Well unfortunately when it comes to those sorts of wars we don't have a choice. It sucks, but I guess at my age I have learned that sometimes you don't get a choice. War isn't nice either. Never was and never will be. And yeah, I hate seeing people die too but unfortunately I really don't know what else could have been done. Until you can calm religion down in those areas (fat chance) then it will just go on and on. And we are talking about extremists here. TBH the only way I could even think to stop the situation is completely unrealistic, and that is move the Jewish people to another part of the planet. Which of course will never happen in a million years. It's sad that Israel are now at peace with almost all of the middle east, but Iran just ain't having none of it. And never will, either. Just before this happened Israel were about to sign a peace deal with every one but Iran. And Iran just could not accept that as it would have isolated them and shown that they were the only ones who just outright did not want peace. And the peed up part is that for the most part Iran have been using other countries and other civilian populations to do their dirty work. Like really, it is actually a miracle that so far in history we have not gone in and decked them. I don't understand why, either. We decked Iraq and etc. But Iran we just seem to have stood back and watched and hoped for the best.
I think you've answered your own question there, haven't you? Invading Iraq was a *********** that destabilised the entire region, cost hundreds of thousands of lives and led to all manner of further problems with the consequences still being felt today. And invading Iran would be much, much worse. But it's okay, because you've recognised that "War isn't nice" whilst sitting in an armchair and cheerleading for "decking" other countries. Good job.
Blame Blair for that and his pack of lies. I didn’t do it did I? He should be in prison. Iran is a totally different proposition though. They have major nuclear ambitions too and it seems not even Israel’s recent teaser shot right on top of one didn’t put them off.
I think you'll find the illegal settlements, constant expansion of Israel, use of skunkspray, and practice of apartheid were going on well before your 'day zero' of October 7th. If you think you can kill people into submission you have another thing coming...perhaps thats what Hitler thought when he wanted to annihilate the Jews...but who knows. For every person who had someone murdered by the apartheid regime you will make 10 legitimate resistance fighters. Your beloved country uses the 'we are defending ourselves' line a lot...it's going to be great to see Iran use the same logic as the iron dome failed and Israel gets a taste of its own medicine ...that's the way this ends. I have no problem with Jewish people, so long as their religion doesn't advocate killing others and stealing their land, or teaching that the world should be enslaved to them..those people could be called whatever they want to be and id still hate them. Without the bribery of the USA and it's so called elected representatives there would be no support for Israel....If the Americans loved the Jewish people so much why didn't they grant them a piece of land as they wanted after ww2..?
And Why shouldn't Iran have nukes.? What gives Israel, the UK, or the USA the right to dictate to other sovereign nations what they can or can't develop.... remembering how the only country to fire a nuclear weapon is the USA.
How about the rules Israel seems to be living by.? You know, where all nonJews are your slaves, that the river to the sea will be Israeli? But I have long since learnt that to argue with anyone who is a Zionist is pointless...bigoted racists will never learn and they forget that their people suffered injustices doesn't mean they learn and instil far worse injustice on others...if that is what they learnt then Zionism should be stamped out. That is not to say Judaism or Jewish people should be.
I think when looking at this you have to think what the impact to an equivalent attack would be in your own country. In the UK it would by perhaps 82,000 people killed in one day. Nothing remotely on that scale has ever happened here and I can't actually imagine how that would feel to any of us. And then you add the extreme nature of the attack. This was not a bomb going off but individuals being shot at plus the kidnapping, the rape and torture and the fact that there were a lot of young victims and that the victims were more likely to be on the liberal side of the political spectrum there. So you have an Israeli army that is definitely more concerned with their own safety than that of the Gazan civilians against Hamas who has no concern for it's own civilian population, even to the point of wanting them to be killed in the hope of somehow increasing pressure on Israel. It's almost impossible to see how this ends as the Israeli population don't see any solution in a situation where Hamas goes back to building tunnels and stockpiling rockets and Hamas won't ever release all the hostages as that might be their only hope of staying alive. To say nothing of the fact that Netanyahu is likly out of a job and back in court if the war stops. I'd like to have hope but I'm not sure what one can hope for.
"Fun" fact (disclaimer: fact is not at all fun): nearly half (43.5 per cent, 2013, Index Mundi per New Scientist) of the population of Gaza is 14 or under. The median age is 18, compared to around 40 across Europe. Statistically speaking, that means that of the 41,802 Palestinians killed as of the 4th of October this year around 18,000 were most likely literal children under the age of 14. I don't think safety has anything to do with it. Israel has, so far, killed as many as 129 Palestinian journalists and media workers, 120 academics, and 224 humanitarian aid workers - and that's not even counting the UN workers it's working its way through in Lebanon right now. And to bounce back to the start of your post for a final bit of mathematical comparative: If we flip this on its head, and pretend that we're the Palestinians instead of the Israelis, you're looking at a population differential of 86:1. That means around 3,616,057 people would have died. Five percent of the UK's population. On this we agree.
