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News Apple's new MacBook Pro blocks upgrades

Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by brumgrunt, 14 Jun 2012.

  1. Guinevere

    Guinevere Mega Mom

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  2. Guinevere

    Guinevere Mega Mom

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    No slots, it's all soldered in. The non retina MBPs are different though and comparable to the older models by using SODIMMS.

    The RMBP is like the Air, RAM is a "choose wisely" BTO option. Either get the 16GB upgrade now or forever hold your piece.

    Personally I think they should have put RAM on a daughter board like they have done with flash, but I'd imagine given they're now using much faster RAM that would have some technical issues.
     
  3. Unicorn

    Unicorn Uniform November India

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    This is one of those times that poor spelling or grammar can make a sentence or phrase sound like something completely different to what you actually meant. Rather than letting you continue to spell it so that it sounds like a naughty double entendre, I'll correct you. It's actually "Forever hold your peace" :thumb:

    I'm still not convinced about this. Yes, if I was going to buy a new RMBP I would be more inclined to go for a higher spec one because of the inability to upgrade them, but the fact that I find it moronic that Apple have decided to start manufacturing non-upgradeable MBPs in itself means that I won't be buying one now. If and when I do ever buy one, it will more than likely be a late 2011 - early 2012 model which I can still put third party SODIMMs and a larger SSD in after purchase.

    Despite what it will mean for their sales (let's face it, Apple are never going to release a product that won't sell. It's just not going to happen) every single tech website on the planet has an article about how the new RMBP is not upgradeable, not repairable and not even as recyclable as the old version. This article from Wired has an in depth look at the new machines "shortcomings". Not an article about how amazing and advanced their shiny new product is, oh no! An article about what's controversial about its design. I think this is a huge mistake for Apple. I haven't seen as much bad press about a new Apple product since the first generation iPad was released with a body that was 1/3 empty and had more than enough space for a camera.
     
    Last edited: 15 Jun 2012
  4. kenco_uk

    kenco_uk I unsuccessfully then tried again

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    The screen does look quite lovely, but the premium on it is incredible. The perceived value can be called into question with saved manufacturing costs not having much bearing on the end cost, i.e. the so-called savings haven't exactly been passed down to the consumer level.

    An iPad was £429 on release day. How much is an iPad3 with it's A5X and Retina screen? Not much difference, eh?
     
  5. amnesia182

    amnesia182 New Member

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    Sorry, just had to register to point out that it's different FROM, not different TO :p
    If you're going to rip someone else's grammar apart...


    Anyway, back on topic... I applaud Apple for bringing out a cutting edge machine with an awesome screen resolution, but their habit of charging £25 for (cheap) adapters because they omit standard sockets like ethernet or firewire ports really gets my goat.

    Apparently, the new model has a different power connector too, so you can't even re-use an old one as a spare if you use your laptop in multiple places.

    How long will 512Gb storage last when we're all watching QFHD videos to make use of the 5 million pixel screen ?
     
  6. Mosquito

    Mosquito Active Member

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    probably because I spent like 30 minutes typing that up between working on things :lol:

    Fair enough, I guess I have to stop thinking of Macs as a general computer company and keep reminding myself that they're more specialized and directed toward a specific market, one that I'm not in.
     
  7. azrael-

    azrael- I'm special...

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    As has been mentioned previously "what if one or more of those hardwired components fail...?"

    This is typically Apple ...or at least Apple, since Jobs took back the reins. And for some reason the Apple apologetics keep finding reasons why these "lock-in" moves are actually great for the consumer.
     
    Last edited: 15 Jun 2012
  8. Unicorn

    Unicorn Uniform November India

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    I know, and the thing is that component prices are starting to move back to normal again (only just, mind). They won't pass any lower manufacturing cost down to the consumer, it's not their style. And let's face it, Apple don't need to be making any more money. They want to and they will, but if their profits stayed exactly the same for the next 5 years as they were in '11-'12 they'd still swallow up each and every one of their rivals in profits and sales. I know it's a stupid and redundant argument, but they're starting to get too greedy for their own good.

    The more and more I think about this, the more I can see nothing but greed behind it. I personally don't think it's about the more advanced technology in this one. The retina display, you say? That's an excuse. We knew that was coming to MBP this quarter. It's the perfect catch 22 for their customers - Pay more for overpriced over the counter upgrades with the machine (in other words a high spec RMBP) to get the "new thing" (retina display) or get a "plain old" standard MBP that they can upgrade in the future and potentially service and repair for less. In a lot of ways it's sneaky and underhanded. As Wired said, Apple have "split the baby" with two versions of the MBP now on the market - something Steve as much said they were avoiding with the introduction of the unibody aluminium MBPs at release.

    I just don't like the fact that with the Air, they tested the waters of no user upgradeability, with the iPad and iPhone 4 they tested the waters of expensive repair parts with glued, laminated display assemblies and they're now testing the water with two MBPs. You do realize that if the RMBP outsells the standard MBP in the next 12 months, all Apple notebooks are likely to follow suit? Next year could see the elimination of the current unibody MBP from their product line.
     
  9. Horizon

    Horizon Dremel Worthy

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    I know about MXM very well and it's not a socket, I have a 5870M sitting right here on my desk. An MXM is a interface similar to PCI in which a MXM Graphics module laptop equivalent of a graphics card.
     
  10. Unicorn

    Unicorn Uniform November India

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    Horizon, do you often argue with your shadow?

    Wait, is that black cat white?!

