E.U: Leave or Stay? Your thoughts.

Anyone like the new Econonist advert:

 

Very apt.

 

I did just read one of their articles - that in reaction to the Brexit result, there should be another referendum - about England, Wales and North Ireland leaving UK . That would :
- drop England, Wales, NI from EU
- let Scotland stay in EU, as they would "inherit" UK membership with just Scotland in UK.

(of course it is a crazy idea, but not without a point).

 

But both Scotland and NI voted to Remain, so who gets to inherit the UK's membership?

 

I can't see Spain agreeing to that.

 

Scotland, obviously. North Ireland just joins Ireland, and gets the EU membership that way.

 

It seems already clear that the Brexit plan is unfurling as (drum roll): staying in the EEA. There's been backtracking on membership fees being reallocated to public services; on immigration --with a most precise distinction being made between EU citizenship status and EU immigrant status, and on invoking Article 50.

Expect a lot of "EU bad, but Europe good" rhetoric coming down the pipe now as Article 50 gets kicked into next year.

 

I vote we all start Petoria.

 

Yeah it is without point. Scotland would be classed as a independent nation, As confirmed before they tried to leave the uk the last time. Spain would block all access to the EU for as long as they could. Scotland can not inherit EU membership.

Wales voted to stay so why would they leave ?

Northern Ireland merging with rest of Ireland there was a time when this might of been doable that time is long since past.

Reading other none uk websites, EU is petrified, The french and germans are trying to hold the thing together, If the french get a chance to vote its not certain they would stay. Germany do not want to pay more for the EU than they already are, With the UK gone that bill becomes theres.

Boris said many daft things during the campaign, His Hitler Qoutes is the one most forget but is very apt at describing the EU "Nazi leader and Napoleon had failed at unification and the EU was "an attempt to do this by different methods".

Germany want a united europe, Including everything, Army, Intelligence gathering / sharing, Free trade, Free movement,Hard finacial control, Basically 0 passport control inside the EU. UK would never agree to the first 2 and argued the crap outta the last three for the last few years. City of London deal was made because of there interference in financial matters.

Makes you wonder if this has not been coming for many years.

 

You clearly didn't understand what was written there. That scenario described a case where UK would stay an EU member, but the only remaining member of UK would have been Scotland.

 

Haha Don't silly. Northern Ireland is a millstone around the UK's neck. You think Ireland could afford to take us.....I'll give you a hint, Google "Flag Protests" and then work out the costs of policing that alone. Next think of the outright war that Unifying Ireland would cause in the north.
I also don't think the Dail would want the likes of DUP and UUP creating a bigger mess of politics either.

Coming from NI I'm happy enough to give Brexit a go at least. Now is the time to look for oppertunities from knee jerk reactions. We get the best of both worlds thanks to the good Friday agreement

 

The talk of a border poll (which is part of the good Friday agreement) requires a popular consensus to be united with the south , whilst that consensus is increasing , its still not near the bar *yet*

I can bet a large poll in NI will be taken soon to gauge opinion though

 

UK has Voted to leave the EU which would negate the argument entirely, Scotland are not a independent nation.

As I said before, they would have to declare they want to leave the UK block, England Wales and Northern Ireland will not leave.

So Scotland to leave the UK block will have to vote for indepedence. Which goes back to what I wrote.

Northern Ireland does not want to be part of Ireland do you not know Irish history? 7% voted yes to a joint ireland, 32% in 20 years time, 60% Never. In the last conducted Poll. (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/n...but-a-firm-no-to-united-ireland-30622987.html)

Wales are quiet happy where they are part of the UK.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-21345997

even the catholics of NI as a majority didn't want reunification

 

I'd say that's what informed people with a brain think about the EU and Europe. Many Leave voters hardly realise that there's a difference. For them Europe is a bunch of Muslim refugee loving Nazi autocrats (yeah, this oxymoron is lost on them too). Keep in mind that many Leavers are of the poorer communities who have never been abroad and speak only English.

(They are not like you and I who have been abroad, and are right now comfortably communicating in what for both of us is a second language.)

I think that many Leavers don't make that distinction. They don't know anything about the former, and politicians and tabloids have fed them the latter picture.

 

I voted Leave on the basis that I didn't like the fact that the EU was attempting to unify everything into a single superstate, where we would become nothing more than another county within it, beholden to the laws from on' high that we had no say in, I love Europe itself, even though I've only been to a small part of it.

The problem is that English culture just doesn't work for that kind of event, all throughout our history is us fighting off the French, the Scottish, the Germans, the Scottish, the Vikings and the Scottish, I know that some people are unwilling to commit to what they see as a betrayal of history and willingly become just another small bit of a nation made up of those we used to spend years beating seven bells out of.

 

There will never be an EU superstate, unless a few other members decide to bail out - namely Greece, Italy, Portugal and Ireland. You know, the ones that are terrified of fiscal union because they've maxed the credit card and don't want to pay the bill.

 

The problem is that Brits attribute characteristics as unique to their culture without knowing other cultures. Take the Dutch for instance: defiantly living 7 metres below sea level on land that they pulled from the sea, they are a sceptical, sober and independent people. Their religious tolerance and open-mindedness was well known in the 1600s. They were well-known for their arts and sciences. They stayed neutral in WWI, resisted the German invaders in WWII although they had a tiny army with no chance of winning. They are a small country but with a strong spirit, managing to live closely together and to feed a whole nation through innovative agricultural practices.

Or are they? I could talk about their colonial history, their being the most efficient and cruellest slave traders, their strong 'pillaring' of society along religious and ideological lines, and the small-mindedness that quickly becomes apparent beyond the Randstad.

Turns out that they are a mixed lot, the Dutch, and quite like the Belgians, Germans and British in some ways and different in others.

 

QFT.

 

Scottish UK Referendum: We want our Independence.
Scottish UK Referendum II: We don't want our Independence.

http://whatscotlandthinks.org/questions/how-would-you-vote-in-the-in-the-scottish-independence-referendum-if-held-now-a

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/apr/25/nicola-sturgeon-urges-cameron-honour-pledge-clyde-shipbuilding-jobs

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_independence_referendum,_2014

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/what-staying-in-the-united-kingdom-means-for-scotland/what-staying-in-the-united-kingdom-means-for-scotland-with-references