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Multi Elite - Dangerous by David Braben

Discussion in 'Gaming' started by Jedra, 6 Nov 2012.

  1. GravitySmacked

    GravitySmacked Mostly Harmless

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    That's good to hear Parge :D
     
  2. Cei

    Cei pew pew pew

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    The Warthog has a built in profile too. I immediately changed it ;)
     
  3. Parge

    Parge the worst Super Moderator

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    The X52 one is pretty good overall. I changed a few things about (rebinding push to talk etc).

    One thing I'm still umming and arring about is whether to have the throttle set so zero is in the middle, or zero at the bottom, and use a button to turn the engine to reverse. Think I might try the latter tonight (think its called 'continuous' mode in the settings FYI.
     
  4. Parge

    Parge the worst Super Moderator

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    On Yaw:

    From here

    CaptainKremmen
    They aren't ignoring those requests.

    They are simply choosing not to act on them... for reasons they have clearly expressed on many occasions.

    Mike Evans
    Designer- Elite: Dangerous

    Indeed, a request is just that. We don't have to do anything if we don't want to but that doesn't mean we didn't read and consider the request. Suffice to say a low yaw rate is a fundamental part of our games aesthetics and a corner stone to our flight model that we at frontier like the way it is. We're not changing it, for to do so would be to compromise our own vision for what Elite: Dangerous is and what it's going to be. I don't give a damn what all the other space games have done in the past, nor do I care that our yaw rates are apparently even slower than a plane's is (though every time I've tried doing a pure yaw turn in IL-2 I've stalled my plane before I got anything that even resembled a steady and fast turn rate). Fast yaw and pitch in a space game is a video game trope of the highest order along with banner arrows sliding around the screen and compasses telling you where to fly all the time. I'm almost certain that other developers just implement those features because they've been so prevalent rather than actually reassessing whether the game needed them or could be even better without them! We found for example that the compass that pointed you towards your target at all times made combat too easy to end in stalemate of circling. As soon as we tried removing it all of a sudden it was more exciting to fight someone because they could give you the slip whilst you weren't glancing at your sensors and even if you did pay attention to the sensors the difference in the way the information is presented can still mean you don't quite stay on the target's tail perfectly, again providing more opportunities for them to turn the tide of the battle.

    Suffice to say we wanted Elite to feel like star wars in terms of how the ships move by banking/rolling and pitching through manoeuvres opposed to the yaw and pitch based FPS style movement most other space games offered (where roll plays little or no part). That limitation to having to do your main directional change manoeuvring by pitching makes the flight path taken to be more cinematic and means a skilled player can predict the manoeuvres of an opponent in advanced by observing their current roll position relative to themselves only. So long as they match the roll quickly enough they can always follow through the inevitable pitch manoeuvre effectively and maintain the chase. If the target could yaw or pitch effectively then it's much harder to assess what they're going to do as they're current roll position doesn't really matter any more.

    Finally realism has played no part whatsoever in any of our design discussions about the flight model. We don't care what would be realistic as we only care what the game play experience is when flying these ships and so far we feel we're hitting the right notes for the majority of our audience.
     
  5. DeckerdBR

    DeckerdBR Minimodder

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  6. Cei

    Cei pew pew pew

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    Yes, I have a FLY5 and I wouldn't recommend at all. The FLY5 uses a spring balancing system and a mechanical gimbal as the sensor, whereas the T.1600M uses Hall Effect magnetic sensors that are usually only found in more expensive HOTAS setups.

    Basically, order the T.1600M and wait for it to arrive. The FLY5 isn't worth spending the same amount of money on.

    My FLY5 has been passed down to the wife, but if she gets in to SC I'll upgrade her to an X-55.
     
  7. DeckerdBR

    DeckerdBR Minimodder

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    Thanks - I was initially a bit put off by the little HAT button on the T.1600M but you sold it to me :)

    Ordered from Scan. Excited.

    I made my first mission based trade run last night in Elite, netting me 3500 - enough to get me a heat sink upgrade, which if I understand it's function correctly, allows me to jettison heat build-up via an ejected cartridge, useful for staying in 'silent running mode' for longer and other activity's where heat build up causes issues?
     
  8. Risky

    Risky Modder

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    Thank goodness for that. "Real Physics" and fun combat gameplay aren't compatible.
     
  9. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    ELITE originally didn't have yaw because basically joysticks in those days (1984) were standard arcade affairs with only four directions and a fire button. There were no pedals, HOTAS sets or steering wheels or any of that fancy stuff. Not even mice. Just arcade joysticks and paddles.

    So if you have only four directions to play with, and you don't really want people to have to use the keyboard intensively for manoeuvring, you are limited in motion. Pitch is an obvious must. Yaw would be next but then you cannot have roll. However by combining roll and pitch you can compensate for the absence of yaw, and that was how ELITE worked. It was fairly intuitive.

    I think that ED tries to get the game play right above all and that is most important. Frontier tried the realism route and it made dogfights all but impossible (and just flying from A to B rather cumbersome as well). Moreover we are talking about a fictitious scenario; who is to say what is "realistic"?

    EDIT: saw pictures of the new station interiors (of more prosperous systems). Very nice!
     
    Last edited: 1 Aug 2014
  10. Cei

    Cei pew pew pew

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    Pfft, I played ELITE on the keyboard alone. I didn't get a joystick until X-Wing came along...

    I get that they don't want yaw to be a big player in the flight mechanic, but dear god is it slow and bad. Even a small increase in yaw speed would be appreciated - I've had several very close runs with station walls due to the terrible turning circle (and whilst docking my roll axis is busy matching the station rotation).
     
  11. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    *****. :p In ELITE I docked without computer and without any yaw at all, without problems.
     
  12. GravitySmacked

    GravitySmacked Mostly Harmless

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    Are the servers down at the moment? The online option is 'redded' out for me since I updated this morning.

    edit: never-mind I just had to re-verify my machine for some reason.
     
    Last edited: 2 Aug 2014
  13. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    By poking it and going: "Yup, it's a PC...". :p
     
  14. Parge

    Parge the worst Super Moderator

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    Yes! I had to do that too for some reason?

    I'll be on tonight by the way. After having a little argument with a docking bay, I've just got a new sidewinder, and I'm currently fairly deep into outer space. Currently docked at a dual ringed space station. Ready to head out even deeper.

    ITS SO EXCITING!:jawdrop::eeek:

    EDIT: Also, I've changed my throttle so it now zeros in the middle. Takes a bit of getting used to, and can be quite dangerous when landing but I'm 100% sure its the right way to play in the long term.
     
    Last edited: 2 Aug 2014
  15. Blogins

    Blogins Panda have Guns

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    Anyone tried the 'Docking Computer' yet? Bit of a hark back to the old days! :D
     
  16. Cei

    Cei pew pew pew

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    Nah, I keep having the bad experience of being yanked out of hyperspace as soon as I have a decent value of cargo, ending up being attacked by 2+ Cobras. I usually die as the stock Sidewinder popguns don't make much of an impact and overheat too fast.

    Anybody else apart from Parge playing tonight?
     
  17. Nexxo

    Nexxo * Prefab Sprout – The King of Rock 'n' Roll

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    Does it play "Blue Danube"? It's got to play "Blue Danube".
     
  18. Cei

    Cei pew pew pew

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    Yes, yes it does.

    Skip to 3:00
     
  19. GravitySmacked

    GravitySmacked Mostly Harmless

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    I've been having a blast with the x52 pro today, it makes everything so much easier to do.
     
  20. bawjaws

    bawjaws Multimodder

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    Ah, the Docking Computer. The best 1,500 credits you'll ever spend.
     

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