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Hardware Apple tries harder to prevent upgrades

Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by Claave, 16 May 2011.

  1. Yslen

    Yslen Lord of the Twenty-Seventh Circle

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    As if bolting an expensive IPS screen to a load of computer hardware that will be obscelete long before it needs replacing was not bad enough...
     
  2. impar

    impar Well-Known Member

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    Greetings!
    Its 1929€ (~£1703) here. The only thing going for it is the monitor and the looks.
     
  3. cool_dude

    cool_dude Active Member

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    Thats why i'll never buy a mac.

    Macs are great though, never go wrong.... hmm perhaps because you can't install half of the stuff you can install on a windows pc and hackers are targeting the most used o/s rather than a o/s used by a minority who think that Apple are doing them a favour feeling elite but really its pure daylight robbery.

    I do like their appearence tho, mind.
     
  4. Guinness

    Guinness New Member

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    you seem to misunderstand me veato, I'm not talking about what you paid. Comparing your discounted MAC to full price pc components is a little unfair.


    So at CURRENT RETAIL PRICES (to avoid confusion: the prices you can currently purchase these products at from Apple and Scan/Ebuyer/Overclocks etc), the iMac does NOT represent good value in a like-for-like comparison with a self build.
     
  5. veato

    veato I should be working

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    1. Your components aren't full price. You can shop around for the best prices. That on top of those components not being the original RRP anyway. The monitor alone used to cost over £700 when new.

    2. And what I paid is not an unusual discount. Education and work (perks) discounts are quite common
     
  6. Ergath

    Ergath Giant Zombie Pigeon Photographer

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    :) I love you too. Good choice of phone BTW.
     
  7. Guinness

    Guinness New Member

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    Full price? Thats how much they currently cost. RRP has nothing to do with it.


    I guess thats just another reason to self build! You cant shop around for a Mac!



    Common or not, you are still comparing trade/student discounted prices to retail prices including VAT. If average Joe wants a mac, he pays full wack (£1649 in the UK).

    So my statement stands: at CURRENT RETAIL PRICES (the prices you can
    currently purchase these products at from Apple and
    Scan/Ebuyer/Overclocks etc), the iMac does NOT represent good value in a
    like-for-like comparison with a self build.




    Before you attempt to pick more holes, lets get one thing clear... the two are actually incomparable! Your statement should have been:
    A heavily discounted, closed-off, un-upgradable, all-in-one iMac offers good value for money over a retail priced self build with similar but fundamentaly superior specs that is upgradable, customizable and can be repaired with off-the-shelf components.

    Like-for-like comparisons are almost impossible and kinda pointless. If you wanted an enthusiast level system that was good for overclocking and gaming you wouldnt have chosen a Mac, regardless of the supposed cost saving!
     
  8. veato

    veato I should be working

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    In obtaining best value FOR ME how do I not take into account where I can buy something from and if/how I can get any discount?? That's ridiculous. If I'm doing a comparison to determine whether I can get value from a Mac compared to a self build I absolutely have to get the best pricing for both types.

    You claim they're not comparable too be for me they absolutely are. In needing a modern, large monitor, light gaming use PC I have compared a self build to an all-in-one in terms of specs and cost. Just because one isn't upgradable over the over does not mean they don't compare in other areas. Once costings are done I can compare the amount of RAM, the CPU, the quality and specs of the monitor, etc etc. Yes self build gets a tick for upgradability and Mac got a tick for silent and space saving but their fundamental differences does not mean they cannot be compared to fit my needs.

    "If you wanted an enthusiast level system that was good for overclocking and gaming you wouldnt have chosen a Mac" --- Huh? What's your point? I chose a system based on price and specifications (with the monitor being the most important). Even without overclocking and gaming (although I do like the odd PC game) I still need a fairly powerful system.
     
  9. Guinness

    Guinness New Member

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    I'm not talking about you. As I said, the fact that you got it cheap is great.....for you. If average Joe wants one, a pc self build offers more value for money. Not least because Joe could upgrade, saving the cost of a whole new system.
     
  10. Guinness

    Guinness New Member

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    I'm not talking about you. As I said, the fact that you got it cheap is great.....for you. If average Joe wants one, a pc self build offers more value for money. Not least because Joe could upgrade, saving the cost of a whole new system.
     
  11. Guinness

    Guinness New Member

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    And of course you can compare them to determine which best suits your needs. Just like you could compare a Dyson and a microwave to determine which is best at picking up dust from your carpet.

    You can't build an exact equivalent of an iMac (an un-upgradeable mix of laptop and desktop components built into the back of a monitor) so direct comparisons for determining value for money Re pointless.

    You can dismiss it all you want, but the fact that a pc is upgradeable adds real monetary value.
     
  12. veato

    veato I should be working

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    From your point of view!! Yet you ignore the 'added value' of buying Apple! It's ignorance. And your insistence to speak for 'average joe'. How do you know what the average consumer wants? You're approaching this from a one sided view of the gamer/enthusiast/overclocker and not the 'average joe'.
     
  13. impar

    impar Well-Known Member

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    Greetings!
    You forgot to put the "Its beautiful!".
     
  14. faugusztin

    faugusztin I *am* the guy with two left hands

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    Average Joe buys the €400-500 laptop, he doesn't buy a €800 PC, not even talking about €1000+ Macbook, €1200+ iMac.
     
  15. Guinness

    Guinness New Member

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    Calm down dear!

    You know you're right. But take a look at where we are. You're on an
    Enthusiast website! The front page is full of component reviews which
    mean little to the average Mac user.

    "SSD review anyone?"  
    "No point thanks, I have to buy from Apple at a premium"

    ^^^the whole point of this article!


    If I were to approach this from a true gamer/enthusiast/overclocker
    stand point then things get worse for the Mac:
    Gaming at 2560x1440 on OS X with a 6970m, a 3.1GHz stock quad, no
    overclocking, no customization, no modding, no dedicated sounds card,
    built in speakers, poor cooling, a laptop-style Alu keyboard, no gaming
    mouse, no upgrade prospects and it will cost me more money??? Not for
    me, ta.

    And you've kind of just made my point about the two not really being
    comparable. They are designed for different end-users.

    Buy an iMac because you like it/you dont want to self build/you cant
    self build/it better suits your needs/you've got so much money it doesnt
    really matter. No one will care. But suggest an iMac represents good
    value against a self build on an enthusiast/overclocking website? Nope.
     
  16. Guinness

    Guinness New Member

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    True. But average Joe reading bittech? Could be a different story.
     
  17. Ninja_182

    Ninja_182 Enginerd!

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    I think its all rooted in Apple wanting to keep their 'reliability' reputation in their own hands. If they keep people's hands out of hardware, they wont have people reporting problems caused by bungled upgrades as 'unreliable Apple hardware'.

    Incoming car analogy:
    Bungle modifying your engine, engine blows up, hurr durr engine is made of cheese. No it isn't, you just did a bad job and broke it. The same applies to anything more complicated than a hair dryer.
     
  18. wuyanxu

    wuyanxu still wants Homeworld 3

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    speaking of Apple:
    http://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/apple-to-support-reps-do-not-attempt-to-remove-malware/3362

    basically: Jobs said our computer is perfect, if there are any customer get infected, keep them in the dark and keep them away from retail stores so we can sell more style-over-function Mac computers.
     
  19. azrael-

    azrael- I'm special...

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    Sorry... I'll get my coat... :)
     
  20. impar

    impar Well-Known Member

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    Greetings!
     
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