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News Epic grabs Metro Exodus from Steam

Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by bit-tech, 29 Jan 2019.

  1. Speed

    Speed I'm all you need!

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    The last thing we need is for them to charge more for certain launchers, so thanks but no thanks! Games are already ridiculous prices as it is on launch to the point where I've never in the last three years played a PC game on or even near launch day! This often works out to my benefit beyond the obvious price savings because they are almost always a broken mess on release that is patched at a later date, partly because the industry has got complacent and frankly badly needs a shake up. Just look at what Bethesda thought it could get away! Sure they used their own launcher as a form of risk management but they obviously thought they'd make money regardless or the game wouldn't have seen the light of day.

    Yes it is nice to have them all in once place but this should promote competition and price wars not increases in prices for people loyal to one platform or another.
     
  2. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Lover of bit-tech Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    Ooh, I get to debunk this old canard again - huzzah! Though I'm in a rush, so I'mma have to do it the short way:
    Those inflation figures need updating, mind you: using the Bank of England's calculator, £59.99 in 1991 money is £126.54 in 2018 money.

    Gaming is super-cheap today. Grand Theft Auto V cost orders of magnitude more to make than Street Fighter II: Special Championship Edition on the Mega Drive, but launched for less than half the price.
     
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  3. Wakka

    Wakka Yo, eat this, ya?

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    What was the average price of a Sega Mega Drive game in 1991, though? Was SFII:SCE an extreme case? I don't remember having to save a years worth of pocket money to buy Mega Drive games...
     
  4. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Lover of bit-tech Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    SFII:SCE was somewhat higher than some, but then it was a new-release and much-anticipated title (and the discussion was about new-releases, remember): the Autumn/Winter 1991 Argos Catalogue doesn't have any Mega Drive games, but it does have NES games at £24.95-£39.95. The Spring/Summer 1992 Argos Catalogue has two Mega Drive games for £39.99 each: one was a year old at the time, the other had come out in December the year before.

    Issue 1 of Mean Machines Sega, published in October 1992, has third-party adverts for Mega Drive games ranging between £17 to £45 depending on age and popularity; reviews include Predator 2 (£39.99), Atomic Runner (£39.99), Green Dog (hey, I had that one, and also it was £39.99), The Aquatic Games (£44.99), Smash TV (£39.99), NHLPA Hockey 93 (£39.99), and spotlights on a range of games costing between £9.99 (Enduro Racer) and £39.99

    So, for a reasonably new-release game you're looking at an average of £39.99 around 1991/1992. £39.99 in 1992 is the equivalent of £81.32 in 2018, so we're still talking about games being comfortably cheaper today despite the massively increased production budgets.
     
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  5. Speed

    Speed I'm all you need!

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    I never suggested games were not expensive back in the day and that isn't really my point at all. I'm fully aware that gaming is cheaper today than it was back in the 90s but the industry was also vastly different. Money back then was made almost exclusively on the games themselves and for the odd modified arcade port you picked as an example; in arcades as well. This is why Rockstar invested so much money into making GTA V knowing full well they could make it back with the re-releases, micro transactions etc. So yes it cost a lot more to make but also made vastly more money beyond just the games themselves.

    While this may seem like nitpicking; having played it back in the day I should also point out that Street Fighter II: Special Champion Edition was not released in 1991 on any platform. It was released in 1992 in arcades and then ported over (with some additions from other versions) to Sega Mega Drive and released in 1993. It is also an extremely odd comparison to GTA V / Horizon Zero Dawn which was built from the ground up where as the Sega Mega Drive version of SF2 was ported from the arcade version with as you mention a small team. Sure if anything that shows how big the mark up was back then but I still find it a bit of an odd one to pick out.... does it hold fond memories or something?! ;)

    Regardless I'm simply stating that games are expensive at launch in comparison to a few months down the line, and the last thing we need is there to be a premium for specific platforms. £50 is an awful lot of anyones money and to add £XX on top so you can buy it on a specific platform is an awful suggestion and the last thing us consumers need. I'd rather these highly competitive platforms like Epic store whom are aggressively trying to carve out market share help push the stagnated industry towards healthy competition not the usual anti-consumer "buy from us and you'll get X exclusive skin or DLC".

    Personally (and maybe I'm in the minority) I'm more than happy to wait it out to get a patched cheaper title. Timed platform exclusives might be a downer for many but with most people having huge backlogs of unplayed games I don't think it is the huge issue that some people make it out to be.
     
  6. Anfield

    Anfield Multimodder

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    And how man copies did it sell at that price?

    Because the total money made from sales compared to the production budget is what actually matters, not the per unit price.
     
