E.U: Leave or Stay? Your thoughts.

Hence the bit at the end:

Implying heavily that option 3 is the correct one.

 

I think that Farage has no informed view on walking away or the negotiations, except that he realises all outcomes are going to be bad, someone's going to get the blame for it, and he doesn't want to be it.

Meanwhile let's see how Boris Johnson is feeling:

"We find that a door has magically opened in our lives. We can see the sunlit meadows beyond. I believe we would be mad not to take this once in a lifetime chance to walk through that door." --May 2016

"You’ve got to face the fact there may now be a meltdown. OK? I don’t want anybody to panic during the meltdown. No panic. Pro bono publico, no bloody panic. It’s going to be all right in the end.” --June 2018

 

"I don't want anybody to panic during the meltdown"

I bet that won't "age" well as with the withdrawal bill coming back next week the House of Commons will provide a nice glimpse of a meltdown.

 

The meltdown will happen in the late night of March 28th 2019, when there is still no deal and the UK realises that the old trope of the EU always fudging together some last-minute compromise in the final minutes before the negotiating deadline will not hold this time. That's how the EU works amongst itself. That is not how it negotiates with outsiders, which is what the UK is now.

 

Farage: They Don't like it up 'em
Boris: Don't panic!

EU: ...stupid boy.

 

And today in non news: The government is still trying hard to limit the power of parliament by watering down promises previously made, kicking as much as possible further down the road...

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...orced-backtrack-brexit-pledge-meaningful-vote

 

Looks like Mr Brexit is getting buyers remorse, first he said he'd consider a second referendum and now he's saying we'll be in a worse position than we were before we voted to leave, no **** Sherlock!

It's almost like leave voters didn't know what they were voting for.

 

Not even to mention the mess it is creating in regards to devolution:
https://stv.tv/news/politics/1418551-brexit-bill-clause-passed-without-holyrood-s-consent/

May is pretty much campaigning door to door to increase the chances of indyref2.

 

"The former Ukip leader said he did not include a Brexit roadmap in the referendum campaign because “they wouldn’t use me” and “they wouldn’t talk to me”." But that didn't stop him from campaigning for Brexit in the first place, no? What a lame cop-out.

Meanwhile: that foreboding sound you hear is the ticking of the clock...

 

The worst part is that despite the validity of the referendum being called into question what with Russian money and over-spending, the vast majority of 'experts' saying we'll be worse of no matter the deal, and the suspiciously dogged determination of some Westminster elites to make sure neither parliament or the electorate are allowed to change their minds, like they should be able to in a democratic society, there's still people that believe this will improve their lives.

I found this video interesting if rather dry.

 

And a very eloquent exposition on just how ****ed Britain is on how many levels.

EDIT: Here is a transcript of his speech: https://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/magazine/drawbridge-economics-the-brexit-reality-check-is-coming

 

True but it also highlighted for me how contradictory Corbyn and McDonald's stance is on the EU, not that it really matters as thier not in government, but it would be nice to have a party that wanted to remain and had at least some chance of being elected.

Corbyn and McDonald should, philosophically, want to remain in the EU as typical their more socialist, more welfare state, more regulated, more liberal, etc, etc.

 

When you look at the noise on a TV screen, you can imagine seeing all sorts of shapes.

The brain is a pattern detecting machine. It evolved in an environment where spotting a striped tiger in the long grass was a survival skill. So was picking out the ripe fruit or nuts in dense forest foliage. Hence our brain is wired to hunt for patterns in a complex environment, that may mean threat or opportunity.

The EU is hugely complex. It was borne from the trauma of two world wars, from a hope and dream for something better. But this also makes it like a Rorschach inkblot on which people project their own innermost fears as well as desires.

 

I disagree, not with the it's a complex organization part but that it appeals to the same parts of our brains as the abstractness of Rorschach inkblot or the primary fight or flight reaction.

Like any complex system it's open to analysis and when analysed t's clear to see it leans towards more socialist ideals, what push-back there is/was from that came from the UK so what makes Corbyn and McDonald believe a UK detached from the EU isn't going to follow the same course as it has for the last 40-50 years is peculiar to say the least.

IIRC Mrs May has already said she wants the UK to become Singapore on the Thames and that Corbyn and McDonald can't see that most of the deregulation of markets, lowering of the welfare state, and other things they don't like about the EU have had past UK governments behind them then their being naive at best.

 

UK to become Singapore? Then where is my 10 gbit up / 10 gbit down internet for £105 a month?
Oh right, she only means the bits that benefit her ilk not what benefits normal people, carry on laughing at her.

 

It is open to analysis for sure, but most people don't analyse as such. They see the complex world through the lens of their primate brains and reduce it to a simplistic model. This good, that bad (and that neutral, so forget about that). The more complex the situation, the more we try to simplify it.

The problem with Corbyn and McDonald is that basically they haven't moved on in their thinking about the EU since 1973.

 

I'm not sure they've moved on their thinking about anything since the 70s. It's still probably an improvement over most of the Tories being mentally stuck in the 50s [1950s for most, 1850s for rees-mogg]

 

I suppose so, however that's why i find their lack of support for remaining in the EU so contradictory, if you had to place the EU on the traditional political spectrum you'd probably place them on the liberal left whereas the UK would probably be on the authoritative right so why Corbyn and McDonald think leaving the EU isn't going to result in more of the same is beyond me.

 

They hate the current liberal mainstream though, free markets, interventionist foreign policy, eastwards expansion, individualism etc.
I also wouldn’t put the UK on the right despite stuff in the media/impression of the torys, we are still a moderately socialist country.

This NHS money seems like a desperate move to me, I feel a general election approaching soon.

 

'Brexit Dividend'. How stupid does she think we are?