Is this Really True?

Discussion in 'General' started by tm36usa, 30 Jul 2005.

  1. slaw

    slaw At Argos buying "gold"

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    i am no expert but isn't that kinda what they do?
    either way its must be becoming easier to catch these people with most records being computerized?
     
  2. TheAnimus

    TheAnimus Banned

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    Its not the states fault they live in longbridge. What skills exactly, i mean whats to stop me saying i'm a skilled assembler programmer, i want ONLY to work on ARM700 series, or x86 kernel mode for windows (going market rate is a hefty 3 figures per hour for that). I can do that, so should i not take a job below £250 per hour? Don't be stupid. Its easy for me, as someone who rents to say that, but you can't have thoughts above your station, and if you've got a sizeable mortage, housing benefit won't help until its game over time.

    It dosen't help people in need. A mate of mine in halls used to work in the benefit office at a southern town. He finds its the minority that deserve it don't get anything, they loose thier house, and consiquently are back in work very swiftly. Its the people who don't need the help, had no house in the first place, who find it useful.

    He got on repremand because he pushed his panic button when some 'farther' put his kid on the counter told him to piss and ******** himself, and that he'd come for the clerk.

    The people in longbridge aren't going to be given their mortgage, or any money for a cooling off period. They have no right to stay, they should move were they can get work, or re-train (which the tax-payer should pay for, but they don't). So their left with dole or get a job that might be lower paid. So go for the job.

    My point here is dole beyound 6 months for people who aren't ill is totally un-needed.
     
  3. tm36usa

    tm36usa What's a Dremel?

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    Wow i just got back home and read the whole thing and all I have to say is wow. Even though I dont live in the UK, from what has been said I have to aggree 100% with TheAnimus. People who are too lazy too work shouldnt get the benifits, only a swift kick in the arse to get back to work. I have been restoring tenent (sp) houses this summer part-time. I say restoring because the people who were living there were cheating the welfare system and totaly trashing the house. They used oil heaters for heat which turned the walls/ceiling totaly black. The Insurance guy wouldnt belive that there wasnt a fire. It was that bad. We have been working there since Late may and its still not done. I never expected for the thread to grow so fast.
     
  4. TheAnimus

    TheAnimus Banned

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    never underestimate the power of the troll.
     
  5. chemo

    chemo True Jungle Brother

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    right animus, im sorry but some of the things youve come up with are just plain stupid.
    you say youve never had a problem getting work etc when you can easily have a word with your parents and work for them by the sounds of it. now other people might not have that privalege in life, i sure dont mate. sometimes getting a job is a little harder than that.
    and its not £50 you get for just your food or clothes or friggin computer parts, you have to still pay for all services (gas,water,electric) so its not that much either.
    i agree with you that someone on minimum wage doesnt get much more than someone on benefits, but the benefit is only meant to be a safety net for people who genuinely get sacked/made redundant. and its the only reason i still have a roof over my head now! i wouldnt even like to think where id be if it wasnt there, its not like ive never paid any money into the pot.
    and this bit of one of your posts really got my goat matey
    now like ive said, if it werent for benefit id have been screwed a long time ago. and your answer is just to 'screw' everyone that really needs a bit of support just because dickheads are robbing the system? i think youve got the wrong point here, the government needs to get to hold of the cheaters and still help out the people in need.
    3 months? well lets stay with the rover people, what happens if they dont find anything in 3 months as the work round their way is pretty low? just stop them getting anything at all???

    it seems that youve had a bit of safety net with your parents etc, but if you were alone and had no family or anything im sure you would welcome the benefits that you get and really value it for what it is - a means to an end. i hated living on £50 a week, you cannot do anything with it, but i didnt get anything more than i was entitled to and i much prefer to work for my cash even if im only a few quid up each week compared to the benefits.
    i can vaguely see your main point though, and yes, i do agree that people do stay on the dole because they are lazy and something does need to be done to stop it and push the funds towards people who do need it.
    i just think youve not really been at the harshest end of the line mate thats all.
    :)
     
  6. TheAnimus

    TheAnimus Banned

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    I've never charged my parents for what i've done for them. The worst job i've had was a certain hotel kitchen by far, there i was been paid nicely under minimum wage (hey i was 15).

    Under the new scheme utilities get paid.

    If you can't find work for 3 months, what i'm saying is you have to let your aspectations take a slide. Its not as if the job center has nothing to offer.

    One thing i will say about my parents experiance, the amount of people they get comming for interview, who turn up, say we're not intrested in the job sorry to waste your time, just to keep the dole is outrages.

    Theres such an incredible shortage of work during hte summer here in newquay, and so many people on job seakers.

    6 months for housing, 3 months for petty cash, all you should need, i don't wish to be hard, but if theres no work, look further affeild. In the next 2 years i'll be choosing were to live, two things will dictate that but by far the largest will be were i'll get work.