  7. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Lover of bit-tech Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    You're absolutely right - that was a mistake on my part when I did the original comparison. So, correcting, that means that £59.99 in 1993 money is £120.06 in 2018 money.
    Exactly why I picked it, and if you read my linked posts I specifically call that out: SFII cost more than either of the other two named games despite costing significantly less to make (and, yes, having a significantly smaller audience, which may or may not balance that out.)
    Yes, but that's not why I picked it: at the time I made my original comparison I actually had an old magazine sat next to me with an advert for SFII:SCE on the back, highlighting the price as £59.99 at Rumbelows - thus it was just a handy comparison to use!
    Yes, they absolutely are, and I'd highly recommend people don't pre-order/buy on release as a result.
    Yes and no: a three-hour film on Blu-ray will cost you £20; a trip to the cinema to see the same film will probably set you back £30 with snacks and transportation taken into account; while a £50 game might bring you 300+ hours of entertainment (or eight hours of boredom - you pays your money, you takes your choice!)
    It is, when framed that way, but you could also frame it the opposite: Game X costs £50 on Steam but £45 on Epic because it's discounted on Epic, not because it's hiked up on Steam (even though, effectively, they're exactly the same thing.)
    Word.
    No, it isn't, because what we're discussing here is the claim that 'games are already ridiculous prices as it is on launch,' when in fact they're the cheapest they've been in decades.

    EDIT:
    Could have been worse, could have had a Neo-Geo...
     
    Last edited: 1 Feb 2019
  8. Anfield

    Anfield Multimodder

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    Game price is nothing but a symptom while the root issue is how much money companies need to make in order to turn a profit.
     
  9. monty-pup

    monty-pup Minimodder

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    Anyway ... I would still pay a bit more for my games to ensure I could have them all contained within Steam.

    And speed, if they cost a little more, you would just wait a little longer than you do already ... no biggie. I agree games are quite expensive for sometimes a lacklustre experience and buggy.



    Another solution is this timed exclusive with Metro Exodus and other pubs/devs retaining ability to release wherever they like after a year or two. Thereby Steam gets it eventually. And I’m happy. I can wait.

    — I have Origin installed. Never played 1 game through it. But through Steam I would ... I know, weird ... shoot me down all you like.
     
  10. edzieba

    edzieba Virtual Realist

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    Remember: regardless of what store you buy a game through, they already are accessible though a single location, and through a single launcher.

    The location is called 'your PC', and the launcher is called 'the OS'.

    And it's not just your games, every program (be it a game or otherwise) can be accessed through the same universal route, without needing to jump through the hoop of some companies proprietary 'launcher' first. Steam (or any other store frontend) is not necessary to launch programs, game or otherwise. And even if you want a fancy leanback frontend in the event you are trying to use a PC solely with a gamepad rather than a keyboard & mouse, there are plenty of them available to do so that do not require you to purchase games through that same frontend (e.g.).
     
  11. Wakka

    Wakka Yo, eat this, ya?

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    So, removing the SFII example (as it's definitely an outlier in pricing), it's not near as dramatic as you first made it out to be - Considering that a lot of new releases are around the £50 mark nowadays, that's a, inflation adjusted, ~35% reduction in game prices.

    Now, where you really need to dig deep is the cost of things like entertainment/videogames/leisure activities in the early 90's vs the cost of living, then compare that to 2019. I would wager, with wage growth being so stagnant and things like energy and housing costs going through the roof over the past couple of decades, the perceived "value" of such things has become much more skewed.

    But that's a whole different study!
     
  12. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Lover of bit-tech Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    ...but a fun one...
     
  13. adidan

    adidan Guesswork is still work

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    Yeah, you have to take into account that back then your only other expenses were for the chimney sweep and the cost of string you needed to remove teeth with.
     
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  14. Wakka

    Wakka Yo, eat this, ya?

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    Just like the 90's itself, then!

    *wishes it was still 1996*
     
  15. adidan

    adidan Guesswork is still work

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    Posted in Gaming too. Yeah, I repeat myself.

    Outer Worlds initiallty to be released on the Epic Games Store and the Windows Store (just WTF is that?). Other sellers (ie Steam) 12 months later.

     
  16. David

    David μoʍ ɼouმ qᴉq λon ƨbԍuq ϝʁλᴉuმ ϝo ʁԍɑq ϝμᴉƨ

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    Cool. Another game I won't be buying until next year.
     
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  17. monty-pup

    monty-pup Minimodder

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    The thing is, in 12 months time Outer Worlds and Metro will be released full price on Steam.

    I’m not sure I will be buying them full price ...

    Xmas 2020. Steam Winter Sale.
     
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  18. adidan

    adidan Guesswork is still work

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    Hello fellow pea, we must be from the same pod.
     
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  19. edzieba

    edzieba Virtual Realist

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    And in several months time when it releases, there will be a 'guide' posted on how to add an shortcut within Steam, and everyone will suddenly remember that you can buy a game from anywhere and still play it on a PC even if Steam has not blessed it with trading cards or fancy hats.

    It seems game developers' universal displeasure with Steam's de-facto monopoly ("nobody wants to release there, but everyone has to") is starting to boil over. While Epic are throwing cash around to make the Epic store attractive to pull themselves up by their bootstraps, I could see Amazon or Google (or someone else with sufficient clout and existing install base to absorb initial setup costs) eating their lunch even without incentives. While the lower fees elsewhere are attractive, it's the curation and moderation (or rather, the utter and total lack thereof leading to an incredible low SNR) that is the major pain point with Steam, and they've painted themselves into a corner there.
     
  20. adidan

    adidan Guesswork is still work

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    That is true, although I'll still be waiting for Steam sales - not because it releases on Epic but because i'm tight. :)

    As for being on the Windows Store, does anybody actually use that?
     
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