Right. So I am at present in a situation where I am reaching the end of a rather steep career ladder in this country. This means that I am looking at migrating to another country in due time (I am presently looking at next year this time about). Countries where I am eligible to work are pretty much all of Europe, as I am a German Passport holder. This (to the best of my knowledge) means that I am a Citizen in an EEA Country, and therefore eligible to work and live in the few countries I am eyeing. Countries I am eyeing are largely language restricted. I speak fluent English, German and Afrikaans (similar to Dutch, but not near similar enough to do anything with). Bits of French as well, but not enough to effectively communicate in. This limits my options to pretty much a handful of countries: 1) England/the UK 2) Germany 3) Austria 4) parts of Switzerland My primary focus at present is the UK market, as it would pose the biggest difficulties (I have loads of Family in Germany and Austria). However, some questions need answering. 1) I am 26 years old and employed as a manager of the local Software development department at a "big 3" audit firm. The team I lead is 2 people strong. I've been in this position (by the time I seriously start looking at moving) for going on 2 years. I was previously employed for 3 years as a Senior Analyst/Programmer by a Local Bank. Obviously, my focus lies in the Software development market, preferably for financial services providers. - When looking at jobs in the skills range I have via Jobsite.co.uk (for example), I see that salaries vary massively. As in - between 30K and 300K GBP PA. What are realistic salary expectations, given my job profile? 2) What would the "float" be that one would need to come over there? Obviously, one would fly for an interview, once shortlisted. Should an offer be made, it's a matter of wrapping up here and then moving. How much money is needed for such a move, assuming that I'd probably land with a suitcase and a guitar (that effect at least), and not much else. Bridging the first month (i.e. until the first salary) would include transportation, food, accommodation, etc. ow expensive would this be (roughly only - I am aware that a lot of this would depend completely on lifestyle,etc). Also, keeping in mind that time of year might end up costing more money for me, as This country is completely underequipped to cope with cold temperatures. So new clothing to deal with that would need to be bought that side. 3) What are good places to look for work on the web? Are jobsite any good? What about Monster UK, Gumtree, etc? 4) Any advice?
IMO, if you work at one of the Big 3, I would get them to move you. Having done this a few times with various firms, I can tell you it's the way to do it. They handle everything. If that path isn't available to you, then be aware it will cost you an arm and a leg to move and set up a home. Very few firms are going to hire someone outside the country and pay for a household move with paperwork. It's to big a risk. Dubai, and places like it, are the exception (but they have you by the balls). Intra company takes away the risk, since you are a known. Imagine laying out all the money to move you, get your paperwork square and set you up; just to find out you aren't the right guy. To give you an idea, the move (DXB->JNB) for the 2 of us and 2 cats cost in the neighborhood of 35,000 USD. 5k of that alone was the cats. We had a 40 ft shipping container, granted it was only 2/3s full. As for pay: any company will want to see your current pay scale and salary as part of the interview process. Which automatically will place you at the bottom of the European scale. They will adjust for cost of living, but man, you are screwed. Get used to that. One of the reasons intra company is better, they will usually equalize your pay to the local scale; most do it through a cost of living allowance. If you get hired locally, you won't qualify for that. Now you could luck out, negotiate hard and get a good package. But I have done this 5 times now, and known MANY people that have done it; the odds aren't good (especially given the need to cut costs right now, you should have done this in the late 90's, TBH). If you want to get out of Namibia, and work for the Big 3 I'm thinking of, then wrangle a transfer to the Johannesburg office. Stay 2 or 3 years, and then look to other markets that need your skill set. Latin America looks like it will need you in 5 years. I'll be frank with you here: no financial institution is going to hire and move you at 26 unless you are a fully fledged software guru ninja chuck norris. It makes more sense to expand regionally and develop a network in which you are known to be competent and willing to go the extra mile. I mean, seriously, do you think financial software developers (internally or externally) are going to hire a guy with just a guitar and suitcase? The problem is, IT and software are skill sets that are taught quite robustly world wide. India, Asia, Europe. They are everywhere. So if you were in Europe, why would you hire a guy all the way from Southern Africa? The interview and look-see flights alone make you an expensive recruit. Internally, you are more promising, because you have exposure to the systems, programs and culture. That being said, I do hope you find something. If you want some moving advice, or maybe someone who works for a large software firm that has a lot of US<->UK transitions, I might be able to get you a second opinion.
