I was going to name the thread "Oh great, now we're f'd", but thought the chosen one more to the point Is anyone really surprised at Iran's reaction? There's only so many times they (isreal) can be warned they're going too far and they need to calm down. Really don't want to get dragged into it. I think the US, UK etc need to tell them; "we've tried to get a diplomatic end to this, if you carry on you're on your own" Yes what happened last year was truly awful, but they can't continue to use that as reasoning for bombing the crap out of highly populated areas. At some point you have to say enough is enough.
Problem is there are a lot of tech, business, economic, and religious reasons the allied nations want to back them up. It's not as simple as just shrugging and walking away. Just like Russia with Ukraine, Israel know they can kind of do what they want and allied nations have to back them up. Kind of messed up, but that's modern geopolitics for you!
Isreal reminds me of people at school, total wimps who would run their mouth off at anyone and anyone cause they knew their gigantor mate would back them up. Makes me very nervous of a not insignificant war coming.
This is the issue though isn't it.., You've got satanyahoo on one side knowing as soon as he ends any war he will be tried for his crimes...unless he gives them 'from the river to the sea' (likud party official line is this place will be israel, full stop). And on the other side you've got the US, run by AIPAC, with most of their so called elected officials bankrolled by them and worried they will be without a job if they don't bow down to them....can you imagine at any point in history where an elected official of one nation wore the army uniform of another and said kill all the children .? And yet it goes unpunished.. Then they wonder why they are hated in the world. You can call these people terrorists all youd like but you know well sure that you yourself might end up doing as they are if your home is taken over by some **** from Brooklyn who said that the land is his ancestral land from over 3500 years ago...controlled your air, water, food, had checkpoints where you had to show your papers (remind you of anywhere.?), Then they go and bomb another sovereign nation...isn't that nation then allowed to say 'we are defending ourselves like Israel when we launch missiles into your crowded population saying 'we believe there was 1 single threat there and killing 500 of you is just what happens in war''. When Israel commits terrorism (the exploding pagers) we are silent...but imagine for a second if the Russians did this. If your allegiances are to a flag more then to innocent children and you hide behind any ideology then that ideology needs to be stamped out..be that Isis (strange theyv never attacked Israel, eh?), or even Zionism *****.
The only pressure Israel will bow to is a hard-line approach from the US and that doesn't seem like it's on the cards any time soon. I don't know what Harris' opinion is on this, from a potential presidential standpoint; as opposed to a party line position. This has to stop. It sounds like Bibi is about to formally declare war on Iran. What then, half the Arab nations get drawn in?
One of my fears is that this becomes an angle/hook for the up coming elections. You can bet your ass that trump will be itching to kick off "Gulf War with a Vengeance'. War is great for their economy, plays to his demographics thirst for blood and allows them to dump a shed ton of troops and ordnance just south of Ukraine. That will only bolster Isreal's testicular fortitude and willingness to go full Leroy Jenkins This is fear number 2. Iran, Lebanon, Syria for definite, possibly Jordan, then maybe Libya, do Iraq and Afghanistan kick off again? The whole of the middle east and north Africa could well well be at war
Trump has made a massive deal out of not getting involved in wars, so I'm not convinced about this. On the other hand, he's boasted about being the best President ever as far as Israel is concerned, so who knows? I think it's much, much more likely that any US involvement (whoever ends up President in January) in the ongoing/upcoming conflict will be restricted to military aid rather than any form of boots on the ground.
Myself , personally ... Israel has not been killing the terrorist's that have invaded them .. they have been hell bent on total anhelation of the Palestinian people ... and haven't they done their job well!! And now .,. bombing the crap out of Iran. Im sure there are bad people in there that deserve what's coming to them ... ( i fear the western world has done worse ) but still .... you dont massacre an entire country just because .. Its heartbreaking to watch. What do they expect the Lebanese & the Iranians to do??? Sit there and just take it?? This will all end badly and like always this destruction of humanity is down too a few evil men. The worlds fcuked.
There wasn't a great deal of provocation for any invasions when he was last in office as far as I can remember. Whether he actually does anything if elected is questionable, but some posturing and provocative speeches about action might fuel Isreal's bravery. And now isreal have got troops on the ground in Lebanon, 1 confirmed isreali casualty, no doubt there will be many more on both sides. I genuinely detest humanity at times.
Why is it, at least to me, it seems every one wants to pretend last October did not happen? and sit there and preach? I love how the whole world seems to think they can tell Israel what to do. And how they know what is best for them. As for Iran? lmao, blow them to kingdom come. And I say that as some one who has a top ten mate from there, who is deaf in one ear thanks to being tortured by their regime. In fact, back when 9/11 happened he said to me, and I quote - "I wish we could go into Iran next and sort that out. I could go home then". Not one Israeli bullet or missile has been fired first. Not ONE. I think people need to understand that. Unlike the UK, who has gotten into plenty of wars that did not concern them or in defence of their very being.
Yeah that is spot on. Trump does not like war. He is a businessman and sees it as a massive waste of money for the most part. Which is odd for a Rep, as they are usually the hawks. The fact is as they are showing (Israel) they do not need any help on the ground. They are light years ahead of any one else when it comes to technology. Amazingly so. Seriously that phone/walkie talkie / pager **** was something out of a movie (Law Abiding Citizen to be exact).
