Equipment First dSLR - Canon EOS 400D the right choice? HELP!!

Hey guys,

I need a little bit of help. For the last (painful) four years I've been using a Sony DSC-S600. Finally I have managed to save 800 dollars for a new camera. I was thinking about the Sigma DP-1, because the IQ was nice and it was a small camera. But today I was having a look at some cameras in a shop and I was able to play with a Canon EOS 400D Rebel XTi (although it was off). I always thought that I didn't like dSLRs because they were bulky/heavy, but I had never before had one in my hands... I can't explain what I felt, it was as if it were part of my body!! I LOVED IT, and it didn't feel big/heavy in my hand at all, actually pretty lightweight. Is this what I've been avoiding for the last 4 years? Oh, have I been blind in ignorance...

I'm very seriously considering to buy this camera with the money I've saved, but I'd like to know if it's a good camera to start in the dSLR field. I know it's a great camera (I'm reading reviews from dpreview and imaging-resource right now), and although I'm not an expert in manual (my S600 wouldn't allow it) I know my share of the theory and I've been longing to have full manual control for a very, very long time. It's a lot of money (for me) to spend, so I want to make the right decision...

Would it be better to save a little more and buy the 450D when it's out next month? I'm more keen on the 400D for 2 reasons: it's cheaper, and I don't see big differences between the 400d and the 450D, except a bigger/better LCD and the Digic III engine, compared to the 400D's Digic II. Would that be much of a difference?

Even the slightest comment from more experienced photographers will be immensely appreciated.

Thanks,

Zabe

 

It's always great to upgrade to dSLR. I am not very experienced in photography and have also just recently purchased an XTi in hopes of making it a hobby, but from what I have gathered from my research prior to buying the camera I can tell you these things;

As it stands now there is a newer version of the Canon family coming to the market, the XSi. This means it is an upgraded version putting the other two (XTI and XT) a bit out of date. The upside is it will push the price of the two cameras (again XTi and XT) down and making them easily available if you want to save a few dollars and buy second hand.

In terms of learning how to shoot full manual and all of the other fun stuff that comes with a dSLR like you stated "it'll just be a matter of learning with practice." I have only had a few weekends with my camera and leaving the manual and other photography readings next to the toilet has greatly caught me up with all of the photography terms and how to shoot properly. The manual is a good resource and brings you through the basics of the camera and tells you all about it (well what else would it do?). There are also hundreds of sites out there, including this one, that you can easily post a question and will get a lot of responses and feedback to questions. So learning the new features is up to you, there are unlimited resources at your fingertips.

As far as the camera being outdated I don't think that can happen, I could be wrong. Over time it will wear or dust might get in some hard places but proper care will ensure a long healthy life for your camera. Also you can upgrade the XTi with a lot of accessories and lenses which will broaden your ability to take pictures. But I guess over time as you get better you might be limited to some features on the camera, and unless your a really fast learner and need the extra technology it should be good for a long time to come.

Wrapping it up I am very happy with my purchase! The few weekends that I have been out to use it have been very enjoyable and a HUGE leap from my point and shoot. It allows me to do so much with pictures and in combination with Photoshop CS3 I will eventually learn a lot more and take better pictures each time I head out with the camera in hand. If you are serious about it and will use the camera I think it is a reasonable purchase and you should take the leap into the dSLR world.

Again I am not that experience so I hope anything I said wasn't wrong. There are things I might have left out so others will fill it in. Hope it helps.
-aaron

 

400D? The 450 is avail, but that being said they are both good. Tho TBH im not too sure what the differences are in terms of features. I myself have brought a DSLR in the last month, A Nikon D40. Theres a large difference in using one of these to using a simple point-n-shoot unit.

I loved my godfathers 350D and im pretty sure the 400D's only difference is a self cleaning lens and high MP rate. Either way its a awesome camera, have a look at the Nikon D40/D40x

 

The 400D is my first DSLR, I was a bit hesistant to spend that sort of cash on a camera but i'm very glad I did, great start for a beginner but plenty of room to grow into (skill wise).

Definately worth the money

 

Personally since you've been saving up I'd buy the 400D for cheap + more lenses than an 450D. Since you're in the US I'd keep an eye on the Dell Website, earlier they had a body only 400D for $319 (I was too late to order one) while that price might not come around they've been on sale and they're reputable to buy from. Some of the big differences between the 400D and 450D is that the 450D has spot metering, SD instead of compact flash, new battery design, 2 more megapixels (not that important tbh), along with an IS kit lens, and a larger lcd. Personally I don't think that's worth an extra $300 that could buy a pair of lenses that add more flexability to your shooting.

