Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by arcticstoat, 20 Jun 2011.
if you don't understand the reference...
I have a solution ... go back to what we used to do 10 years ago back when things were much simpler.
-no more public voice chat
-small font chat that's "easy to miss"
-no private message
Those simple changes would eliminate the 12 year old kids calling you an asshole (because you're better than them) and they would make it harder for idiots to draw attention from the chat. Who even reads the chat in PC2 (PC) ? I know I don't because it's so easy to miss. There is so little bitching in BC2 compared to cod partially because of this. Why bother insulting someone if they don't even see what you just said ?
As for voice chat... just use teamspeak/ventrilo like everyone else, god damn it
My solution obviously doesn't include consoles because they are doomed to a world of mediocrity when it comes to online gaming
Admins in servers make life good for all. You don't see sexism or racism going un-punished in the CPC servers. Admins are the key to 'parenting' the gamers and making sure everyone enjoys their game. I think the only way to solve PM's and messages that cannot be moderated is to include a 'panic button', abusing it would result in losing it. But I guess that would only be for a paid service.
I kind of see your point, but, if you treat people with respect, courtesy, kindness, consideration - not forgetting still injecting fun into the game - like most people do IRL then you know what I meant.
I would love it if you were to reply "actually I scream abuse at people all day everyday IRL, which is why I was confused what you meant"
Wow... so when a little boy sends me a death threat and "I know where you live" (which is actually possible thanks to the annoyingness of data online) I'm supposed to just be grateful I've provided him with an outlet which he needs? **** off. **** off right now. No. So basically your post says girl gamers shouldn't get special treatment, but teenage boys do need special treatment? That's insanity. The games themselves should be enough of an outlet.
I rarely got grief online until I got good at some FPS and my friends let slip the enemy team were "pwned by a girl" then it spiralled out of control. On XBL people didn't seem sure I was female for a while, even though I thought my GT was pretty obviously female. Many times I've considered changing my avatar to be male and I know a few friends who have already done this. Unfortunately my youtube channel has made most of the people I play on XBL pretty aware that I'm female, but still the comments there are more sexual whereas the ones on PC are pure seething hatred.
One thing I would add though; is that almost every time I get the abuse, and certainly every time I get the really bad stuff... it's when I've just completely destroyed them at something. I'm pretty thick-skinned and try to laugh most of it off. If they're really annoying me I'll bait them with hugs & kisses. Some of my fellow female gamers aren't though, and I've spent evenings dealing with tears because of these little idiots trying to ruin their self-esteem and stop them gaming
However, I will add one thing for the other side of the coin. The girls who feel the need to have GIRLGAMER in their title or bio... I know they shouldn't have to hide, but these little kids don't need much provoking and you're better off not doing that. I am a gamer. It makes no difference if I'm female or male. There is no advantage when it comes to gaming.
wow,sorry to hear that. it's disturbing to think abusive comments could have such serious impact, and plus the fact it's directed based on nothing but gender.
definitely post those on that website. the site is a great collection of all that is wrong with all those spoiled kids, and society by some extend.
was in age of empires online last week.. they have coop for certain games in the single player part
was paired with a girl or maybe 'black cherry', not sure- so anyway I load into the game and I was given all the army and food and she had a little patch of land and 4 peons xD
I dunno if the developers did this on purpose.. but we complained about it in the main channel (it's beta afterall).. and one of the responses was- women are supposed to sit back and farm.. let the man deal with the army and overall strategy.. you want to win don't you?
while I found it amusing.. it was kind of a put down to all the women who were on playing in the beta at the time (the game is a sausage fest to be honest.. but I'm sure their were women playing)
certain things men can do better than women in general.. but gaming isn't one of them like we can stick our thing in a light socket if we wanted to
I really hope you did not understand my position in this way, because this is absolutely not what i'm saying. I'm saying the problem does not apply to just girls, but it goes for everyone with a spec of identity, and to get the experience you want, you have to find the community you want. Sometimes that means turning your back on something that could otherwise have been great, and that part, yes, you'll have to man/woman up and just deal with.
Death threats are criminal behaviour, and shouldn't be tolerated anywhere, anytime, period. If that happened to you, the kid (or grandpa for all i care) should be reported, arrested, and brought to justice. I'm sorry if i brought up any bad sentiments with my views, but there's always nuance.
There's venting and shouting and there's criminal actions like vandalism and threats, for which I have as little tolerance and understanding as you. Please don't get me wrong on that.
