Hello LeMaltor! You now have my undivided attention for the next few days. I can assure you that this is not a Good Thing. Any more asinine posts and, in a variation on a quote by Mr. T., you'll meet my friend, Banhammer. Are we good?
She's perfectly in the right. The system is designed to stop you doing exactly what you're trying to do, namely taking breaks right at the end of the working day to make the day 'shorter'. You're entitled to a 20min break at some point during the day, and obviously your employer has made that an hour - but they get to pick when.
Correct (though english working law isn't my field). you said it yourself: What you suggest (working for 8 hours straight, then taking a 1 hour break, thereby shortening your day) is not allowed by law.. I'm afraid she's right. Now having your 1 hour break one hour before shift end (so still working one hour afterwards)...isn't nice, but appearently legal.
Legal min 20mins you get one hour.. why are you whinging? You have a job, be thankful, its coming close to Christmas don't rock your boat
I'd imagine he's whinging because he's had his work pattern shifted around just to fit in an hour break which he doesn't want or need. Think i'd be 'whinging' if I was told I had to stick around an hour longer just so they could send me on a hours break pretty much at the end of my shift. Also, having read the regulations it seems to me that it provides employees with entitlements, i.e. you're entitled to a break, you're entitled to daily/weekly rest periods, but it doesn't require you to actually take them. I don't see that it'd be an issue for an employee to agree with an employer that they were happy to work more than 6 hours without taking a break.
Sorry, but you are. You are butting heads with your supervisor because you think you know more then she does and you aren't getting what you want. But you aren't the supervisor. and getting what you want isn't what your job is. Suck it up, or leave. Because your going to end up the rotten apple and start to sour the team, at which point you will be a discipline problem. Then you leave them no option but to fire you. An adult would approach this in a way that didn't involve the "what does the law say about this" or "my way is better/smarter then yours is because you don't know what you are doing" attitude she is no doubt picking up from you. They would approach this in a way that would win her over to your view, and do it in such a way that she would be left with the view that you supported her and she could rely on you. Right now all you are is a nail sticking out of the floor board, begging to be pounded down.
I think hes done it the right way and its exactly how I would approach it. He's perfectly entitled to see if his current employment circumstances are consistent with the law, and if his company is breaking it then he should let them know so they can be changed in accordance with current UK labour law.
Indeed he should check. But based on what he wrote it definitely sounds like he's the problem here and not her. She is require to give him a break. He's currently shortening his day by an hour instead of taking a break. All she is doing is making sure the company is in compliance by giving him a break, and choosing a time at the end of the day. He doesn't like it. He can a) take the break when told, as an employee of the company. b) be the one that sours the team, in fact becoming the moral problem he describes. which in time will come back to him. or c) resign. The truth is, this is a non issue. He's making it one because he doesn't like his new manager and he doesn't like that his day is now a bit longer with a break the doesn't fit his ideal. Looking into the "legality" of a break shows he's really not interested in being a team player and knuckling down to make the business work. In fact, by his statement, if he doesn't get his way he wants to sabotage the business to "prove" his point. Which is childish in the extreme in a workplace.
Yo, this is a silly thread Nexxo, it merrited a silly responce, and the grammar boat crew missed the irony boat. Yes I probably shouldn't play with the newbs, but to be fair I don't wheel myself out that often
Bad idea. People don' like admitting at least publicly that there wrong. A polite note first and if no changes after two weeks or so then a discrete and again polite chat. As the people above have said it seems that there no law on your side so you need to get here to comply because she wants to. If she dislikes you because your arguing with here then you haven't a hope in hell of getting what you want.
The OP asked a valid question, he might be wrong but instead of making comments like you did the valuable members gave reasoned answers. I wouldn't bother 'wheeling' yourself out again unless you are going to be helpful. Your post wasn't ironic it was just inane and not helpful.
Shouldn't play with the newbs? Looks like you aren't capable of playing with anyone, mummy should have kept you out for another year to prepare.