Sad to say it, but I don't think there is any. The only solution I can see is some other 3rd party taking over the whole region and administering a peace settlement as a unified nation. Unfortunately that's utterly impossible.
I think you missed or chose to leave aside the point of my comparisons. My point was that if an equivalent act happens to the UK or to France or the Netherlands or whatever country, you pick it's hard to envisage exactly how we might feel or choose to react. We know how Hamas has decided to react every time as it got it's reaction in first.
I would hope that our reaction wouldn't include such one-sided massacre... but, then again, I'm not entirely ignorant of history. It's hard for us as a country to act high-and-mighty about blowing up a refugee camp, hospital, school, or tower block when we've got things like Dresden in our history. (25,000 people killed in three days of fire-bombing across the entirety of the inner city, most of whom were women and children.)
Again, though, as has been discussed previously, this is just a cycle of revenge from both sides so it becomes largely meaningless to talk about action & reaction, or one side "getting its reaction in first". Both sides can always point to a previous incident as justification for their actions.
We can't just pin point any one recent event as the start. The region has effectively been at war constantly since the 14th century BC and the only peace has only ever been under foreign occupation when some big bad empire enforced order. Of course said empires did plenty of things wrong too, doesn't matter if it was England who dreamed up the current two state solution without consulting the locals or the ancient Babylonians committing genocide or Alexander the Great messing around in the region. What makes matters even worse is that we can't even define which country legitimately exists in what area of that part of the world, when the same town has historically been part of 7 different countries some of which don't exist anymore then what country is the rightful ruler?
Wheres Mr vault-tech now The ***** running Israel are a reflection of the views of its people. The vilest war criminals we have ever known in our lifetime are continuing to say the quiet part out loud.Then they shout 'antisemitism' whenever it's questioned. The Jews were offered a place in California and south America after the Europeans massacred them, but your boy Herzl wanted Palestine and whatever shady dealings he did with Balfour led to it. It's an illegitimate state. Behaving illegally. Hopefully it'll end soon
It won’t end soon, Netanyahu cares only about his political ambitions. Even his own people don’t seem to matter, if they did he would be doing everything possible to get the hostages out safely, rather than letting his army shoot ambulance crews. In their choice of leader, the Israeli people have done themselves a massive disservice, just as Hamas has for the Palestinians, in starting all this in the first place. It should be remembered the Palestinians did not vote for what Hamas became, after gaining power in Gaza.
This conflict did not start Oktober 7. Oktober 7 was the pretext they needed to justify their ethnic cleansing campaign and future land grab. Before they could kick this off they needed A: Pretext B: Control of the narrative i.e. the media (they have a stranglehold on MSM and if anyone wanna knee jerk respond and call me names for pointing it out and or claim otherwise that's ok) and C: Someone to support and back them politically, financially and militarily. Added. Pertaining narrative (I'll do my best to keep this example brief..ish) We call this a war, but (and by the way, this is a pathology in the west in general, I'm not going to expand too much on it but suffice is to say we have a habit of calling things for what they are not and then force 'consent' people into submitting to that what ever the narrative says we should call it) just because you call something a war does not make it true. The narrative across western media is to call this a war. However. A war suggests a somewhat equal footing. You have two countries (or several, if other countries decide to invite themselves to the conflict and make it their own) each with their own army, navy and air-force. The Palestinians have neither an army, navy or air-force. What we call a 'war' is nothing less than slaughter of Semitic Palestinians, most of whom are defenseless women and children with a few Hamas fighters thrown into the mix. We also make sure to call the aggressor a victim and the victim the aggressor and anyone who opposes the slaughter as anti-semitic. The 'irony' of that accusation I'm not going to expand on. Isn't it interesting thou?
i used to live next to a family of Palestinians in Derby, and they basically said Netanyahu and Hamas are basically two sides of the same coin, they both need each other to stay in power, Netanyahu treats the Palestinians like garbage, which galvanises the population against him, who rally under Hamas who are the only group promising Vengeance and fighting the holy war, then they lash out at Israel who use that anger to justify treating the Palestinians like garbage, starting the cycle anew and with each cycle Netanyahu increases his stranglehold on power, and Hamas get ever more support both open and covert
