Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by WilHarris, 27 Feb 2007.
and others will say that Ubuntu is total rubbish
According to Slashdot , Dell are now saying that they are merely seeking SUSE hardware compatability certification.
But, what to do if there is a problem with a piece of software on windows? This is exactly the same on Linux. If you expect everything to just fall in your lap, I think you are living on the wrong planet
and IRC is multiplayer notepad
Ubuntu has that in their mission statement IIRC. But for instance Gentoo has the greatest manual I've ever seen, paired up with an enormous Wiki. The resources are at the tips of ones fingers, but if you are too lazy to do an effort, why should I invest time
Unlike with software firms, there are actually plenty of gifted coders in all distro's development trees. And all packages have (or should have) a maintainer. He or she is the captain of the boat, and descides what gets included and what not. Just like in big software firms, only it doesn't cost a billion to get notepad coded...
Now you are going overboard... Better get your facts straight... Maybe some ideas were stolen from Windows, but don't act like there is 1 thing authentic to Windows, allmost all their features are 'borrowed'. And the other way round, like all the eye candy in aero, just resembles beryl/compiz a bit too hard don't you think?
And again, the great thing about Linux and OSS is that it doesn't revolve around money. Developers actually do it for fun, or prestige. Which leads to a lot more optimised code, and a lot more debugging. If there is a bug discovered in a OSS package, it gets fixed pretty quick, now, compare that to the Windows counterpart? I've seen bugs getting fixed in <4hours, and I must say, except for new cutting edge code, the Linux kernel is quite bugfree... Compared to the Windows kernel... But then again you have a handfull of payed developers on the Windows side, and millions of voluntary developers on the OSS side... More eyes = less likely to get something wrong.
Step back in functionality? Again, please get your facts straight... OpenOffice isn't MS office, it doesn't offer a lot of junk 99% of the users don't use, but that doesn't mean that it can't be installed. There are modules that can be added in (just like in MS Office, only they are installed there by default). For instance the formula editor in OO just owns the one in MSs counterpart.
But I'm glad you brought up the learning curve. I wonder, the first time ever that you sat behind a Windows PC, and opened up Office, did you know how things worked? Guess not. OO is just as inituitive as MS counterpart, and has features that MS should learn about (like hotkey'd 'paste as', easy paragraph reorder, ...)
Another great example of the learning curve is VIM... But the vision of the about that is just awsome and so correct here. Why make an easy to learn program that doesn't work efficiently when you know it? Better make a bit harder to learn one, that is actually lightning fast when you know it... Once you climed the curve (and everyone has to in some extent), you'll notice things getting better, not more frustrating because of the constant hand holding.
And what is best in Linux, all these packages can be installed a lot easier then in windows. Just use the distros package manager and everything is installed correctly, without fuss
Well, it does count for a bit that MS Office costs 600€ for something 95% unused? And if that isn't plenty for you, you should look into other office suites, like for instance Koffice. That is the great thing about Linux, choise!
I'm surprised you haven't brought up gaming tough... That is the only thing that can't be done on Linux like it is done on Windows. But that isn't the fault of the Linux community, blame the Game developers on that one. It is perfectly possible to make games on Linux (which run even better then on Windows), but game studio's can't be arsed to make an effort. In that aspect they aren't that much different then home users...
EDIT: it seems that I stepped once again into a 'mine is better then yours' conversation. But let's make it a 'mine is different then yours' one, while we keep respecting eachother. Linux isn't Windows, OO isn't MS Office, Firefox isn't IE... They are alike, each with their similarities and their differences. You know the pro's and the con's of both, make a choice accordingly. If you hate OO, don't use it... But don't start bitching around that it sucks, because for most of the users out there it does just what they need. Don't go pointing fingers at the Linux developers, while it are the 'Windows software developers' that ignore this growing (altough still small) segment of the PC world. Don't go messing around that there is a learning curve in Linux, there's one in Windows too,....
I agree with glider on this. It isn't something that is a "mine is better than yours". Everyone is different and has different tastes and this is what Dell is trying to cater for. I use both windows and linux all the time on my laptop. I use open office on both (because i can't be bothered forking out money to M$) and i have no problems with compatibility with microsoft office and there are all the advanced features i need (equation editing etc). Fedora 6 works brilliantly and if your complaining about updates you've never seen that little auto-update thingy that sits on the menu bar and pops up when there are updates that need downloading.
The only thing i have to complain about with linux is that many of the new games don't run on it. However this is part of the choice thing that Dell is offering. If you aren't gunna be doing much more than word processing and web browsing then linux is just fine. however if your planning on playing games on you computer then get windows. It's quite simple really.
I mentioned that:
ok fine, none of this "mine is better than yours" but..
on windows as it does as you say install so much crap, if you ever need something, it is right there, no install needed, its just a quick "help-> how do i do xxx"
thats easy, users like easy....
I wonder if the PCs/Laptops will be any cheaper without Windows, realistically i'd have to say no, as the OS costs companys like Dell mere pence anyway. But it would be nice if we saw a small saving at least.
make linux noob freindly and its no longer freindly for me, same way windows became unfreidy to me. Face it, a computer is complex and if you can't use the os you shouldn't have a computer you should have a console and a fancy phone that can browse the web.
Beuty of linux is we can have newb freindly distros and ones that are faster to use (have you ever tried file managing from the command line - so much faster).
go newbs get your restrictive operating systems
They apparently changed their mind:
Dell not to bundle Linux with desktops or notebooks
kip you can do a lot in windows as well ya know under the covers it is quite complex.
While I totally agree to this (and use the commandline in Windows as much as possible if I'm forced onto a windows workstation), but the CLI in Windows isn't nearly as powerful as those in Linux. While this is perfectly normal, because Windows isn't actually CLI based, it is just a remainder of the past, it severly limits my Windows experience.
I'm with Glider and Kipman. I started using O long before I migrated to linux. It's a little more challenging to use, but I have done things like multi-layered calendars and brochures in it, things I would normally use Publisher for, if I had $400 to spend on Publisher. Also keep in mind that most pre-built machines don't come with Office, you have to purchase it seperatly. A lot of them come with Works, which is absolute shite.
Also, keep in mind that Dell's target market for this product is NOT the mass consumer market, but rather the power users such as ourselves who use Linux anyways and just want a computer without the bloat. I think most of us would be happy with a whitebook with no OS since it sucks to pay for a Windows license just to format the drive and install linux over it.
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