 

I would argue that the IS in the 450D kit lens and all the other nice little new features doesn't make the 300 dollar difference look all too bad if you consider how much lens you actually can get for that 300. I'd say get the new model, take a lot of pictures and get to know the camera. Then when you're familiar with it you can start to think about what lenses to get.
In honesty I don't think there's that much to gain from 300 dollar lenses. The nifty fifty might be the exception but that's it.
I'd choose the 450d with all the new features (live preview for instance) over the 400d any day as long as the price difference is as low as it is.

I'll add that I'm currently the owner of a 350d and never saw any reason to move to the 400d whereas I really really want the 450d

 

The 400D is an excellent camera (and this is coming from a Nikon D80 owner, so you know I'm not biased). You cannot go wrong with it. Now that the 450D is coming out, it will go down in price significantly and you'll get an utter bargain.

Alternatively, the tweaks on the 450D are not insignificant so it depends on what you prioritise in your choices. Eitehr way, you simply cannot go wrong for the money.

 

First of all, thanks to all for the replies, this is being very helpful.

I see the 400D is a very good camera, and I can get it with the kit lens + a 4gig extreme III compactflash, all for $650. If I decide on the 450D, I would get the camera + kit lens + 4gig extreme III SDHC, all for $950. It's a $300 difference, which for me is a lot of money. Then again, I already saved $800 over time, so an extra $100 is doable over the next month until the 450D is out, with a little effort. I know Canon makes very well built cameras, so I don't think I should be worried about getting it right when it's out. I agree with OleJ in that the IS lens would make a difference (at least that's my experience in P&S cameras), but how about the live preview? Can somebody explain what this is? I thought this was framing like I did in the point&shoot with the lcd and that all dSLRs could do this, but as far as I've read, it seems to be something different. Can somebody explain what the difference is please?

Thanks to all again, this is being incredibly helpful in deciding what to buy.

 

You are right on the money about live preview except for one detail. Not all dSLRs can do this. Quite contrary I reckon. For Canon it was first introduced on the consumer ones with the 450D. It is there on the 40D or something as well but that's a different price range.
So when it comes to Canon live preview is quite new.
But all P&S nowadays have it and have had for a long long time

To explain live preview a little detailed: The LCD shows what is hitting the image sensor so you don't have to use the viewfinder.

To some extent the function negates the whole SLR existence except for the fact that I've yet to find a P&S with a good availability of lenses and an LCD that I can clearly see in all light conditions (and that doesn't send out light (in terms of false light)).

 

I wouldn't pay the $300 difference for the 450D, unless you have your heart set on it. On paper the differences aren't THAT great. But yeah, +1 to you can't go wrong with whatever you buy.

 

Then I'm sold. I assumed since all point&shoots had lcd-framing (or live view, as I now learned it's called), dSLRs would also have it, given that their in a higher level. Framing through the LCD is a VERY big deal for me. I like using the viewfinder, but not as my default method, because I use glasses and I find it quite uncomfortable to look through: the glasses "hit" the camera, they don't let me get as close as I'd like to... if I can't put my eye in there and surround it with darkness to focus on the image better (even though without the glasses I'm kind of blind, lol, and I can't use contacts), I don't feel that much advantage on the viewfinder, which is why framing through the LCD is very important for me.

I can see that the differences between the 400D and the 450D are not that big. 12 mp (meh, when will they get tired of cramming more and more mp...), 3" screen (that's a + point), improved NR (although i see that the 400D is great already), and mostly, the image-stabilized lens (that's a big deal for me too, I don't have parkinson but I get pretty close...). I intend this new dSLR to last veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery long, 5 years at the least, 10 if optics/technology don't make huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge progress, so if I was able to survive 4 years with my S600, I might as well spend the $950 and, even though painfully, get a dSLR that fits all my needs and that I'll be able to enjoy for years.

OK, so EOS 450D it is, then!! Or as it's called over here in the US, Digital Rebel Xsi!! Now, once I get the camera in april, let's see what I'm able to show in the POTM from may on!!!

My deepest gratitude to all of you who took your time in reading/answering my post. $950 is a very big deal for me and I've been waiting a whole year to make this jump... now I feel confident in that I'm making the right choice with the 450D.

Many thanks,

-Zabe-

 

Sounds like the extra $ for the 450D is a good choice for you then since it will make the camera a lot more usable.