    My parents live somewere very senic, but the chances i have getting a job thats better than a £8 per hour in cornwall, is low compared to london say. So i'm not going to say i want to live near my parents (my mum is cronicly ill btw, but has been for years so i'm used to that).

    If your out of work for longer than 6 months, you've got some issues with what your looking for. By giving someone £50 for food + spending, people see minimum wage as beneith them.
     
  7. chemo

    chemo True Jungle Brother

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    id like to see where thats from because ive never heard of anything like that before. certainly not the times ive been to the job centre.

    petty cash? you mean the crappy amount you get to feed yourself and everything else you normally take for granted whilst working. its not picnic i can tell you.
    if youre out of work for longer than 6 months then the job centre should step it up a gear and send you out on interviews and such to really get you going into a new job. they certainly dont want you dossing forever.
    i think youve been incredibly lucky in your years up to now and i really hope you never get the taste of the harder end of things where you really need help etc.
     
  8. TheAnimus

    TheAnimus Banned

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    i really don't see the problem with £50 net petty cash.

    £5 a day for food lets you have plenty of meat, and eat like a king, 5 portions of fruit and veg, okay, you might have to have sweed every day but still. £5 a day is more than enough.
    £5 for cleaning products including detergents (you don't *need* fabric softner).

    When you've got no job, its hardly extream to expect you to walk to the supermarket rather than car/bus, and shop around get whats cheapest whereever.

    When you've got no job, u've got no right to get SKY and do pubbings. You can still go out and have mabye one pint.

    My point is food + cleaning stuff, you should be able to make do with £25 a week, and thats healthy. What more do you NEED? Cloaths etc, right now i'm wearing a £2 t-shirt, and some £12 jenes. Okay these aren't what i'd wear if i was going out tonight but you get my drift.

    I've never had to go on the hard end of the stick, the worst hardship i had was when my bank cancled a SWIFT that was my months salery, that was quite devistating (and then at the same time refused to give me credit because i hadn't had a payment that month!). But luckily i have a rainy day account which has enough for food, and i resorted to fixing peoples PCs for socail allowance.

    But at the same time i sit here righting this, working out how much to put in my ISA because of my contract programers sallery. When i don't have a contract, i'll work as a cleaner or anything i can get! As i've said above i don't have a mortgage or anything important to pay. But i can't see why people think their "above" things.
     
  9. chemo

    chemo True Jungle Brother

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    youre still banging on about not paying bills, where have you got that from mate?
    i REALLY think you need to look into that as i think its complete bullsh** really.
    £50 per week is absolutely nothing. and it is NOT petty cash.
    you need to get your head out of the sky and more down to earth, the benefits are not enough now let alone reduce them further. the reason theyre on the borderline of reasonable is so it forces decent people back to work and makes them get into the mental state to go out and earn a better living.
    things must be alot different round your end of the woods, it definately seems like it with some of the stuff your churning out.
     
  10. TheAnimus

    TheAnimus Banned

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    as i've been saying, the housing benefit, and utilities paid ISN'T job seakers (this gets confusing). It might be aviable only to cornwall because its objective one (there are some quircks like that) but i know someone who's got kids was getting it in greater reading. (i was shocked, a tad nieve when i was doing that).

    Remeber i do work with children who are gifted/talented and 90% of the time have piss poor parents, 10% of the time their parents are ill. (funded by AimHigher and Dfsed that stuff).

    the point i'm making is once u have ur room + board paid. £50 is just for petty cash. Which is a lot.

    I've got some paper from AimHigher in my folder here, which tells you how you can live on 3,200£ for 30 weeks including rent + food + everything. This is ment to be outside london. So sudenly £50 petty cash (yup, i'm using that phrase again) is decidence.

    (that 3.2k for 30 weeks is for students, so they don't have to work during term time, its part of the new loan structure 2007)
     
  11. chemo

    chemo True Jungle Brother

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    you dont seem to be getting my point at all.
    as far as ive ever known the benefits do not cover utilities at all. and i think its a joke how you are saying that £50 is alot to live on for 7 days with this in mind.
    if it is the case that where you live that the bills are included with the benefits then you get £50 on top of this then it only works out to just over £7 per day for general shopping. which is nothing in my eyes.
    why are you so sore about people getting money from funds that the majority of people pay into just the same as you do and when they need some of it back they are receiving it. they deserve to get a reasonable amount back once theyve paid into it.
    are you upset about the amount of tax you pay each month? or are you upset about people leeching the system? which ill agree with, something needs to be done with those w*nkers.
     
  12. TheAnimus

    TheAnimus Banned

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    i agree too both of those points. (tax + leechers)

    I dislike the current structure.
    Basic Job Seakers gives you £50 to do what you want when ur seaking a job
    You can then get the welfair. Which pays everything you need to stay alive except foodies (running water is included).

