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Cooling Best price/quality equipment?

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by relix, 29 Jan 2003.

  1. relix

    relix Minimodder

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    (it really, REALLY becomes time Bit-Tech does something with wc-stuff!)

    Okay, I wanna built a wc-system for my next PC, but I don't have too much money to spent so I don't want things I'll never use.

    I think I want to spent about €/$250 for a pump, a rad, a CPU-block and maybe a VGA-block and/or a reservoir...

    What are the suggestions? I don't know if I'll ever would like to upgrade the system, like add a chipset-block or so, but the rad should at least be capable of cooling the CPU and the VGA-card. I was thinking of a BIX, a BIX2, a BIM, a BIM2 or what about a BIP or BIP2?

    I dunno, I want silence, so I think the BIM's are out of the question (80mm fans make more noise than 120mm with the same cfm, right?). I think a rad with place for 2 (4, on each side 2) fans is overkill for the things I want to cool, so that leaves me with a BIX or a BIP. Probably a BIX then?

    Anyway, just tell me what you think and stuff, I still can't make up my mind (if I'd use a BIX/P/M 2, I could slow the fans down even more? And I'd be able to overclock more...but they also cost a bit more...and stuff..argh!)


    Thanks! :D

    (it's so hard spending money if you don't have lots of it...:miffed: )
     
  2. ernie

    ernie What's a Dremel?

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    i would be interested in the answers too...
     
  3. Haddy

    Haddy World Domination

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    Well let us know the parts you are looking at, and we can pretty much tell you the better of them.....

    Personaly I like d-tek blocks and danger den block for both cpu and gpu cooling *in that order*....

    Ehiem pumps are perfect, espcially the cheaper models that are out now.....

    Radiator....I would go with a regular heatercore if you have the room *spified up to look good* or a black ice micro with a couple quiet 80mm fans....

    Resivors are not needed, i think alot of people have this misconception that you must have one in your loop...Its just not true. Mostly a RESIVOR is looks, as were a AIRTRAP is for both looks and techincal use...Airtraps get air out of you loop easily, if they are set up properly *air = less heatexchange espcially if air is inside your block*....

    Well i think that pretty much sums up my personal openions....

    I made up a whole kit @ dd for $169.00 *minus shipping* that included:

     
  4. relix

    relix Minimodder

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    Nice, thanks :D

    does a heatercore has the same performance as a BI Micro?

    I think I'm gonna go for a BIM2...it's only $9 more than a BIM, and probably has better performance, right? It's still even cheaper than a BIX!

    ...wait, what has the better performance? a BIM2 or a BI Pro 2? They cost almost the same...


    mmmmm, okay, here's what I have in mind:

    a BIP2 or a BIM2: $65
    a CPU block: around $50
    a VGA block: around $30
    a Eheim-Fake pump: $25
    Artic Silver 3: $08
    2x Papst 120mm: 2x $17

    equals: $217...damn wc is expensive
    :wallbash: :wallbash: :waah:


    I actually just want to have a silent PC, overclocking isn't really "my cup of tea", but it's always nice if I can overclock a little :D. You think any changes should be made to the above setup? Like, if the fake-eheim pump won't burnout or something? (it's the same one like on the DD-page, the cheaper ones, but not the eheim-ones)
     
  5. Haddy

    Haddy World Domination

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    A heatercore shoud preform up there with a BI Extreme

    Not sure about that...Depnding on the fan it would probably be a toss up....

    Now dont forget the bim2 uses 80mm fans not 120.....I havent seen much on these new hyrdo pumps but you can usualy trust dd stuff...
     
  6. 8-BALL

    8-BALL Theory would dictate.....

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    From all of the watercooling forums I have read, heater cores perform better than all of the Black ice range, and they have a huge following with hardcore water coolers. However, they are butt ugly, which cannot be said for a chromed black ice extreme.

    So it boils down to what you want. If you want the best performance, get a heatercore. If you are willing to sacrifice some of this performance, in exchange for the convenience of perfect fan mounting holes and correct hose fittings, good looks, as well as a bigger hit to your wallet, then you will be wanting one of the black ice extreme range.

    The black ice micros are great if you're short of space, but you really need 2 of them for adequate performce if you're wanting to cool the cpu and gpu with undervolted fans (for silence) as well as the ability to overclock.

    Also, don't skimp on the pump. If this fails, you're in trouble, although this doesn't happen that often. Remember, the efficiency of all heat exchangers (including radiators) increases with increasing flow rate, to a point of diminishing results, where you're having to use such a large pump, that it will begin to put more heat into the water than the extra flow rate can remove.

    Another point worth noting, is that for silence, a 120mm fan will have a lower pitch hum rather than a whine associated with 60-80mm fans. This is much less offensive to the ears, even at equivalent volumes.

    As such, I would go for a Black Ice extreme over any of the others, (bar the BIX2, though this is expensive). Also, 2 120mm fans at 7V will probably be quiter than a single one at 12V. yet a BIX with a 7V fan on either side in a push pull configuration will perform well due to the increased static pressure.

    If you are after silence, I would also consider getting a passive heatpipe heatsink for your graphics card. Just as effective and will allow your watercooling to work more efficiently at cooling just your cpu.

    I know this is probably getting a little expensive, but high performance twinned with silence will always be expensive, particularly if you want reliability as well.

    I hope this has been useful

    8-ball
     
  7. Haddy

    Haddy World Domination

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    This is true....Although i havent seen much overclocking tests on them...
     
