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E.U: Leave or Stay? Your thoughts.

Discussion in 'Serious' started by TheBlackSwordsMan, 22 Feb 2016.

  1. rollo

    rollo Modder

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    Scotland to leave is like good luck, Spain will Veto any free entry into the EU as they do not want there own country to break up. You need all 27 votes for instant entry. Spain will make sure the process is as long as possible. Spain will probably never agree to it is what most political analyst have suggested.

    And the EU can whine all they want till article 50 is invoked all we are doing is playing a game.

    Stock markets have recovered a lot 2% down at the minute is basically within tolerance of the state it's normally in. The sub FTSE 5500 remain people will not be best pleased as that was some rough estimates I heard this morning.

    We are not even at 52 week low points. Even the £ to other currency as slowly started to rise back up again. Bank of England will never bankrupt its own country Greece style which was the major fear.

    This was a campaign based on fear be 3-4 years before its all decided if it was good or bad.

    Deals not null and void till we leave.
     
  2. faugusztin

    faugusztin I *am* the guy with two left hands

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  3. Corky42

    Corky42 Where's walle?

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    That can't be right, the EU is undemocratic, at least that's what i was told. ;)

    /S
     
  4. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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  5. Archtronics

    Archtronics Minimodder

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    Been saying this all morning.

    I can't see a pro EU govt rolling over and accepting 2% more people want to leave. It will be stung out until the leave voters start feeling it in there pockets.

    For Johnson/Gove this is just Political manovouring very house of cards.
     
  6. rollo

    rollo Modder

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    Spain prime minister said as much, For Scotland to skip the joining process they would need all 28 members to vote in there favour. At the time Uk and Spain would both of blocked the process.

    Article 48 requires all 28 member states to agree and that was the SNPs big fighting ground.

    EU president also stated for the time that any Scottish application would be saw as a new applicant to the EU making it go through the same process that the last 2 entrants did.

    All 28 member states at the time had to agree to them joining and general feeling was Spain would never agree as long as their own issues persisted.

    So yeah as I said vote out of UK and try to rejoin it's one long process, they might be done by the time we get round to leaving ourselves.
     
  7. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    It will depend on the EU's co-operation. I think that Article 50 cannot be imposed by the EU, and referendums do only have an advisory capacity --it is within the parliament's constitutional right to ignore it (and it is not the first time that the EU has ignored a referendum if the member state did).

    And with Brexit voters already expressing regret and the .gov website petition asking for a second referendum having crashed once under the amount of people signing up, I think that the government may not meet too much resistance if it decided not to go ahead with a Brexit just now.

    It's different when you're accountable, eh, Boris, Mike and Nige?
     
  8. Anfield

    Anfield Multimodder

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    It is not just about issues in their own country with Spain, but the control for Gibraltar is turning into an issue as well.

    http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-gibraltar-idUKKCN0ZA169

    It came up during the various Greece negotiations that they could not be kicked out, but only leave on their own, so the same should apply to the UK.
     
  9. faugusztin

    faugusztin I *am* the guy with two left hands

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    Sure. But EU can make UK's life as miserable as they want it. Why take UK's position into account in any decision in next 2 years if you are leaving anyway. Or maybe not. Who knows. But if UK is really not leaving EU in the end, then they brutally weakened their position.
     
  10. Archtronics

    Archtronics Minimodder

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    Potentially but the EU will also be trying to stop other parties throughout Europe calling referendums wanting to leave. That will likely mean reforms at which point the UK gov will say how Brexit has forced a change in the EU and it's now all sunshine and rainbows.

    I could be completely wrong of course.
     
  11. Corky42

    Corky42 Where's walle?

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    I'm guessing the wink and /S didn't get across that i was joking/being sarcastic, then. :D

    I know it would need all 27 other member states to agree, it was more an off handed jibe at everyone who says the EU is undemocratic, maybe now's not the time though.
     
  12. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    No, I think that is exactly what will happen. Lots of heat and noise on both sides threatening to leave/eject, but lots of quiet renegotiation underneath. The UK stays in, which is a powerful message to other member states, but with some face-saving concessions that also mollify other Eurosceptic member states a bit.
     