Literally in the first post mate. No one here has said that what happened last October wasn't horrific, but what's happened isn't a response, it's a full on campaign of destruction. Are Hezbollah total cretins for hiding in and underneath heavily populated areas for protection? Of course they are, but you can not say that killing a hundred innocent people for 1 terrorist is justified. And there is no "fired first", they've just been taking it in turns for 75years, but this sustained attack into multiple countries has gone too far and could drag us into a war. You really want our troops over there getting killed because a genocidal megalomaniac is trying his best to wipe out an entire race?
The only way it will stop is if you wipe them out. Sometimes you find that is the case. This war has been waiting for decades. Just as the whole middle east was about to sign a peace deal last October happened. Spear headed again by Iran. Who do not want peace and have made it very clear their only ambition is to wipe them from the face of the earth. You can not reason or make peace with that. Iran is a horrible place. Public hangings, women beaten and stoned to death. If we need another big war to end that? well I suppose it is time. There is no peaceful way out here, sadly. It is and has been inevitable and has been put off for decades. Maybe one day you should sit down with an Iranian in the UK and talk to them about what it is like out there. And why so many have come here for asylum, like my mate did. And there is a fired first. Every time Hamas or Hezbollah etc fire missiles at Israel, Israel block most of them and then retaliate. The last time Iran tried and got nowhere Israel sent a missile very close to one of their underground nuclear facilities as a way of them showing that you know? "We know" and even that did not deter them.
I could understand that if Israel spent their days firing missiles all over the place hoping one hits. But they don't do they? Hamas and Hezbollah just keep rocking up and firing missiles every now and then and I guess they poked the doggy with the stick long enough for it to bite. Maybe there is some political timing in there? who knows? like I said I am amazed it has not turned into a full blown war for as long as it has. This, as I said, is all because of Iran. Hiding behind their puppet regimes of terrorists they fund and supply weapons to. TBH at least if it happens now we may get some more time on this earth, 'cause if they get their hands on nukes we are all screwed way faster.
The events of October last year were beyond horrific but, by any standards, the Israeli over-reach is orders of magnitude worse. This is not blood for blood. This is hatred off the chain. No amount of vile acts by terrorists can justify such an insane response. They're inviting their own destruction and banking on fear of the western powers holding it back. I don't have the numbers but it seems Netanyahu does not have the support of the majority of Israelis and, as already mentioned, he's reading from the American playbook on war as a means to retain power within his own government.
Just because it is not our way, doesn't give us the right to intervene. One of my best mates who I lived with at uni and to this day is still in my phone as "dirty Arab", is of Iranian descent. Don't assume just because you have second hand knowledge of it that other people don't. But that's their country, their laws, their beliefs, and we should not force our beliefs onto them just as we would not tolerate it the other way round.
We're not. This is between Israel and them atm. And yeah, their country their rules. Which don't include randomly firing missiles into another country.
You contradict yourself, mate. Here you are saying their country their rules, but also stating what you think Israel ought to do. Not being funny man but if that attack was on this country like 7/7, and if it was someone you knew being massacred you would feel differently. I don't like how every one seems to know what is best for Israel and how they should take stuff like that on the chin. No way. I've never followed all of the crap going on out there, but over the past decade I have noticed a pattern. Hamas fire rockets into Israel, Israel responds a couple of days later. Hezbollah do the same from Lebanon, same. Not once has Israel, in all of the time I have been paying attention to it, fired first. Not once. Look I know we have a lot of muzzos here in the UK now and I know because of that the general consensus is to hate Jews and etc (even our politicians are doing so) but that doesn't make any of it right. The fact that Israel is full of temp bomb shelters pretty much says it all to me. In fact, at the festival it took about an hour of bombs being taken out before they even realised it was serious. That is how bad it is. Countless of the victims who did survive have now taken their own lives due to what they saw and were put through that day. It is absolutely inexcusable. No land battle or argument over religion can excuse what happened. F-ed up part of it is you're shunned if you even spoke out about it. Screw that.
No. No no no no, a thousand times no. What isreal is doing is nothing about their laws and punishments of their own people for breaking them. This is not about hating Jews, this is nothing to do with any Muslim population here, and this is exactly where you've lost any grip on reality and taking this personally. I want them to stop because I don't want the UK to get dragged into gulf war 3. I want them to stop because we're far beyond revenge, bombing highly densely populated areas in the hope they kill 1 or 2 terrorists is not appropriate force, it's tantamount to genocide. All they're doing is ensuring that hamas and Hezbollah will have a huge line of new recruits so they can continue to justify what they do. Can you go back and find who fired the first shot? Why is definitely isreal retaliating missile attacks? Why can't the missile attacks be the retaliation? The first shots were fired by the allies when they carved out a country that didn't exist and hoped the ejected natives would take it on the chin. That's "the first shot" you're so obsessed with. Innocent people are dying. In fact sod the innocent bit, people are dying. People who have done nothing to harm anyone else are dying. Soldiers on both sides who are only following orders are dying, for no reason other than big men sitting in safety told them to. Everyone needs to stop, but they won't. The best we can hope for is de-escalation and going back to taking pot shots at each other.
