybe could stretch another £100​
    Main uses of intended build:
    Gaming, connecting to TV to watch things on, listening to music, general use​
    Parts required:
    Just the tower, no need for OS, monitor, speakers, keyboard or mouse​
    Previous build information (list details of parts):
    No previous build​
    Monitor resolution:
    1080p, 60Hz​
    Storage requirements:
    Probably just a 128 GB SDD for now​
    Will you be overclocking:
    Yes, but not massively​

    Hello everyone

    My current laptop is frankly a bit of a piece of **** (power socket loose, so only charges in one position, battery life sub 5 minutes, sound only coming out of one channel and **** quality anyway, left mouse button lost its click, DVD drive not reading or writing, internal fans very loud, sigh )so I was originally planning on replacing it around April when most of the new graphics cards and Ivy Bridge should be out with a nice desktop that should hopefully last me about 5 years. However, my laptop isn’t sticking to the script and has added constant freezing to its other quirks so I was considering perhaps working out most of a new build now in case it totally gives up any time soon, as I do need something for work.

    The last computer I built was for my dad in 2006, but I’ve been doing bit of lurking around a few forums and came up with these parts. However, I have absolutely no preference or loyalty and just kind of want anyone’s opinion on whether I’ve chosen reasonably, and alternative choices if not. Thanks!

    Case:
    Fractal Design R3 – Was looking for my computer to be as silent as possible as I was considering having it in the sitting room and linking it up with my TV, so came up with this after generally good reviews. Did have a few questions about it though – is it noticeably quieter than say, the Bitfenix Shinobi, which is a fair bit cheaper, and also supposed to be quite quiet? Has there been any word on an R4, considering the R3 has been out for a while? Also, has there been any new information on when the Corsair 550D or the Bitfenix Ghost are coming out? Finally, I only have carpets, is this reasonable to put a case on? The last computer I built didn’t have any intakes at the bottom but I see loads of cases do these days. If anyone does put it on their desk, is the R3 still generally inaudible?

    PSU:
    Corsair HX650 - Would like it to be modular just for neatness, so thought about this one. Honestly though, I don’t really know much about PSUs at all, and was wondering if 650W was perhaps slight overkill. Had a look at the recommended PSUs at the top of the forum but wasn’t really sure whether it was completely in date and whether newer ones had perhaps overtaken some of them. Probably won’t ever go for SLI or Crossfire really, just kind of thought a higher wattage would run quieter than one which just about made my requirements. I realize the fact I’m waiting before choosing a graphics card means this is a bit harder to help me with, but it’s almost certainly going to be a single card if that helps.

    CPU:
    i5 2500k - unless someone can convince me it really is worth waiting for Ivy Bridge? Ideally I will just wait for Ivy Bridge but if my laptop does die sooner, what do you think the resale value on a 2500k would be? Would I pretty much need to go for the retail over the OEM version? Is it even worth reselling it?

    Motherboard:
    No idea really. Saw there were Z77 ones out soon – what’s the difference between them and the Z68s? When I first started looking at parts a few months ago there were a few motherboards that said Gen3 ready or whatever, but am I right in saying that now lots of motherboards that were not previously Ivy Bridge compatible now are with a BIOS update? If so, what does the Gen3 part actually mean? And how important will PCI 3.0 be? Was very slightly leaning towards the Gigabyte GA-Z68XP-UD3P, but that’s just because it looks nice. Not that bothered about that however.

    CPU cooler:
    Gelid Tranquillo v2 – just heard generally good things about it really. Heard that it’s quieter than most – is it still after overclocking the i5 to say, 4.5GHz? Also, has anyone had any experience in using one in a Fractal R3? I can imagine that it might be slightly harder to cool in a case more aimed towards silence, and I was wondering whether the increased speed of the fan would mean that there would be no point in buying a silent case, if that makes sense. Also, is there any loss of lifespan to the processor when overclocking? I would like this computer to last about 5 years, with perhaps an upgrade to the GPU at most, so if there is a loss in lifespan I could just not overclock and go with a cheaper cooler or perhaps even the stock one.

