Motors Bit-Tech F1 2018 thread - Season Over

Discussion in 'General' started by RedFlames, 26 Nov 2017.

  1. Wakka

    Wakka Yo, eat this, ya?

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    My thoughts:

    Mercedes - Lewis did all he could, from the start to opening up a buffer to Kimi in the first stint. I'm sure he'll be annoyed with the result, but he'll also remember what happened last year and how that turned out. Bottas was woeful, frankly. I've been vocal in my feelings towards him in the past (he was flattered against Massa - doesn't have the drive that wins championships imo), but to bin that car in the first qualifying session of the year, then spend half the race stuck behind a Force India was a shocker... Now, I know it's not easy to pass at Albert Park, but when you're in comfortably the fastest car on the grid, up again a car that hasn't even fully figured out it's package, it's harder to justify (if he was in a McLaren or RBR with some power deficit, I could forgive him).

    Ferrari - Kimi probably knows he only has that drive because Vettel OK'd it on preferential treatment basis, so he can't grumble that he finished behind him. See spoilers above and add a +1 for my opinions.

    RBR - Max was ragged today, which isn't nice to see so early in the season. He needs to keep an eye on the big picture on circuits like this. Danny did good to finish where he did, considering his starting position. Good early move on the Renault... But we still don't have an Aussie on the home podium! I was properly rooting for him when he kept getting close on 1st DRS zone, but that Ferrari just had those couple of extra horses.

    McLaren - Fernando said he'd get 5th, Fernando got 5th. Good start, kept up with the leading pack well enough and good defence against Max at the end. Stoffel was typically anonymous - that boy needs a stand-out performance or 2 this season, or he's gonna go the way of Perez and Magnussen.

    HAAS - Wow... I mean, that's gotta be an early contender for fail of the season. Shame, as K-Mag had a great start and was looking solid in his position. When Grosjean also stopped I started to get suspicious that the rear left wheel man was a mole planted by Alonso. Probably HAAS's best shot at a decent double points finish flushed down the toilet.

    Renault - Not much to report really. It's still clear they are just following the plan they laid down from the beginning. Solid, no frills race from Hulk, Sainz started getting scruffy towards the end.

    Force India - Need to get this car working properly sharpish, otherwise they are going to quickly be left behind by Renault and McLaren. With the double HAAS retirement, they'll get a bit of breathing space later in the year as they inevitably run out of development steam, and I reckon they'll be safe from Sauber, Torro Rosso and Williams.

    Williams - Ummm, they were there?

    Torro Rosso - Someone must be sweating... and not because of the Australia sun. Out in Q1, slow in the race, an engine blown already? Business as normal at Honda!

    Sauber - I'm no aerodynamicist, but the more I see of the Sauber, the more it just looks like a lot of ideas chucked together in the most ugly and inefficient way. The time sheets don't lie, that car is a dog. Shame, as they probably have a better driver line-up than Torro Rosso, definitely better than Williams, but I reckon the white car will be taking the back row for most Sunday's - unless they can strike a HAAS-like deal with Ferrari.
     
  2. fix-the-spade

    fix-the-spade Multimodder

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    Merc/Ferrari/RB - Normal service continues. I still expect to see a smiling Australian in a silver suit next year.

    Mclaren - Vindicated, still not as fast as Red Bull, but close enough that Max having a Minor Maldonado Moment put Fernando ahead. They are going to have their best year in ages.

    Renault/FI - The battle for fourth, until/unless Mclaren get on top of the chassis.

    Williams - Sooner or later they will be getting Pole and I don't mean the grid position.

    Toro Rosso - Must have felt mighty pleased with themselves when they got through all of testing with just one Honda engine. Must have felt much less pleased when they found out they were using that one engine for the whole season too.

    Sauber - I expect them to move ahead of STR once they get some updates, the Alfa deal came late last year and parts/know how will be on the way.

    Haas - They had better do better from now on. Once Renault, FI, Mclaren and Sauber start getting upgrades they will be getting shunted down the grid, upgrades being Haas major weakness last year and the year before.
     