Big 3? Assuming that translates to Big 4 in the UK then your best bet is definitely to move inter-company. They'll sort everything out for you, pay the costs associated with relocation and transfer you onto the equivalent UK pay scale. They may even put you up in temp accommodation for a bit while you sort yourself out. Having worked in one of the Big 4 there was always plenty of mobility - even for the younger staff. Your salary will depend on where you live. If you work in a Big 4 office with London weighting then you'll be looking at earning around 25%-35% more than you did if you lived in the North (at my pay level it was ~33% different!). Once in the UK you'll be in a better position to find a new job if that is what you want to do.
Having no personal experience, I'm not gonna go on for ages. However, you will be screwed coming here. This place is bloody expensive. Cost of living is ridiculous. I would hit Germany or Switzerland without a second thought. I'm guessing though that the guys above me are right and an inter-company transfer will be your best bet.
I'm sorry, but you actually think that the cost of living is cheaper in Germany or Switzerland?!? Boy, are you in for a surprise.
Sweet jesus you think the cost of living in Switzerland is cheaper than the UK? Try ditching the tabloids.
I've looked into Inter-Company, actually. There's not a snowball's chance in hell of me being moved inter company. Reasons for that being mainly that the Namibian office uses its development department to develop on a platform that Only Botswana and Zimbabwe share. All the other development gets done in Johannesburg. Moving to South Africa is an option I've also considered, but again - Inter company is just not happening (also, because my boss won't let me. They spent 6 months interviewing people to fill this post), and to top it all off, getting a work permit in SA is almost impossible to me. I've tried, but the only way that'll happen is if I give up my German nationality and become Namibian, which is a move that would be rather retarded. As for the recruitment process costing whichever target firm a load of money is something I've also considered. What I would try to do there (but this is possibly a pipe dream) is line up a bunch of interviews in a 1 week period, fly over (at my own expense), and then interview for all the places. The moving would also be something at my own expense (hence me asking what that first month would cost roughly). I am realistic enough to know that I am just not THAT good so that companies would move me at my age. Back to inter-company, there is another issue. There's only a handfull of development departments in the firm worldwide. I am managing the smallest one. I don't think there's a massive chance of 1) one of the current managers resigning/leaving. 2) The office where this happens actually being desperate enough to take me (a foreigner, thus needing motivation to government etc, if this is anything like Namibia/SA), rather than someone that's already senior in the department. This means that even if a post came up (and advertising for them is not something that happens), it'd mean me taking a massive hit by being dropped in seniority level. Thanks for all the input so far, though... it's been very helpful.