    Storage:
    Crucial M4 128 GB–just thought I’d hold off getting a mechanical drive till the prices came down properly. Any alternatives to this drive? Seems to get a lot of good reviews but again, not sure if anything better has come out recently.

    Memory:
    Crucial Ballistix 2x4 GB 1600MHz – seems quite small and cheap. Not sure what else I should be looking for in RAM? Are big heatsinks really necessary? Would they interfere with the Tranquillo?

    Optical Drive:
    Cheapest DVD writer available at the time probably. Eventually might get a Blu-Ray reader – have these been going down noticeably in price? Is it worth me waiting a few months?

    Case fans:
    I did skim over that article on cooling the Fractal R3 a couple of weeks ago – I was just wondering if anyone else has tried adding a few extra fans and whether the opening of the vents made a noticeable difference in noise?

    Sound Card:
    Don't really know if it would be worth getting like a 20 quid Xonar DG. There's no way any motherboards could sound worse through my speakers than my current laptop but I'm not sure whether it would be worth stepping up to a cheap sound card.

    GPU:
    Probably just going to wait till April for this, just in case the 78xxs are good or Nvidia release something that isn’t stupidly overpriced. Otherwise I was probably going to get the 6950 2GB or the 560Ti 2GB (maybe the 448 core one?) unless there’s a big change in price in better cards over the next few months. How does that sound? My TV isn't as high resolution as some monitors nor with that fast a refresh rate but I would like my GPU to be reasonably future proof. Heard about some issues with AMD drivers, was wondering which of the two would be more likely to keep releasing updates a few years down the line?

    TV Tuner card:
    This isn’t totally definitely required, was just a vague thought as it might be nice to record TV onto my computer. Probably won’t get it till I get a mechanical hard drive however. Any advice on this would be great though!

    Sorry for the extremely long post! Much appreciated if you get this far and for any help.
     
  2. noizdaemon666

    noizdaemon666 I'm Od, Therefore I Pwn

    Joined:
    15 Jun 2010
    Posts:
    5,882
    Likes Received:
    652
    Wow that's like 3 posts in one it's that long lol

    Seems like a good build to me. I'd be tempted to get something more in the graphics department. Probably wait for Kepler if it isn't too long away, or like you said, a decent 7xxx AMD chip :)

    I seem to remember from the cooling article that opening vents on the R3 does let a fair bit of noise out. But ifyou're using fairly quiet parts (Tranquillo, aftermarket cooler on graphics card etc) then noise shouldn't be an issue with the vents open or closed.

    The HX650 is a very good choice and does give headroom for upgrades. I wouldn't particularly recommend lower given your budget is quite high. Plus, it will cover you no matter which GPU you buy really.

    The i5 2500K is an awesome chip. But as soon as IB hits the resale value will fall a fair bit. If you want IB, I'd try to hang on. Get the OEM versionof whichever since you're getting a separate cooler. As for lifespan, keep the vcore at 1.4V or under and it should last a fair few years.

    I've never heard of Z77 (I must Google it lol) but the PCI-E 3.0 spec doesn't add much at the minute. Though it may be worth having if you want to keept the board for a fair while as new graphics cards are going to use it. For current gen. cards it's useless though as they are only PCI-E 2 and can't saturate that let alone the higher bandwidth of 3.

    Excellent choice on SSD, not a lot of space though if that's all you're having. Though I guess if all you do is game it should be sufficient. I wouldn't switch it to anything else to be honest.

    GPU wise, don't get the 560Ti 448, get the 570 as it's very little more and is more powerful. Or as mentioned, wait for a new gen card.

    For the RAM big heatsinks aren't necessary, they're just there for aesthetics. As long as whichever you buy is 1.5V it will be fine. I personally like Corsair Vengeance. And I think the Tranquillo fouls only the first memory slot which would be ok with largeheatsinked monster RAM lol

    Just get the cheapest optical drive you can find, they're all the same thing. And prices haven't budged much in ages.