    NO. WAY! The sky is green :eeek:

    [​IMG]

    Newsflash: a PCI slot is a socket :rolleyes:

    Further reading: I'm sick of hearing all this slot vs socket crap. It's a pile of bull****. PCI and RAM "slots" are sockets. They are physical housings for supporting a daughterboard or expansion card with electrical contacts inside them. SOCKET. I know there used to be CPU "slots" but it's time the industry woke up and called a spade a spade. A socket and a slot serve the same purpose and are two versions of the same thing. If anything, a slot is another type of socket, but it's still a socket.
     
    Last edited: 15 Jun 2012
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  11. Horizon

    Horizon Dremel Worthy

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    one connects a board to another board, the other connects a chip to a board, just sayin.
     
  12. Bakes

    Bakes New Member

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    Fair point. I guess I just assumed they'd gone away at some point in the last five years. Nevertheless, I think you can probably see how processor upgrades might not be so desired for laptops - especially since the processor in my MBP currently sells on Scan for £430 - it's just not that cost effective. When processors are basically unique for each model, keeping them for repairs could (with something like the macbook retina) quickly become as costly as just stocking logic boards for common models, especially since with the logic board, you could fix the whole thing by changing one part and let Apple worry about the rest.
     
  13. Nexxo

    Nexxo Queue Jumper

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    Both versions are acceptable. Different from tends to be used in American English. Different to tends to be preferred in classical English. Your smartass-fu is weak. :)
     
  14. kenco_uk

    kenco_uk I unsuccessfully then tried again

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    It makes sense to solder the cpu to the motherboard, I can see the sense in that. It ensures the notebook operates within tolerances. The heatpipe and cooling fan array are designed as such to keep whichever cpu within operating temperatures. Yes, yes, that's all fair enough.

    It seems daft to cut off your nose to spite your foot though. Removing the ability to sell ram and/or ssd upgrades, but potentially costing a bucketload if there just so happens to be a faulty batch of ram modules, that get past stringent QC checks, which are soldered to the logic board. I assume from the stripdown that the ssd is proprietary? It looks to use a msata socket/slot (pick whichever, horizon lol).

    To look at the innards, well.. it is a work of art make no mistake, an engineering feat to squish all that into such a confined space. Apple do know how to make something look nice and desirable and they certainly have the marketing prowess. They'll have to work this one bloody hard though.
     
  15. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    Apple will soon have competition. A small company in the U.S called Vizio, which started making cheap TV's, and soon after affordable TV with amazing features that worked very well., and well reviewed. They got in the market with the help of Best Buy and Walmart. They are now, since CES that just past, making high end laptop a-la-Apple. Compete with design, attention to details everywhere, 0 junk (Microsoft Signature Windows 7 (and later 8) included (that means Windows, drivers with no bloat, Live Essential, Microsoft Security Essential. That is all), also have a good touchpad, did I mention Nvidia Kepler GPU? Well they are equipped with one. Good keyboard, engineering in the U.S, good screen with acceptable resolution, Oh and no stickers, anywhere. Even the power adapter plug looks nice. Not bad for a first laptop from a company.

    Check it out, there is even a nice interview video:
    http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/15/3076519/vizio-reboot-pc-american-hdtv-success-do-it-again

    I hope they succeed. Because that we need competition and innovation on the PC market, and I think the current PC manufactures are acting like if Apple is "not a PC" so it doesn't concern them.
     
    Last edited: 16 Jun 2012
  16. Guinevere

    Guinevere Mega Mom

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    You are under the incorrect impression that I wasn't aware of this word transposition.
     
  17. Guinevere

    Guinevere Mega Mom

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    I've read the reports on them, and they do look good. It will be interesting to see how they fair in being able to obtain parts and in distribution - two areas where Apple have the market locked up pretty tight.

    The designs (Desktop trackpad etc) are definitely inspired by Apple without being a 1:1 (Samsung style) copy... may 0.9:1 or something...

    And they're doing the right thing by going Windows Signature rather than try and make another few $ on each sale by allowing 3rd party bloatware trials to trash the experience.

    The maximum specs are a bit lower than Apple though. Slower CPUs. Slower GPUs. No SSD. Less RAM. Shorter battery life. Poorer connectivity. Lower res screen (But still IPS). Lower spec speakers

    But...

    I'd wager they'll be half the price and for someone who doesn't 100% need to run OSX they'll likely be good enough with maybe the potential to do DIY RAM/SSD upgrade... nice just not the very very best.
     
  18. Gunsmith

    Gunsmith Maximum Win

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    beautiful
     
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  19. Guinevere

    Guinevere Mega Mom

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    Not without spending £9.

    http://bit.ly/Mei80u

    Well done to Apple for being bold enough to improve on something even if doing so is a very slight inconvenience to a few people.

    The new connection means the machine can be slimmer and the size change means the socket cant grab hold of a USB cable like the old one could (never had that problem myself - but was apparently an issue for some).

    Slimmer = Better (And more marketable!)

    The needs of the many... outweigh the needs of the few
     
  20. Nexxo

    Nexxo Queue Jumper

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    I think it's the most exciting thing to happen in the computer industry right now. But it wouldn't have happened if it weren't for Apple. Apple turned computers from office tools into lifestyle products (like Sony turned game consoles from teenage toys into lifestyle products). We wouldn't have those nice perforated aluminium Lian-Li cases without the Mac Pro cheese grater. We wouldn't have Android phones and tablets without Apple iPhone and iPad. We wouldn't have Microsoft upping the ante with Windows Phone 7 and Windows 8 without OSX and iOS.

    I think it is rather ironic to see Vizio extolling the virtues of the same design principles on their laptop that Apple gets criticised for on theirs: no exchangeable batteries; proprietary non-expandable components. Apple is dead; long live the new Apple.
     
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