This is one of the problems when people go to far in a company to fast. At 26, you are doing something that most people in more developed markets are doing at 35-40. If you want to move, you need to seriously take that into account. Managing a finical software dev department in London (or Berlin or anywhere) at 26 is not going to happen. Start up sure, but not a big accounting/audit house. Again, not being negative, I'm being realistic. Also, if you had started building contacts in other countries, the non advertised jobs would be something you would know about. And people that would be hiring would know who you were and what you have been doing. More importantly they would go to bat for you, which in a large international firm, is crucial. If you knew that Joe in the Cambodia office was retiring in a year, you could have started a lobbying effort to put yourself in the running. FWIW, working here (in SA) on a German passport is easy. IF the firm is willing to do the legwork for you. My wife and I are Americans, and her work permit was cleared with no difficulties. Mine was a bit messier, but then again, I started a company here and work for myself. In her firm there are Germans, Venezuelans, and a few other nationalities. I have friends at Nokia networks that are Germans and French. It's easy if they hire the right people to handle the paperwork. But they have to want you. I'll keep being honest here and suggest the problem is that you never laid out a long term development plan for yourself in the company you are with. I find this to be a larger regional problem, people simply do not plan careers here. If you had sat with a mentor or HR and laid out what they saw as your plan, you laid out yours, set combined development goals, then you might not be in a position where you feel you are being pushed out of a company. It would have allowed you to get training and specific experience for the path you had decided on (software sales, advanced fiance/accounting, management skills) . Too late now, I know, but something to look at when you are interviewing at your next position. Ask about personal development and a normal career path in the company. Stay away from an HR dept that can't answer that. More importantly, you need to sit down and write out where you want to be in 2, 5, 7, and 10 years. And what you need to get there (while being realistic). Trust me, the best thing I ever did was STOP taking jobs that were offered and STARTED going after jobs I wanted. But before I could do that, I needed to know where I was going and what jobs would get me there. I can't believe I'm suggesting this, but have you looked at Dubai? They are showing signs of a pretty quick recovery, and they have a very large financial operation. Surely they need someone. If you can live there for 3-4 years, the experience might be worth while and since everyone is from somewhere else the move would be normal part of the package. Life there isn't terrible, and more then one person I know has entered a large international firm there and transitioned to other markets successfully. Oh, and the cost of living in the core EU countries and Switzerland is pretty close to each other. Small differences here and there, but over all it's with in a small margin of expensive. Don't let the high salaries (compared to southern Africa) fool you, make damn sure the HR dept gives you the averages of basics in the region; rent, petrol, food, etc.
Thanks for the input, Jumeira. The issue with South Africa was not explained properly from my part (apologies): I am a German on a Namibian Permanent Residence. Getting a South African work permit would mean either getting a South African Residency, which should be possible, but would mean I'd have to drop my Namibian one, which is something I wouldn't want to do, as I have too much family here, and South Africa is within easy-travel range of that family. I also agree that I am hired in a position that's not normally given to people in my shoes at my age, especially not at the firm I am at. I have realised this, and it's part of the reason for me asking all these questions. Job advertising sites don't normally give that much info on the client (save for "bank" or "hedge fund" or "fast-growing"). That makes it tricky to split startup company from major financial player. As for Career planning. I have laid out my Career plan. I've done this 2 years ago already. I've been forced to do this by myself, as I have not found any HR person in any firm I worked in that actually knows the first part about these things. I knew when I took this job that it's a dead end road. I took this job for the way it looks on a CV (Something of vital importance around here), as well as the increased pay grade. The position i could theoretically move into is filled by someone that's been in the firm for >15 years, and isn't going anywhere. Silly of me to take the job knowing that it's a dead end, I know. It was (still is) way better than the low-morale workplace I had for the 3 years prior to this one. And I am still learning things that I didn't know about. All these answers will hopefully help me make a decision later this year (and I have decided that this decision WILL be made this year), whether to go overseas for a couple of years and collect more experience and money, or whether to take the dive and start my own development house (something which I have been working on for three years running now, and which has so far been a moderate source of sideline income for me, albeit with gaps in between). At present I am not being pushed out of the company, but feel that while I am still learning new things, the path here is limited, and somewhere in the next year and a half I will have to make a move in one direction or the other.
Just to answer the responses to my post. You get what you pay for. Cost of living relative to standard to living is appalling in the UK compared with Europe generally. But Switzerland regularly comes out top in standard of living rankings and Germany is meant to be superior to the UK as well. I would rather pay more and get more myself.
Having grown up in Germany, I would have to heartily disagree. But we won't go into that. I'm slightly confused. As a German with a residence permit, you would have to change that permit to an SA one; that's clear. That doesn't mean you can't go back to Nam. IIRC, as an EU passport holder you can reside there up to 3 months. Residence permits come and go, it's not like you are giving up your passport. Should you ever want to actually live there again, you would need to get another residence permit, sure. But you'd likely be there with work, which would cover that. So why are you holding on to this residence permit, granted a permanent one, in a country you are trying to leave when you have a right to be there for 90 days at a time. I'm a little out of date in terms of the EU, but I'm fairly certain that even with the open borders, you need a permit to work in another country. So, if you are wanting to work in the UK you'll have to relinquish that Namibian residence permit anyway, right? I had to give up my UAE residence permit when I left and got here, but I still go back and visit friends. I gave up my Lebanese residence permit when I left there, but I still go back on occasion. And I'll give up my SA permit when I move in 2 years to where ever (*cough* China *cough*). Maybe I've had too many residence permits in the last 15 years, but they aren't a reason not to pursue a career opportunity. Closing off the market that is closest to you and where you are most recognizable over something like a residence permit seems....silly. Just another view.