    And lastly, the sound card. I personally use on board sound and it's good enough for me. Others will advise to get something better like you've mentioned. I'd try onboard first and see, if audio isn't a matter of life or death to you, I'd go for onboard and then if needed, add a sound card.

    I'll quickly add it all up on Scan, I'm sure you could squeeze more power from your budget :)

    Edit: Put it together on Scan for you. Included a GTX570 and 16GB RAM :D Didn't include TV card or sound card as you seemed undecided on them.
     
    Last edited: 27 Feb 2012
  3. down18

    down18 What's a Dremel?

    Joined:
    27 Feb 2012
    Posts:
    34
    Likes Received:
    0
    Cheers mate, that's extremely helpful, thanks.

    Completely forgot about the free delivery bit-tech-scan thing, I could have probably split that post into a few! Oh well, I'm sure I'll get to 20 soon enough.

    A few questions about what you've said so far - what do you mean when you say an aftermarket cooler? Do you mean for example that cooler that's been stuck on that 570, or do you mean buying another one known for quietness or something?

    When you say you like the Corsair Vengeance, is that just aesthetically? Not really sure how much difference I'd notice in speed between two types of RAM, or how much I'm bothered about what they look like, so I was just planning on going for the cheapest shortish 2x4gb 1600 MHz that was available at the time really. Is there more to it than that? I've never bothered reading about timings, didn't think it was that important, but don't really know anything about it so happy to be told I'm wrong!

    A question about the graphics card I forgot to ask - how important is vRAM on a 1080p screen? Read some conflicting things, but I think the general consensus seems to be that at that resolution it's not that big a deal? 1.3GB would be fine?

    Just had a wee look at your spec, thanks very much for doing that!

    Just wondering am I likely to see any difference in having 16GB instead of 8GB RAM? I thought that for gaming you didn't really need all of 8GB in the first place, it was more for future proofing? And is the more expensive higher wattage PSU worthwhile? While I do have a budget of £1k I would like to save as much as I can and perhaps splash out on a mechanical keyboard as well hah.

    Thanks again for your help mate.
     
  4. aikidochris

    aikidochris What's a Dremel?

    Joined:
    28 Oct 2011
    Posts:
    66
    Likes Received:
    1
    Hey dude,

    I built my current rig which more or less meets your requirements exactly (as they were mine also) between christmas and new year, its all kinds of awesome, came to about £1000 all in from Scan including the Scansure insurance.

    See sig below........
     
  5. fdbh96

    fdbh96 What's a Dremel?

    Joined:
    29 May 2011
    Posts:
    1,894
    Likes Received:
    33
    Looks good.
    I have the r3 and in terms of cooling with stock fans, a gelid tranquilo, i5 stock speeds and a 460 the temps are fine. And its really quiet.

    However, 128gb is quite small (80gb usable after win7 install) and you mentioned that you want to listen to music/game. I would either recommend a 256gb one if thats your sole drive or add a normal hdd for storage.

    Having said that, i suppose you could just get the ssd then if you run out of room, get a hdd :)
     
  6. noizdaemon666

    noizdaemon666 I'm Od, Therefore I Pwn

    Joined:
    15 Jun 2010
    Posts:
    5,882
    Likes Received:
    652
    16GB RAM for gaming is completely unnecessary, I merely put it in as you said a £1000 budget. It will make it future proof but you could save ~£35 by dropping to 8GB. Again I put the higher wattage PSU in for future proofing. It would handle SLI/CrossFire more capably but if you're only ever having one graphics card, might as well stick to the cheaper HX650.

    VRAM isn't that much of an issue at 1920x1080, 1.3GB should suffice. true_gamer has said that at 2560x1600 BF3 uses 2.2GB vRAM so 1.3GB at 1920x1080 should be adequate.

    I like Vengeance because of aesthetics and also because it's a reputable firm, 1.5V and decent timings. 1600MHz RAM is the sweet spot at the minute, at 9, 9, 9, 24 timings that is. I have seen cheaper memory at 11, 11, 11, 32 which while not that much, does mean it isn't quite as fast response times wise. Any 1.5V 8GB kit of 1600 (PC3 12800 as is sometimes stated) with 9, 9, 9, 24 or less for timings will see you right.