The games themselves should be enough of an outlet... agreed, but they just aren't, clearly. Opinion on thiss matter is irrelevant, it's just not happening.
Wait... wow, i'm sorry but that just went to a whole new level... Are you saying that, irrespective of the current topic of conversation, you are wholly unaware of the issues centering around "bullying" and its emotional ramifications that invades pretty much every demographic in every geographical location?
Because that just came across as a wee little bit... erm... how to be polite... blinkered?
Apart from anything else, this is an abject failure of game GMs and software houses.
Maybe I've been lucky. I've only played one MMO (for 4 years) which is Lord of the Rings Online. And I'm very upfront about actually being female. I've never once had an offensive comment. But then again, if I did, I'd report it instantly and be entirely confident that action would be taken against the offender. I'm guessing the offenders also know that - or have already been banned. Why should it be different in other games.
Anonymity may be the key. But they're not that anonymous to the games companies. EVERY game should have procedures in place to cope with offensive harrassment (whatever kind of harrassment it is). You'll never get rid of the immature idiots. But games companies who allow half their potential market to fade away because playing is so unpleasant may not be as long for this world as they may have hoped.
I never played on consoles after the Sega Megadrive. PC was the way forward and that took me to online gaming.
Text spamming was always around, but good mods would kick the more IQ challenged pretty quickly.
Then came IWnet. Thankyou Infinity Ward for introducing me to the world of uncontrollable and inescapable children who know some swear words. Yes, some have survived puberty but that doesn't mean the brain developed just because the body did.
Luckily I play with a group and we have our own TS server, well policed and passworded. So can mute the morons from IWnet. However, no chance at all of sorting out the in game text chat. Just have to endure it, or play another game.
This behaviour puts me of consoles even more.
This is why I don't play on-line. I cannot be arsed to put up with the immaturity, the misogyny, the pubertal boys and the men (because they invariably are men) with some sort of arrested development disorder trying to act all hard-core because they rate themselves as internet tough guys. If I want to meet people like that I can simply visit Rampton Hospital. We all know it is more than just the Internet Dickwad theory at work. It is reaction formation at its best (or worst).
To be honest, I think the Internet went downhill after 1991, when Tim Berners Lee (Gawd bless 'im) invented HTML. When you start catering to an audience that likes lots of pretty pictures in its reading material, you know that content is bound to suffer. Similarly computer gaming was a lost cause as soon as graphics became sophisticated enough to make imagination --and hence any form of intellectual ability-- obsolete. Computing died as a hobby when it descended from etching your own PCBs and DIY soldering to just slotting garishly-emblazoned component A into brightly-coloured component B.
Things were just fine when it was just geeks on the internet. There was no porn, no 4Chan and no misogyny. There were no terrorist how-to-make-your-own-bomb-for-Allah sites, no Superior-Arian-Race sites, nothing that you could worry your kids coming across by accident. There was just geeks talking geek and doing geek things. We were doing just fine, thanks. We didn't need the rest of the world gate-crashing our party.
So frankly, I'm hoping that the internet will split into two layers. One is the HTML5, mobile App-driven layer which hopefully will get all those annoying Lord-of-the-Flies man-children running off wagging tailed and lolling-tongued like a dog chasing brightly-coloured toy thrown into a far field. The other will be a strictly Usenet-style text-based interface where geeks can commune in peace and remember just how cool it was to play Zork.
OK, perhaps we'll allow Doom or Quake. But you have to run it from DOS. My feeling is: if you cannot write a tight AUTOEXEC.BAT and CONFIG.SYS file, you have no business being here.
this does hold some truth to it.. imagination is a powerful thing- filling in the blanks
remember on the atari 8 bit.. making characters for games what were 3 colors and all of 8-16 pixels tall
I think we all remember tweaking config.sys emm386 and loading all you could into himem (well people our age at least).. my config.sys was tight.. not loose like the black cherry running around today
I haven't even played the witcher 2.. how turned off I am to gaming anymore
actually now that I think about it.. your right- there wasn't all this sexist crap in multiplayer gaming even in quake 2.. remember girls were common and they could frag with the best of them
there was a lot of racist stuff.. but I don't really remember girls being singled out like they are today.. hmm interesting
I didn't know there was a reddit community for this. Definitely a problem though, whenever I notice a girl in game someone invariably makes a rude/stupid comment. It's pretty annoying to hear that and I really wonder if these people realize how moronic they are. Little serial killers in training.