  3. David

    David μoʍ ɼouმ qᴉq λon ƨbԍuq ϝʁλᴉuმ ϝo ʁԍɑq ϝμᴉƨ

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    I understand the mechanics, and I can do the maths - who said anything about closing the pits during VSC?

    A screamingly obvious change would be to govern pit-in and pit-out speeds under VSC conditions. Not the pit lane speed limit, just the pit-in and pit-out.
     
  4. faugusztin

    faugusztin I *am* the guy with two left hands

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    But the time he gained was not due pit-in and pit-out speed, it was because Hamilton was forced to be slower. So unless you closed the pits, Vettel would have still came out in front.
     
  5. David

    David μoʍ ɼouმ qᴉq λon ƨbԍuq ϝʁλᴉuმ ϝo ʁԍɑq ϝμᴉƨ

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    Were you watching? He only just made it out in front. Governing pit-in and pit-out speeds would have prevented it.
     
  6. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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    As David said, enforcing VSC speed limits on pit entry/exit [currently you're only bound by the limits while 'on track' iirc] would've cleared up any uncertainty.

    Observations...

    Might be a driver sack race going on... there's a few drivers where i'm not sure they'll be there at season's end.
    Cars still can't follow/overtake really.
    Not sure how today could've gone any worse for Haas.
    Renault's customer teams seem to be having a better time than Merc's customer teams.
    Engine penalties: not if, but when... [also take bets on how soon STR have one].
    **** Halo... **** the halo too... That camera placement cluterfuck could and should have been spotted from miles away.
     
  7. Anfield

    Anfield Multimodder

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    That could be avoided by having a min pit stop time applied while under VSC, think of tracks with comically short pit lanes (ok, mostly talking Canada) what are we going to see there if a VSC happens? Everyone going to pit for the sake of saving time?
     
  8. BentAnat

    BentAnat Software Dev

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    Observations:

    McLaren got outqualified by Haas. Their positions, admittedly at Albert Park, are not as easily won as that. I expect a bit more fight from Haas making McLaren's life a bit trickier going forward.

    Haas was surprising to me. I WANTED to see them fight at the upper end of the midfield, but didn't really expect it. Shame about the McLaren man at the rear. Günther Steiner seemed properly heartbroken when the second car retired.

    The Honda Engine is still down on power. Hartley saying "it just switched off" is not super positive... But who knows... it was reliable in practice.

    Merc are still the team to beat. Bottas binning it like that won't do him any favours in the championship. As I have it, this means he's got replacement parts on his engine already. The lost lead, I would say Toto is right... a mistake in the prediction software. Had the software been correct, Lewis would have driven to a reduced window to Vettel. We know the merc COULD.

    The RBR was not as able to fight as I had expected, but that's also the track having its effect.

    The visible pattern was that cars got within 0.8-0.9 seconds relatively easily, and then they stayed there.
    Even the third DRS zone did next to nothing there.

    One thing I DID like was some of the new visuals on the broadcast, although I will admit that I was half expecting a "Pepsi" or "Brought to you by burger king" flashing across some of the overlays.
     
  9. David

    David μoʍ ɼouმ qᴉq λon ƨbԍuq ϝʁλᴉuმ ϝo ʁԍɑq ϝμᴉƨ

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    iirc Haas had a storming start last year, but they faded damn fast due to lack of upgrades.

    You mean Gasly? Hartley finished the race, albeit a lap down.

    Bottas was anonymous throughout - I didn't even realise he made it into the points until after the race ended.

    Ricciardo looked up for it, but Max was impatient and almost reckless.

    I'm not going to take too much from this race as Albert Park is a bit of a pig for overtaking (unless you're Alonso or Ricciardo) - seriously, three DRS zones though?
     
  10. BentAnat

    BentAnat Software Dev

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    Yes, I mean Gasly... thanks for pointing that out.
    Haas did have a great start and fizzled through the year, but I'd sya they have reason to be cautiously optimistic.

    Albert Park is always a bit of a difficult one. It's not much of anything, really.

    Also - glad to see that Helmut Marko started the butthurt early this year.
     