    By aftermarket cooler I was referring to any cooler that doesn't ship with a CPU/GPU. So the 570 cooler isn't really aftermarket in that sense as it comes with the card, but it is a hell of a lot better than the reference cooler designed by nVidia. That's why I said get an OEM CPU as you'll be buying a separate cooler anyway :)

    Hope that helps. Now go do some posting :thumb:

    Edit: A quick note on RAM, the 1.5 I keep banging on about. It needs to be that or less, Sandy Bridge/Ivy Bridge are designed to use that voltage or less for RAM, any more could cause damage to the memory controller on the CPU.
     
  7. MrDomRocks

    MrDomRocks Modder

    Joined:
    5 Sep 2011
    Posts:
    5,063
    Likes Received:
    136
    Just want to add something regarding ssd. I own a corsair force 3 120gb after trim it went to 110gb windows 7 64 bit isn't 80gb at all id say under 50gb i have several games installed. Bf3, being one of the largest. 128gb M4 should do you fine for quite sometime. Though i have a storage drive for everything else. Could you budget for one maybe?
     
  8. ResCyn

    ResCyn What's a Dremel?

    Joined:
    23 May 2011
    Posts:
    97
    Likes Received:
    0
    Rig in sig runs with 2x Silent Eagle 1000s up front, CPU cooler at 850rpm and stock rear at 1000rpm. All vents are closed and temps idle at 26-30C and maxed at 58-62C across different cores. Admitedly there's only a 6870 in there and I'm not one to have my heating on constantly... but mine runs lovely and cool.
     
  9. Bede

    Bede Minimodder

    Joined:
    30 Sep 2007
    Posts:
    1,340
    Likes Received:
    40
    Air cooling: with regards to the components you've chosen, I'd suggest that extra fans are unnecessary, even in that case. I'd suggest trying the R3 with the stock fans; if the temperatures get too high then put extra fans in, but try normal before shelling out £30 on fans.

    CPU: Ivy Bridge has been pushed back to June (according to arstechnica) so really I'd just stick a 2500K in unless you're happy to wait a few months. If you did want to wait though, I think nvidia's 6-series graphics cards are timed to come out in April so a few good 3rd party cards would be out by June too probably - that could be a nice combination.

    Tbh though Intel aren't being pushed by AMD at the high end (hence why they can afford to push IB back so that they can clear SB stock) so I don't really expect anything ground-breaking from IB. The 2500K is a great chip and should last you years, especially with the ease of overclocking it.


    RAM: 8gb is perfect, by the time you'll need 16gb we will have moved on from DDR3 so there's no sense in trying to future-proof here. Low-profile Vengeance kits are nice (example) because they comfortably fit under 3rd party CPU heatsinks.
     
  10. Spanky

    Spanky Minimodder

    Joined:
    14 Apr 2010
    Posts:
    819
    Likes Received:
    106
    I wouldnt pay £270 for a 570 these days, id wait for Keplar.
     
  11. down18

    down18 What's a Dremel?

    Joined:
    27 Feb 2012
    Posts:
    34
    Likes Received:
    0
    noizdaemon666: Think I need to do a little more reading on RAM timings, I don't know much at all about it. About the CPU - has anyone had any experience of selling an OEM CPU without a cooler and whatever else comes in the box? Is it quite doable?

    MrDomRocks: Yeah I was considering buying a mechanical drive when the prices come down properly. Was wondering as well though, I own a 1.5tb Samsung Story station - has anyone had any experience of removing external hard drives from their enclosures and using them? Is it doable?

    ResCyn - How loud does your rig run? Have absolutely no idea about case fans really, how much did they cost, and how much difference do they make compared to the stock fans?

    Bede: Is it absolutely 100% confirmed that the non-mobile Ivy Bridge chips are delayed as well? I keep reading conflicting information, not sure what to really believe. Also, I didn't realise that the Vengeance RAM came in low-profile variants, might have a look at their prices over the next wee while and see if they go closer to £30.