  13. moose67

    moose67 Minimodder

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    I would say that I am far from short sighted and have had plenty of time to grow some rationality in the last decade. My time spent at home seems to be increasing more and more as the years go by. The building sector(to name but one) which is my lively hood, has increasingly been giving jobs to foreign labour and by-passing the British workforce, people with kids, bills, hopes and dreams. No conspiracy, no sour grapes, just cold hard facts of life. And yes it has had an affect on the wages, mostly the self employed. They don't get the mandatory pay rises like the cosy little corporations. One company I know of is still paying the same hourly rate as they were in 2004 because they have an endless supply of cheaper labour. If one falls over they can just replace it with another!

    A few years ago I was promised work on the Olympic village that never came off. Last month it comes out that over half the jobs were given to foreign workers, and finally I realise why I didn't get a look in after all. I rationalised about that one for a long while.....

    I could throw up a million common sense arguments and a million financial arguments, we all could, but I read the other day that there is approximately 1.5 million unemployed and 1.2 million people living in destitute conditions in this country, a country with no immigration policy, and non planned for the future, and a ruling class who are in complete denial about this situation. Therefore rendering me with zero chance of ever seeing an improvement to it, seemed like a good enough reason for me to leave.

    I guess we are on par with the decision making based on economical situation.

    I have spent nearly four decades listening to the likes of Davey boy Cameron and George give me a line Osborne, the champagne socialist and the countless hordes of suits on massive salaries, to know that this was just another "Ted Heath" moment. I personally refuse to fall for it anymore.

    Already I see the butt-hurt, and the fear mongering will continue no doubt. The first day is not even over and already doomsday is going to strike, some most likely will be praying for collapse so that they can shout "I told you so, racist" :rolleyes:

    Well, not in my world, because I'm off for a lovely long walk in my beautiful and sunny democratic English countryside, and I will not be looking back and casting any memories on such individuals as Merkel, Juncker, Van Rompuy or the rest of the parasite pigs!. :rock:
     
  14. impar

    impar Minimodder

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    Greetings!
    As it it, the sooner the better for all.
    UK government dragging its feet for leaving would be painful for UK and EU alike.
    Having a new conservative leader in Fall, a new PM in early 2017 and only then activating Article 50 is a waste of 6 months, full of FUD.
    Multinationals enterprises will reduce its presence in the UK, but no one will want to be the first to announce it.
     
  15. loftie

    loftie Modder

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    Are foreign labourers not capped at the lower bound by the minimum wage?
     
  16. tiger-moth

    tiger-moth What's a Dremel?

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    Over the next weeks and months we'll begin to see what happens when idiots are allowed to break things they don't understand.
    When they're done wrapping themselves in the flag (and they may well need another flag soon if the Scots go) reality will start to sink in - that or they'll find someone else to blame.

    The biggest single day drop in the pound's history, before the Bank of England stepped in - and the money they'll be pumping in will far outweigh any contribution we make to the EU. And we'll have to find that money back somehow.
    No foreign company can now invest in our country - not till after we've spent years of negotiations.
    The money lost will never be regained.
    What happens when you ignore the, almost unheard of, unanimous opinion of the worlds most respected economic experts - what do experts know? Just 'scare mongering'

    All the banks Euro markets will now move.
    Morgan Stanley already have plans to move 2000 staff.
    The City accounts for about 13% of our total tax revenue.

    I'm finding it very hard not to be livid.
     
  17. tiger-moth

    tiger-moth What's a Dremel?

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    The only reason the pound has held up is because the Bank of England stepped in.
    The biggest ever drop in it's history be fore they intervened is all you need to know about the reality of the situation.
     
  18. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    The Bank of England had to throw a net under the pound to stop its descent. That cost will come back to haunt us. Unless the next steps are planned very carefully, there will be a huge price to all this. Trust me.

    Chris Grayling is talking about striking a deal of tariff free trade with the EEA without free movement, but that's a delusional fantasy showing the glaring reality that Vote Leave has no plan and no clue. It has no policy, no leverage, nothing. And now they have no PM and it's all up in the air. Smooth.
     
    Last edited: 24 Jun 2016
  19. Tangster

    Tangster Butt-kicking for goodness!

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    No sane PM would stay in office to oversee what is likely to be significant and prolonged economic depression.

    Half the vote seems like it was people cutting off their nose to spite their face.:sigh:
     
  20. .//TuNdRa

    .//TuNdRa Resident Bulldozer Guru

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    I still believe I voted the right way for my ideals, even if I'm going to burn for them, We only had as much control over our laws as was given, and unlike laws we disagree with here in the UK: We can't tell the politicians responsible to get on their bikes next election for screwing it up, the EU was effectively untouchable by Joe Blogs, even if he had a very valid and understandable reason for disagreeing with a Law.
     

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