Graphics Mantle - will someone please explain before my head explodes.....

OK so I'm currently looking at GPU's for a build ( as per my other thread) now I've been googling a lot and I keep seeing a huge amount chatter about Mantle. Now I have a basic understanding of what its supposed to be (I think), but peoples opinions vary widely between "it'll make all Nvidia GPUs obselete for ever," to "it'll be rubbish and ruin AMD"!

So given all that ( and I know no one will really know until its released) will it be a game changer, and is it worth being a deciding factor in a GPU purchase?

 

It's an API designed to replace Direct X and improve game performance.

It will apparently work fine on Nvidia and AMD GPUs, and will reduce the CPU overheads. IE - AMD reckon that a 8350 8 core Piledriver will no longer bottleneck any GPUs and will only need to be used to around 20%.

Whether or not it will favour either brand? is yet to be seen.

 

See I was lead to believe that it would only really favour AMD GPUs in a couple of forums.

 

At first that was the consensus, yes. However it soon became clear that it wasn't the case.

You can probably bet that it will work better with AMD GPUs, just because AMD are working closely with the devs using it (kinda like why AMD GPUs are better for BF4).

Right now? it's a tough one. To guarantee the absolute best results it's a good idea to go AMD for your GPU. Otherwise? well the games will no doubt support Direct X too.

 

Are you sure about this?

Well, whilst AMD are saying that mantle's non-proprietary, it also needs NVidia to at least have driver support for the api...

(& this is assuming that there's no h/w changes needed or limitations as well, which 'could' mean that none/only some of the currently used gfx cards will actually work)

...& i can find nothing at all that states that they're definitely going to provide it.


Naturally though, if there are the major gains that have been suggested over DirectX & a reasonable no of games are actually released that use mantle, it would be a little foolish of NVidia not to support it.

 

No one is sure of anything related to mantle except AMD and the devs who programmed it. All of whom refuse to say anything good or bad. If Nvidia came out and said they will def support it that would be a huge win for AMD.

Personally think support on nvidia will be like physics on AMD, Its somewhat there but you suffer by missing the key bits.

We have seen 1 screen saying 45% increase in performance figures, Based on what we do not know. ( it was using duel gpus is all we do know from the screen posted )

Most people using the r290 series of cards would probably prefer AMD focuses on there cards working instead of fixing up mantle at this point in time.

Wether it will work on Nvidia or not is an unknown, Nvidia would likely have to code for it. More likely we will see Nvidia develop there own Low level API and run that instead. ( they already have 1)

When if or If we will see a none sponsored AMD game running mantle will determain if its going to be a huge success or not.

Thief will likely be the first Mantle released game that the public gets to test mantle on. As BF4 is been bug fixed.

Still have my 7970 that I picked up cheap to test Mantle with, Can resell the card when im done for double or tripple what I paid if the current mining craze holds.

 

Simple answer: Unless you are happy waiting six months to see how the first few Mantle supporting titles fare, then no it shouldn't be a factor.

I suspect that Mantle will have a greater effect on low and mid range GPUs which struggle to run games playably on DirectX.

 

This. It's more for their APUs, given the GPUs don't really need it from a FPS POV.

According to AMD Mantle will work on any hardware supporting GCN. Which apparently Geforce cards have.

 

So basically it doesn't make my decision any easiers....

 

Just get yourself a GTX770 or R280X and you'll be happy for a while

 

Lol yeah its a toss up between those 2!

Most people seem to say a 770 is better, but then others say the extra GB of RAM on the 280x will be useful down the line!

Never had this problem in my console days!!

 

Well, whilst it's a couple of months old this might appear to suggest that NVidia need to actively support it in some manner...

Since then, there's been the removal of the necessity for a CGN amd card (related, for example, here), but there's been nothing that firms up what extra stuff might be needed.


if you've seen something that explicitly states that NVidia don't need to do anything to support mantle then obviously i'll stand corrected.


[Edit]

Thinking about DirectX as an api, whilst obviously gfx cards have supported DirectX for half of ever, it certainly appeared that (at least) amd added support for 11.2 (for at least the 7000 series) via a driver update.

This perhaps suggests that NVidia would have to do the same with mantle(?).

[End Edit]

The other side to this is that what's a relatively high end card now, will obviously become a mid range card without too much time passing...

...plus there's the introduction of 4K monitors, where currently the recommendation seems to be to use a pair of 290Xs in crossfire, which are hardly cheap.


So, *if* it's the case that this allows for the optimisation of things in such a way that there is a significant improvement...

(as has been suggested - & logically makes sense given that console h/w isn't exactly cutting edge, but significantly gains from a unified low level programming approach being available... ...though naturally this also extends to there being the same processor & audio h/w & whatnot)

...& the games that you want to play support it...

(as with physx, since arguably you can lower settings if your fps aren't up to scratch so we're only looking at aesthetics with mantle from a game player's perspective, it arguably doesn't matter if it's only a small proportion of games if they're the ones that you actually want to play)

...then it'll also add extra longevity to whatever you buy/own & (at least potentially) allow a reasonable 4K experience without spending a fortune.

 

All fair points... but OP's budget was £200

We already just about convinced him to stump up an extra £40 to buy one of the top cards from the last gen, I don't think we're going to be able to twist his arm as far as two top end cards from the current!

 

i certainly wasn't suggesting that.

Simply noting that, alongside potentially adding longevity, it could also make half decent 4K gaming affordable... if it lives up to the hype & gets support of course.

 

We wait with bated breath - but it is making nobody's next card purchase decisions any easier

 

I can go £260 absolute top! That's it, and god help me if my wife ever finds out how much this build is costing......

 

When do you plan to buy this lot? My advice to you would be to look at the Today Only page on the big day, and go with your gut feeling.

 

You know I had actually thought about doing that, the GPU is being bought outright whereas the rest will be on finance so that is an option!

 

To be honest, just pick your card and then ask Scan on their facebook page if they will put it on today only, they nearly always do!

 

That Windforce 770 is still £239.99 on there