    Spanky: Yeah, I was probably going to wait for Kepler just to see what happens with prices.

    Thanks again for all the replies. One more question that occurred to me is about the case - while I've been looking at the R3 and the upcoming 550d and Bitfenix Ghost, I'm also intrigued about the Silverstone RV-03. I realise it is a fair bit more expensive than the R3, but if I shave bits off my budget in other areas, how quietly does it run without the sound-dampening materials that other cases have? I've only read good things in reviews, just hoping for anyone's real-world experience.

    Cheers
     
  12. down18

    down18 What's a Dremel?

    Joined:
    27 Feb 2012
    Posts:
    34
    Likes Received:
    0
    Sooooo

    How does this look?

    http://www.scan.co.uk/savedbasket/40a5017467db41129efc263dc7b8882f
    (plus an optical drive, I forgot that)


    Not sure I can be bothered waiting for the new Kepler cards in my price range to come out, I could wait forever for better stuff. Anything there horrible wrong though that's worth changing? I was considering the 7850 or 7870 but they just don't seem worth it?
     
  13. MrDomRocks

    MrDomRocks Modder

    Joined:
    5 Sep 2011
    Posts:
    5,063
    Likes Received:
    136
    Looks good, but suggest maybe a 750w PSU by Corsair as 659w might be cutting it just a little Plus head room for overclocking etc

    Get the OEM i5 2500k no need for the intel hsf if using after market cooler.
     
  14. down18

    down18 What's a Dremel?

    Joined:
    27 Feb 2012
    Posts:
    34
    Likes Received:
    0
    Didn't notice I'd got the retail i5, cheers.

    I'm not that sure about the power supply though... I think it's enough, I used this http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp to try and calculate what I would need and got quite a lot more than I needed.

    Don't really know much about this though.
     
  15. MrDomRocks

    MrDomRocks Modder

    Joined:
    5 Sep 2011
    Posts:
    5,063
    Likes Received:
    136
    It's up to you, I went with a 750w PSU as it seemed logical as it's additional cost at the time was very small.

    I pretty much have the same build as you, different ram/case and a few other things.

    So it's down you dude.
     
  16. MightyBenihana

    MightyBenihana Do or do not, there is no try

    Joined:
    8 Sep 2011
    Posts:
    1,407
    Likes Received:
    78
    In terms of PSUs, if you really after a quiet build then have a look at a Corsair AX psu. They are a bit more expensive but the fan doesn't spin up at under 20% load so it is silent and they are top quality. But then again I can't remember how loud my old PSU was. Not very I think.
     
  17. noizdaemon666

    noizdaemon666 I'm Od, Therefore I Pwn

    Joined:
    15 Jun 2010
    Posts:
    5,882
    Likes Received:
    652
    I personally wouldn't change anything. A 650W PSU (which can do most of that over the 12V rails) such as the Corsair one you put in is more than adequate for that rig. You could probably even run it on a CX500. Computers in this price range don't tend to pull as much power as people think.
     
  18. down18

    down18 What's a Dremel?

    Joined:
    27 Feb 2012
    Posts:
    34
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hmm, I like the idea of silent under 20% load. How often with that bunch of components would a 650w Psu be under 20%? Or would I need to buy one with more wattage?

    Are there any other pretty good quality power supplies with that feature?
     
  19. noizdaemon666

    noizdaemon666 I'm Od, Therefore I Pwn

    Joined:
    15 Jun 2010
    Posts:
    5,882
    Likes Received:
    652
    To be honest, most PSUs now are basically silent anyway, even if the fan is spinning. I wouldn't bother trying to get under 20% load just so the fan doesn't spin. The GPU fan and CPU fan will be louder than the PSU fan.
     
  20. Da_Rude_Baboon

    Da_Rude_Baboon What the?

    Joined:
    28 Mar 2002
    Posts:
    4,082
    Likes Received:
    135
    If this is a living room PC and your not putting much hardware into it have you considered going mATX? If it was me I would buy a PCIe sound card as there is a fair chance the next time you upgrade PCI will be obsolete.
     

Share This Page