OK, I am not sure how many times I need to say this as it's being completely ignored, so I'll make the text big and annoying for you all:
This is NOT a console only problem!! It exists on PCs just as much!
p.s. I always loved that xkcd Nexxo... she has my name too
Girls do get a bit of a hard time but mainly from the lads in their early teens. In general wether you be a boy or a girl you will take abuse from 1 annoying kid or another on a fairly regular basis if you play online for any decent amount of time.
This is purely down to the fact that the spotty little kid the other side of the phone line knows that you couldnt find him even if you wanted to. The fact of the matter is that you would probably rip them limb from limb if they uttered some of the abuse at you that they would online.
I have caught a few lads out over the past few years where they have decided to abuse me on a late night css mix thinking i would never find them only for me to see their online names down for lan events that i would attend every so often. After politely informing them by way of their clan leaders of who i was and that i would also be attending lan, it is amazing how polite and apologetic these boys then become.
There should be a way to make it compulsary to link online gaming accounts to real life people / address'....Not only would this dramtically reduce the amount of online abuse that goes on it would also cut down the hacking...
This isn't a problem i've encountered actually. Granted i don't play on line very much at all and the only game i've played with people who i know were female was tf2 but on there they were just treated like anyone else. As mentioned above i think this probably has to do with the fact that games are usually hosted on a properly admin'd server so any assholes get banned pretty quickly.
I've written articles to the same extent before, but none have had the coverage of this.
It's one thing to frag a person in deathmatch. It's quite another to slander them for race, sex, nation of origin, or other criteria which either A. they had no control over or B. is honestly none of their concern. If you do it in real life, you pay penalties for it. Why? Because though they may be only words, words are the most dangerous thing in the world. And the law recognizes that.
We don't tolerate this anywhere else-so why tolerate it in games we all play to get away from real life? I don't stop playing games where people are this abusive-I report them. Even America's First Amendment doesn't cover defamatory or hateful speech. There is no precedent for accepting that behavior, and we shouldn't create one now.
If I can't tell spec he shags sheep every night in the forums, what gives me the right to yell it on the minecraft server? (That statement is intended solely for example, I have no idea about minecraft.) spec has often argued that we don't have a right to not be offended, yes, but no progressive-minded country on earth allows slander or libel (depending on its method of transmission.) There is a difference, of course, and we simply shouldn't stand for it.
I have no objection to anyone treating others on the internet with respect, courtesy, etc. I just don't like the implication that people should somehow be forced into acting in such a way on the internet. Afterall the internet is a place where free speech (mostly) reigns and where people are free to act as they will. The consequences of being told to get back in the kitchen or stop being a tight fisted scot and share the loot are only as much as one chooses to let them be.
In truth I have no problem with being insulted on the internet. If it is jovial as it often is I engage in the game of wits and insult them back. If it is genuinely malicious or (more commonly) extremely stupid I avoid or block the person. Anyway, getting off topic here.
You're welcome to go ahead and say that to me on the forums or a minecraft server, I won't complain, because I don't care. Slander me all you want on the internet. One day I might care, but for now I do not. Set up a hate-website dedicated to me, I don't give a toss. Bring any of that crap into my real life and I will start to object because within our normal day to day lives we expect and live by certain rules which govern our behaviour for the intended good of all. The internet does not generally need these rules though and I oppose the idea of them.
There's a lot of apathy and indifference in this thread, which I find a bit nauseating. I suppose it's easy to be complacent when you're not in the target group of abuse.
I think emergent behaviour like that carried out by Anonymous could be useful here. When Anonymous coordinate a huge attack on an individual, it's typically illegal and morally dubious, invading privacy and the like, but they often deserve it and it's incredibly effective. A large community like that being formed around FUoS would be perfectly empowered to persecute people who behave like this online.
It might go down like this:
1. User DEATHLYKILLS66 sends the following message to a female player on XBL: u f***ing c*** f*** of to teh kitchen sl** suck my d***.
2. The comment is photographed and posted on FUoS.
3. His username crops up a second time for similar reasons.
4. Thus confirmed that it isn't an isolated incident, thousands of gamers log in and spam his account, continuously, including in the messages a link to FUoS to serve as an explanation of why it's happening.
5. He doesn't do it again. Like, ever.
Now, I'm sure everyone would like to get on a high horse about this and say that such an approach is immoral, abusive and childish, that two wrongs don't make a right, and so on. But let's face it: it'd work. Anonymous have crippled international corporations with this sort of approach. Basement-dwelling illiterate misogynists wouldn't know what had hit them.
Separate names with a comma.