  8. 8-BALL

    8-BALL Theory would dictate.....

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    I'll try and find some reviews, but from what I can remember, they work surprisingly well.

    8-ball
     
  9. relix

    relix Minimodder

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    Haddy and 8-Ball, thanks very much for the info :D

    8-Ball: I don't see how the setup you're advicing is more expensive than the one I was looking into? A heatercore is at most half the price of a BIX and the passive (zalman) cooler for VGA-cards cost as much as a VGA-waterblock.

    So, I'm gonna get this stuff: a H80A (review on bit-tech :p), a heatercore or BIX, and some CPU block (thinking of the DD3 with copper top...not sure yet, so many contenders nowadays :D)

    I'll have to decide on the pump yet...
     
  10. Penguin4x4

    Penguin4x4 What's a Dremel?

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    Ya forgot the tubing, fittings, and clamps.:hehe::worried::p:rolleyes:

    Hydor is an Italian OEM manufacturer of pumps for US Companies like Little Giant for a long time. The L20 and L30 perform the exact same as Eheim's 1048 and 1250, respectively.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    A heater core would be the best cooling choice. Yes they may look a little ass, but we are after all at the bit tech forums; don't tell me we are afraid of a little painting!?:hehe: :hehe:
     
    Last edited: 31 Jan 2003
  11. Trebor95

    Trebor95 What's a Dremel?

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    hey there :)

    I tend not to go with lucite/plexi topped waterblocks after having seen and heard horro stories ;)

    imho (h = humble)

    as has been said Heatercore's are amazing, I got mine for £10 and performs many times more effectively than my old DD coolrcore :) I hated that thing. You can get them looking quite good :) I dressed mine up in a shoe box

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    I have an Eheim pump (1250) but again the other pumps should be fine. I was new to watercooling when I bought mine so went with the tried and trusted manufacturer (of the people I knew who had already watercooled)

    Waterblock, I have the Little River "White Water" block

    I would suggest anything from OCPC, DD, Swiftech for waterblocks, however I have only ever owned the Maze 2-1 previously.

    for VGA block, the DD Z-blocks are popular and fans :0 I found either a Panaflo H1a or L1a or some sort of industrial fan is best :) industrial in the fact that they are very quiet and put out huge CFM - but generally are limited to rad boxes. Most 120mm fans are ok as long as they arent generic :) you need something with a bit of "kick" to create a pressure gradient through the rad.

    A shroud over the rad is also a very good idea, as has probably already been said as it maximises the rad's surface area :)

    reservoir, not neccesary but easy to fill and usually self bleeding, have it above the pump and it'll almost be self priming as well as acting as air trap :) you can make one out of a tupperware box and stick some barbs in and seal it up nice and good with marine epoxy etc. :)

    other pumps are Maxijet/Rio or something to that effect or the new Eheim compacts iirc, they are meant to be run submerged only but with a little modding make perfectly good inline pumps :)

    hth
     
  12. Haddy

    Haddy World Domination

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    Only because people tend to abuse them a lil....They are best with poly barbs....Which is gonna bend/break first brass or plexi?
     
  13. [DE]FreD_S

    [DE]FreD_S Certified Specialist of Awesomeness

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    Go for an OCPC Atlantis or DD Maze 3 if you want quality and cooling power ... haven't had a maze 3 but I'm running an Atlantis with a Black Ice Extreme 2 and it's a mean mofo combination ... and silent ! Anyone else here able to read out AMD on-die diode temps with MBM ? Whatcha got ?

    Cheers

    [DE]FreD_S
     
  14. Trebor95

    Trebor95 What's a Dremel?

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    ahh, right :) like I said I dont have any experience with the plexi tops/barbs so really .... I was talking rubbish :)
     
  15. Penguin4x4

    Penguin4x4 What's a Dremel?

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    http://www.overclockers.com/articles683/

    http://www.liquidninjas.com/reviews.php?op=showcontent&id=17

    http://www.overclockersclub.com/dangerdencustomwatercoolingkitreview.php

    :)
     
  16. Blackeagle

    Blackeagle What's a Dremel?

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    I'll offer two bits.

    Pump = Iwaki MD-15r This pump has nearly double the pressure rate to the Ehiem 1250, and will outlast it.

    Block = TC-4 Will outperform the maze 3 and the Atlantis

    The pump above is most likly more than you wish to pay. But very, very good.

    The TC-4 however is higher performing than most other blocks, White Water will beat it, but that is about it for commercial blocks.

    At www.procooling.com they have a posted heater core data base. You type in the size core you need for a system and it spits out options. And heater cores will outperform all the DD "made for watercooling" stuff.
     
  17. [DE]FreD_S

    [DE]FreD_S Certified Specialist of Awesomeness

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    Got any links to that White Water block ?

    Cheers

    [DE]FreD_S
     
  18. Blackeagle

    Blackeagle What's a Dremel?

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    Here is the only site I know of that has them in the states.

    www.jpiperformance.com

    Looking at the disclaimer they have makes you wonder if his other job is as a lawyer.

    But this site has the highest performing watercooling kit on the commercial market right now. He also carrys the TC-4 CPU block from Dtek performance.
     
    Last edited: 4 Feb 2003
  19. relix

    relix Minimodder

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    just decided I'll wait a bit with watercooling, unless I can find some cheap secondhand or something. I'm first gonna build me a new PC, and if I have enough money left I'll prolly buy wc...

    still, thanks all :)
     
  20. Haddy

    Haddy World Domination

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    Link no good?
     
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