  11. javaman

    javaman May irritate Eyes

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    I don't begrudge Vettel his win cause that's racing. VSC and safety car have wrecked many a pit window but its all part of it.

    If anything the issue show cased several issues F1 still hasn't dealt with. Over reliance on aero, tires that don't go off and cars that aren't being pushed to that ragged edge

    Bottas and Verstappen both made mistakes pushing and paid for it. Their mistake wasnt lack of skill but ultimately pushing too close to the edge and getting thrown a small variable ie. The dirt surrounding the kerb that caused them to bin it. Any other circuit they would of continued into the next field, here, its all walls.

    I'm cynical that because it was a Haas car that caused the VSE. After crashgate there is a doubt in my mind if this was intentional. Especially after the suggestion that Ferrari are the reason their car is so good almost beyond belief good.
     
  12. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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    Ben then didn't FI have a similar problem a few years ago with wheel nuts [though in their case they couldn't get them off]. The issue with Haas is why did the team/their automated pit system thingy give both cars the greent light when you could see the pit crew flailing around in 'don;t let the car go, something's not right' fashion.
     
  13. CrapBag

    CrapBag Multimodder

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    I thought the rule was u can't overtake with a safety car (virtual or real) but apparently the pits isn't part of the race track

    I mean who comes up with this crap.

    I virtually stopped watching f1 due to this crap, better doesn't deserve to win as it's just a fluke, same goes for any other driver that benefits.

    As others have said close the pits, job done, makes a mockery of Lewis efforts.

    He was winning and lost due to a technicality.
     
  14. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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    Vettel didn't overtake Hamilton. Hamilton was already behind Vettel when the VSC started as he'd already been in the pit.

    The argument is/was that the VSC speed/time limits are what allowed Vettel to pit himself and maintain his position, and that had the VSC not been in effect, Vettel would've exited the pits behind Hamilton. Some argued Vettel only pulled it off because they gamed the 'pit lane isn't the track' to exceed the VSC speed limits on pit entry/exit and that was sufficient to shave enoguh time off the trip through the pits to stay in front of hamilton.

    Hamiltons 'dafuq just happened?' was because the team got their maths wrong and thought they'd be fine for timings/gaps if a [virtual] safety car happened. As it happened - it did happen and they weren't fine.
     
  15. CrapBag

    CrapBag Multimodder

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    Ah ok didn't realise that.

    Typical Ferrari though bending the rules.

    It's why I don't like them now and never will.
     
  16. fix-the-spade

    fix-the-spade Multimodder

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    Teams have used the Safety Car (and now the VSC) to get 'faster' pit stops in since the Safety Car was introduced three decades ago.

    Ferrari did it masterfully over the weekend, they are not the first team to leap frog another car by this method and they won't be the last. I would hardly call it a bending of the rules, more sharp strategy by Ferrari and if it really was a software glitch a massive drop of the ball by Mercedes.
     
  17. CrapBag

    CrapBag Multimodder

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    I'm just thinking back to the times when they pulled other dodgy crap like when schumy won in the pit lane while taking his penalty.

    I know the other teams would do the same thing but it's still shitty lol

    Either way I don't see it that the driver wins on their own merits it's just fudging it really.
     
  18. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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    Ferrari are poor losers... they're not great winners either... Makes them hard to like unless you're a die-hard tifosi type imo...
     
  19. fix-the-spade

    fix-the-spade Multimodder

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    Oh no Silverstone 1998 was Skeevy AF, they even changed the rules so anyone who tried that stunt again would expressly be disqualified.

    I think Australia was great for F1, it meant that at least something unpredictable happened in the result. Drivers don't win and lose on their own merits to begin with, F1 is all about which team crunches it's numbers the best.
     
  20. The_Crapman

    The_Crapman World's worst stuntman. Lover of bit-tech

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    Didn't Vettel have his strategy cocked up by Ferrari potentially costing him 2 or 3 wins last year? It's all swings and nunchuks to the bollocks.

    Wtf had happened to force India!? Resolutely the 4th best team last year, now only just better than back markers, with the same drivers too.
     

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