    £7 for general shopping (hey this might be the 20 year old in me) is a lot.

    i mean say you want a snack, tesco value noodles, 8p, add some sweetcorn (half a tin say, 18p). Bit too much sault + msg + nasties like that. But its not too unhealthy for a snack, costs < 30p requires one dish to be washed up. Awsome.

    I really can't see how anyone can call £50 pocket money not much? Sorry!
     
  13. alextwo

    alextwo <a href="http://forums.bit-tech.net/showpost.php?p

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    There are a lot of jobs out there (not everywhere granted) but people don't want to do some crappy job for a low wage and these are the people who start complaining about immigrants stealing there jobs but fail to see that they are willing to work harder, longer and for less money. If people are genuinely ill then fair enough but if they are claiming benefits because they can't find a job then they shouldn't be given money for doing nothing, they should be given some sort of menial council work to earn their £50 a week.
     
  14. chemo

    chemo True Jungle Brother

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    well animus, i think the way your talking about it as 'petty cash' and 'pocket money' is quite childish and pretty offensive too. its a lifeline that was put there to help out those in need, you talk as if its a luxury and that most people actually want to do it!
    and you still dont see that if someone has paid taxes then why cant they have a little help when theyre struggling? and im still not sold on this thing that pays for bills etc either.

    and alextwo, why the hell has it got to be menial jobs that are offered to people out of work??? why not voluntary jobs? working with the sick/elderly/kids or even in the council offices helping out there. the last thing someone out of work needs is to be kicked whilst theyre down, so giving them a semi rewarding job/activity to do that actually keeps their brain active would be better.
     
  15. TheAnimus

    TheAnimus Banned

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    indeed, in most cities now they have gum patrol people with jet washers. They are paying those guys £8 an hour apparently in reading :jawdrop:

    Not that i'm wishing to say its un-skilled, you will need to have stamina to use a presure washer for that length of time. But its because people don't want to do that, they can't get enough people. Now you can't really force someone to do that easily, if they didn't want to do that job well, take pride in really making a city center nicer, then they'll just slack off.

    chemo, i'm calling it petty cash, because at the end of the day, thats what it is. Welfare keeps a warm room for you (i know there are problems getting accomidation if you don't already have it) with nice running water. what more do you really NEED in life? Its a hell of a lot more than the majority of people in poorer parts have.
    WikiPedia defines Petty Cash as
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petty_cash
    "expenditures where it is not practical to make the disbursement by check"
    Which is what job seakers is, its where its not pratical to get the government to pay it?

    After seeing the way most people cook, i'd be in favour of making people goto food halls (mostly) staffed by un-employed, were there taught how to cook cheap nutricious meals.
     
  16. Uncle Psychosis

    Uncle Psychosis Classically Trained

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    Moving house to find work is simply not an option for a lot of people. It costs an absolute fortune to move house these days---few hundred quid for a survey, lawyers fees, the reluctance of banks to give mortgages to the unemployed, you name it. Add the complications of having to find a job for your partner, rip your kids away from school and friends, etc, and it's just not an option. Don't forget that selling a house in an area thats just suffered mass unemployment is going to be nigh on impossible---who's going to want to move to an area with no work?

    As for there being "plenty" of work, that's just bollocks. In Longbridge there are now 5000 people looking for work---there are not 5000 jobs going spare there, that's for sure. Add to that the reluctance of employers to take on staff who are over qualified (try having a degree and going for work in a shop) and finding work is really not that easy.

    £50 may be a lot of money to a young, unmarried, childless guy like you---but to a married father of three with credit card debts and a mortgage to pay it's absolute peanuts.

    If you don't like our benefits system then I suggest you go and live somewhere without one. Just pray that you never take ill or get made redundant.

    Sam
     
  17. chemo

    chemo True Jungle Brother

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    well ive just looked up your word. petty.

    now feeding yourself as youve already said is of big importance as im sure every would agree with, its not trivial and nor is it petty.
    let alone all the other stuff/bills that come in. just because youve lost youre job doesnt mean you lose all responsibilties for outgoings from the household.
     
  18. robbins1940

    robbins1940 Banned

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    I am on Income Support and ICA. The two come to £82 exactly per week.

    Haven't had a job since 1992(not that an unemployed YT was a job). I mean why should I jump through hoops to get a job. Get paid almost bugger all working my but off for 50 hours for just £120 a week after tax and then lose about £80 of that a week in rent/mortage?

    I refuse to give this government my money to fund illegal wars and bring in ID cards and microchips to enslave the population. And when they make ID cards complusely I am prepared to go to prison over it.

    Sod them I refuse to play their game.
     
  19. slaw

    slaw At Argos buying "gold"

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    are you for real?
     
  20. Uncle Psychosis

    Uncle Psychosis Classically Trained

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    Well, he's got a bit of a point...If the minimum wage was at a higher level then there'd be more incentive to work :D

    Sam
     

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