Cheers for the advice all, should point out a couple more things of the situation I am in as I have left out a few details. As far as souring the team, this is not the case. The situation at work is that I am the supervisor, and along with 1 other we are the only ones at this level. Between the pair or us we run the team, dealing with everything from pay to grievances for a total of 30 staff. As such one of us has to be in our department when it is running at all times, no exceptions other that fire alarms. Secondly, the hours that our business is operational is only 6am til 12. This is the only time our part time staff are in the building, and we are full go during these hours and these hours only. All of our staff are on 4 hour daily shifts and as such get no breaks. The remaining two hours are taken up purely with admin work and paperwork which can be completed any time before midnight that day without causing any issues. Numerous times I have left at 12 to come back in later that evening to do this paperwork and also help out in other areas of the business. My boss only ever makes appearances once a week, she is the one that works in another area of the building and deals with all finances for us, then informs the two of us what we have to play with and also hires new staff for us to train etc. She essentially has no contact with the remainder of the team beyond hiring them and passing messages onto us two to share with them. The other person I work with has been in this job for 5 years and has only ever done 6-2 shifts with no 1 hour lunch, she only takes 5 minutes to get a cigarette break during the day and is in the same boat as me in regards to the changes. I've only been in this job for 4 months. If we do have to take an hour for lunch this will be the most boring thing possible, as we are located in a business park with nothing near by, we have no tele or anything with which to entertain us for an hour. I can't stand reading books and am not looking forward to the idea of sitting for an hour 5 days a week with nothing to do other than spin my thumbs as someone whom has no experience of managing people decides to change the dynamic of a team after 5 years of successful working. And I do mean no experience, this is her first managerial role and she has already taken two weeks off for stress and I have caught her crying twice because she couldn't cope, and this is only her into her 3rd month with the company in this role. Anyway, sleep time as I need to be up at 4 to go through this all again.
It would appear that she's got your health and safety as a consideration here but you don't have a thought for hers. If you're aware that she's suffering from stress, I'd think that you've got a duty under the Health and Safety at Work Act not to push the issue. I'd run with it for a while and then have a quiet, friendly discussion with her. See what her motives are - is she under pressure from her management to stop people appearing to knock off early, which would be my consideration here, or is it something else?
I usually find it's easier to disarm the situation by being non-confrontational and then coax the boss around by making him think it was his good idea! Remember they came to me a while ago with a stack of paper where I had mistyped a day code we use. Considering this data entry is a small part of the workload and it's repeated over a thousand times the odd typo is inevitable! They came in guns blazing about this 'major' (minor to me) mistake and by the end of the meeting the two managers went running to their manager about the excellent 'new process' they just put in place to offset these errors. In the end they seemed to have forgotten I suggested programming a simple macro key that can be changed once, day by day eliminating the odd typo in the date code. At least they never bothered me again and I've not once received a crappy e-mail from head office about it since! My advice is to think up a solution then present it as something she can sell to her superiors.
I agree with a lot of the comments here. I understand your frustrations to the recent changes that your Manager has decided to introduce recently. It's quite simple really, and I speak as a Manager of 30+ direct reports. Under UK Employment Law there are certain entitlements available to you (depending on the T&C's of your Contract of Employment which will normal be detailed in an Employee Handbook of some kind) regarding breaks. From what you describe, the fact that you are being asked to effectively stay an extra hour to ensure compliance with the Legislation seems a bit odd. In all honesty, I think the approach your considering will not help resolve the situation and in fact, confronting her face to face will only make matters worse especially if she is already under pressure and not coping as you see it. As others have stated, work with her, discuss your concerns, but also be willing to compromise if required. In my experience, if you can present an alternative that has a benefit to you, your team, and the business then it will make the conversation a lot easier and a more realistic chance of an outcome that suits everyone. You will know as a people Manager, you will never be able to please everyone.
I'f she's been there for three months only and is already breaking up and pissing off the old staff. No consideration from my part. In my experience, most lower and middle managers were never taught how to be managers. Some cope, some cope very well, and some turn into pricks or they just...snap. I had a manager that wanted us to take EXACT breaks, the "from-12 to 12:20 and not a minute later" kind. Silly thing was, when my mantainance people finished their job at 12:10, and left with the machines running, it was okay for me for them to shift their break by 10 minutes. Not for him. 12:20 is 12:20, if you don't manage to get out by 12, that's your problem. So in the end my technicians dropped their spanners at 12:00 sharp, and my machine uptime went down drastically. Stupid idiot.
im pretty sure you are REQUIRED to take a break if you work longer than 6hrs for health and safety reasons. They cant run the risk of run-down people making mistakes etc. Dont quote me on it though. Personally i think your whining like a 5yr year old. Lots of people dont have jobs and yet your here complaining about your dinner hour ! get a grip. Be thankful you have a job or if it bugs you so much quit and let someone else do the job. when they mean middle of the shift they arent been EXACT they mean at some point towards the middle ! to break up your 9 hrs into to 2 chunks.