Jumeira: Present day politics are a b*tch in NAM. Just getting my re-entry visa (which I IMHO shouldn't need, as I am a permanent Resident since 1984) costs me half a month's Salary. And that's something i need to do every year. It's not that expensive on an American passport, It's not as expensive on a British passport. It's only on a German Passport. I've been advised by countless people in the visa renewal business to NEVER let go of my Permanent residence, as the government is trying to get rid of Germans that got in before independance. The situation is such that the German Embassy won't invalidate my passport when I get a new one, as otherwise my Permanent Residence will not get transferred into my new passport. So yes, I could get a holiday visa into the country. It does, however look rather unlikely to ever get a working/residence visa here again. A Mate of min is currently going through the ropes in that regard... he's having a hellish time with our local government. A Situation of they have his papers, and he is entitled to residency/citizenship (PLUS, he's married to someone with residency), and yet the govenrment is telling him that he has to give up his South african residency first. The SA Embassy won't let him give it up without a written confirmation that the Nam government will give him citizenship. in short -they're just being tossers. It's a political game, and one that scares the crap out of me. I talked to the English Embassy here last week, and they told me that I wouldn't need to get any visas in the UK to work there. I know i don't need any for Most of the rest of Europe. As a consequence, All I'd need to do is come back once a year and get my re-entry visa sorted, and I could retain my permanent residence here. The irony here is that I COULD have dual citizenship, had I or my Folks known about that ten years ago. There's an exception to the "One citizenship" clause in the German law SPECIFICALLY for Germans residing in Namibia. 10 Years ago, the Namibian Government adjusted their law to close that hole. My little brother still has dual citizenship... I don't That being said - i would normally completely agree with you... it's a silly thing to do. BUT - closing off a the market that is closest to you for family seems... well... less silly.
Got it. FWIW, the Germans have become much more open to dual citizenship these days. My mom has been on my ass to get my German passport back. Not that I will, but it's an option even at 35.
No specific advice but maybe you don't need to write off the Netherlands based on the language. Most people there speak enough English to get you started in a job, especially in software. With your knowledge of German + Afrikaans I'm guessing you'll speak Dutch in no time. If you're interested I can ask some friends for recommendations of job-searching sites specific to the Netherlands.
For sure, Scorpsel. That'd be much appreciated. Some parts of the Netherlands wouldn't even be all that expensive to hit up, as I have an uncle in Aachen (Aix-la-Chapelle in French and English, I believe), which is not too far from the bordering towns of the Netherlands Edit: As for Dutch - i managed to understand basic Flamish (not the same, but again, similar, albeit simpler) in a matter of hours...so maybe you're right
I'm not sure you're getting your original questions answered here. You'd need o have about £5k in your back pocket to be sure of a place to stay anywhere half decent in or around London, but that'd be the best place to start your job hunt. You seem to only be looking at perm salaries too, which would possibly be a mistake. Contracting/temping via an umbrella company would be a good way to go, with immediate availability plus your experience being the selling points. 26 is not a bad age to be expecting circa £35 an hour even in the current climate. And while it's not ideal, there are other industries you can temp in to keep cash trickling in while you search, though tbh I don't think you'd struggle, you communicate well & if your spoken skills are as good as your written then interviews should be no problem for you. The standards in the UK are not as high as some might have you believe.
Landy_Ed. Thanks a million. That's a ton of helpful information in a short post. Contracting is something I have considered, and will (now that you mentioned it), definitely look into some more, as it brings with it some rather interesting options in the long-term plan of things. Have some rep.