 

bought it!!

ok, so my fate has been decided!! just bought the eos 450D in amazon this morning, it should be shipped on april 28th!! yay!!

 

Awesome! I wish it was me Wanna switch for a 350D?

 

hahaha... you're gonna have to be more persuading than that, lol!! i'm so proud of myself, i finally get to have a good dSLR with full manual control... now i'll start saving for my new lens, at some point!! then again for now i have noooooo idea about lenses, so i'll have to start learning about which are sharp and give nice macros/teles!!

special thanks for your comment on the live view thing, that totally made up my mind for the 450D. i've read that the sony a350 has a faster contrast autofocus in live view, but i don't care, cos canon lenses are so much better in my opinion... now i'm itching to have it... on the way home from work and even @ home i've been seeing eeeeeeeevery single tiny bit as a "photographable" object... oooh, i'm gonna have sweeeeeeeeeeeeeet dreams this month until i get the cam... and when i do, i guess my dreams will get diabetic... lol...

 

not sure if this will interest you but i just snagged a brand new sigma 28-135mm lens from henry's.com on ebay for 130 cdn taxes and shipping inc. One of things i like about it is when it's pulled in it's not much longer than the kit lense that came with my camera (18-55). It also has a macro feature. It is probably going to replace my kit lense as a walk about lense. It maybe worth looking into. I have been please with it sofar. I am running it on my 350D or Rebel XT. As far as Ebay stores go i find they have one of the better warranties on used lenses (180 days). can't beat that for a used lens.

 

Congrats mate, I'm sure you'll love it. I'm not sure about Canon US but Canon UK are currently doing a cashback promotion, might be worth looking in to

 

Woohoo! Congrats zabe!

Though I didn't catch this before to offer a different opinion (personally, I'm a "less is more" and the 350D is the perfect target for me due to the separate status LCD), I think you were choosing between "great" and "great". Honestly, the whole canon XT/XTi/XSi series is a joy to own, and I think you'll find it a terrific "stepping" stone into SLR photography.

You'll have to tell me how you like that lens...I'm curious as to whether the IS ends up being that beneficial, or whether it's best to just ebay it and snap up something with a wider aperture along the whole focal range.

 

IS really is only need in either low light with a higher f stop number or in tele photo if you don't want to shoot with a tripod. And yes the larger the aperture (smaller fstop number) the better. but prices can get high extremely fast as your aperture increases with an exception of the nifty fifty.

 

Thanks, actually this DOES interest me a lot, because now I'm looking for a good, super sharp lens. I'm not so obsessed about the zoom, I could do with a prime lens and not find it a problem at all (though I do need IS, I tend to be a little bit shaky, plus I love doing night shots... that 30" shutter is gonna give sweet results with highways @ night... ), but a 28mm at a speedy f/1.4 from canon, or sigma @ f/1.8 can cost a hefty $1100, so that's a no-way for a long while. I'm trying to find a good, shaaaaaarp lens that'll give me good DOF, nice manual foculs (the kit lens from the Xsi is quite toy-ish in that respect, USM motors are much smoother/quieter apparently). I also hear that Sigma lenses (like the DP-1 prime lens) are ultra sharp, but maybe sacrificing a little IQ in order to have the flexibility of the zoom for macros (only for macros, as I said I'm really not big on the zooming) isn't so bad. I read that it's better zooming for the macros (of, let's say, a flower) than physically getting closer to the subject, is this true? Any opinions/recommendations on the matter will be VERY welcome.

No such luck in the US!! Ok, it might only be $20 or so back, but that would still be welcome!!

Well, you'll see the results posted over here and in the potm (I should be getting it on April 28th or so, and the following week I'm going to Seattle, so good chance to start with the Xsi!!), but so far I've been doing a little research on the matter, and I read quite a lot in dpreview.com, specially the photography glossary, it was SO incredibly helpful in learning the theory. They have reviewed canon's 18-55mm IS lens just 2 months ago, and they seem pretty convinced about the results (for a kit lens, that is, obviously it does have its flaws). Not the best lens ever, but a pretty good improvement over the previous kit lens. Anyway, I'm posting 3 links below: 1) the link specifically for the page where they test IS effectiveness, which is in the lower part of the page:

http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/canon_18-55_3p5-5p6_is_c16/page3.asp

2) the link for the whole review of the lens, with lots of tests for you to judge:

http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/canon_18-55_3p5-5p6_is_c16/

and 3) a link to the glossary, for others like me who are seeking to learn more about the dSLR theory.

http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/Glossary/