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Elementary school shooting

Discussion in 'Serious' started by Sloth, 14 Dec 2012.

  1. jrs77

    jrs77 Modder

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    Sorry Nexxo, but they're actually.

    In most european countries you can join a shooters club and you'll get the permit for buying guns needed to perform this sport and that includes anything from .22 to .45 revolvers or semi-automatics and/or .22 rifles. Additionally there's allways the hunting-licenses that will let you buy rifles and pistols.

    Where I'm living - in Finland - you don't even need to take that road and simply apply for a license at the police office, and if you don't have any records you'll simply get your license.

    If that's not easy, then what is?
     
  2. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    Well, in several countries you have to keep your gun stored at the gun club. In others you can also only purchase ammo at the gun club, use it there and surrender for storage what you did not use. Carry concealed? Not in the EU.

    Second: the guns that are available are expensive. No cheap snub-nose .38 Saturday Night Specials there. This means that there is little trickle-down to the local criminal market.
     
  3. jrs77

    jrs77 Modder

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    Ofcourse it's not like in the US, but it's still easy enough. And the biggest country in the EU - Germany - allows storing guns and ammo at home for example.

    And the price is not that expensive either. I can legally buy a new Glock for €600 here which I think is rather cheap.

    Sure, it's personal perception and experience maybe.
     
  4. mucgoo

    mucgoo Minimodder

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  5. Blazza181

    Blazza181 SVM PLACENTA CASEI

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  6. wafflesomd

    wafflesomd What's a Dremel?

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    I think that has more to do with Piers being an annoying idiot. I doubt any country would want to take him though.
     
  7. walle

    walle Minimodder

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    He is parroting the party line attacking the 2nd amendment just like all the other vomit brokers are, when they are not busy with informing the families of the victims of how many bullets their children were killed with, using their shock and awe tactics.

    As for Pierce Morgan, well, I doubt if even the English would want him back, the man is widely disliked as I understand it.

    This is well worth reading: http://www.libertarian-logic.com/2nd-amendment.html
     
    Last edited: 24 Dec 2012
  8. Throbbi

    Throbbi What's a Dremel?

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  9. Bufo802

    Bufo802 Minimodder

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  10. steveo_mcg

    steveo_mcg What's a Dremel?

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    Most police don't want to be armed. The few I know are quite happy with the way things are tbh escalation would, I observe, only make things worse.

    This article is interesting as it was written just after two PC's were shot on a routine call out.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19641398
     
  11. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    A Saturday Night Special costs $50,--.

    To a sports shooter, €600,-- for a quality gun that they intend to keep is a reasonable price. To most petty criminals it is a LOT of money for a gun that they want to ditch as soon as they've used it for a crime to avoid being caught with the incriminating evidence.
     
    Last edited: 24 Dec 2012
  12. lm_wfc

    lm_wfc Minimodder

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  13. walle

    walle Minimodder

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    You will find people that don't understand the 1st amendment, just as you will find people that don't understand the 2nd amendment. You will find people that emotionally react to those who exercise the 1st amendment, just as you will find people who emotionally react to those who exercise the 2nd amendment.

    Here we see a reaction to someone who is exercising the 1st amendment whilst not understanding the 2nd amendment.
     
  14. Blazza181

    Blazza181 SVM PLACENTA CASEI

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    I think it only applies to US citizens, but nonetheless, it's pretty appalling for a fair few people to say: we don't agree with what you said, we'll claim it's an attack on our freedoms, get out.

    As much as I dislike Piers, this is ridiculous.
     
  15. jrs77

    jrs77 Modder

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    Yeah, but what are we talking about here? In all those school-massacres during the last decade it was allways registered guns being used. The parents bought these guns in all of the countries in the first case, be it in Germany, in Finland or in the US.

    The illegal guns bought with the intent of using them in a crime will allways be another problem.
     
  16. SuicideNeil

    SuicideNeil What's a Dremel?

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    FTFY :thumb:

    It, like most legal & religious issues, is a matter of interpretation; the 'right to bear arms' doesn't mean every man, woman & child should necessarily have free & easy access to military grade hardware for home defence essentially. That would be silly.

    No, what Piers was trying to say ( I hate the bloke too ) was just that^, that semi auto weapons and smaller magazine sizes are perfectly suitable for hat most people intend to use their weapons for, no need for full auto weapons and larger calibres ( Heck, nato uses mainly 5.56mm stuff, only the larger 7.62mm stuff for more specialist weapons ).

    Of course, this being America anyone who says a bad thing about guns gets lynched automatically and called anti-American / anti liberty / anti-constitutional etc etc, which simply isn't the case. There do need to be tighter controls and sensible limits ( a ban is unenforceable at this point ), and they need to be national, not dictated by each state as it sees fit- hence why currently in some states it's almost impossible to buy or own a 'gun', but in others you can walk right into a shop & out again 5 minutes later with enough weapons to start your own private army, no paper work required pretty much.
     
  17. Elton

    Elton Officially a Whisky Nerd

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    I might not agree with Piers Morgan. But this? Wow, that petition is deranged. If only because legally it isn't even possible to deport someone for the attacking the government verbally. 1st amendment sure. But there hasn't been any damages that can be proved.

    Aside from maybe tourism profits, that's a loooong shot.

    Hilarious and depressing really. Only because not only is this petition entirely impossible under the constraints of the law (libel laws don't count, there are no losses incurred) so if this ever receives any widespread coverage. ... Dat circus act.
     
  18. DragunovHUN

    DragunovHUN Modder

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    Really, there are petitions on that site for developing cat girls and a functional death star, this isn't even noteworthy in comparison and yet it's being discussed because OMG GUNS. I thought we'd all be tired of that topic by now.
     
  19. IanW

    IanW Grumpy Old Git

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    There is a town in the US (Kennesaw, Georgia) where local laws state that every household MUST own at least one gun. :jawdrop:
     
  20. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    In which case you're arguing for tighter regulation of registered guns, no?

    It's good to argue for better mental health services to spot and intercept these people, but if you work in those mental health services you'd realise how tricky that is. Such shooters represent about 0.008% of the population with mental health problems. Meanwhile there are a lot of 'false positives': people who will talk about killing themselves or being violent to others without actually ever doing it. They all need... What? Sectioning? Monitoring? Therapy? Medication? With mental health units being overcrowded, community mental health teams being overstretched, the waiting list for a psychologist in mental health being up to 6 months, and there being (last time I checked) no tablet that curbs homicidal tendencies (at least not without the sort of side-effects that would preclude the patient from taking them voluntarily), I don't see that working, somehow.

    The NHS, wonderful institution as it is (and I could earn twice what I earn now privately, so I like to think that I'm putting my money where my mouth is), is overburdened. This is only partly due to an ageing population and treatments becoming correspondingly more expensive as they become more sophisticated. It is largely through people drinking too much, smoking too much, eating too much and fighting/****ing/partying too much (see A&E on a weekend night or the STD clinics any time of the week). Basically it is a population behaving irresponsibly, without self-discipline, without boundaries, expecting the NHS to parent and contain them when they go off a cliff.

    It's that kind of society that fails to contain and regulate itself where messed-up kids become school shooters: a society that indulges in its childish whims and acts out disinhibitedly: that eats too much, drinks too much, shags too much, fights too much. That wants bigger portions, stronger alcoholic drinks, bigger cars, shinier gadgets, bigger guns and work less for it, and above all less responsibility, lower taxes, more freedom to do whatever the **** it wants, sod everybody else. Sorry, but this is not a problem you can shove onto some overburdened public service. This is one where it takes the village to raise the child.
     

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