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News Microsoft announces Surface pricing

Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by Gareth Halfacree, 17 Oct 2012.

  1. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Staff Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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  2. Snips

    Snips I can do dat, giz a job

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  3. Anfield

    Anfield Well-Known Member

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    Personally I think the Microsoft RT / Arm tablets will fail, the "proper" coming later that run full windows instead of RT could be much more successful.
     
  4. Snips

    Snips I can do dat, giz a job

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    Surface RT = iPad replacement, Surface Pro = laptop/ultrabook replacement?
     
  5. Hg

    Hg The game known as life

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    I think the lack of 'apps'/programs will be its downfall on the RT version.
    The full fat version i would like to see do well to help reduce Apples lead on the sector, but im not sure if it will allow you to run standard windows programs off the net or will it force you to download programs through windows store and thus closing off the market.
     
  6. Tyrmot

    Tyrmot New Member

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    This seems somewhat overpriced to me - though I'm more interested in the x86 version, so will wait to see how that is priced. One would have thought they would want to undercut apple at this point - not try to play the ipad at its own game.
     
  7. RichCreedy

    RichCreedy Hey What Who

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    the full fat windows 8, will allow you to install any normal x86/x64 program that currently runs on windows 7, wether its through steam, direct download or whatever, new ui apps will have to come through the windows store
     
  8. Jehla

    Jehla Member

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    I'm not sure a £12 wireless keyboard is a fair comparison to the ms cover considering there will most likely be 3rd party keyboards availble.

    On a different note, what x86 program's are people planning to running? Personally most things I can't get on rt wouldn't run on the hardware anyway.
     
  9. Icy EyeG

    Icy EyeG Controlled by Eyebrow Powers™

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    They would, if you had a compiler for it. I use many of the programs listed on portableapps.com. Most of them are light enough, and if you had a windows compiler for ARM (or if you could have a MinGW for ARM), most programs could be ported, IMAO.
     
  10. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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  11. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    It's not overpriced. You have twice the RAM and storage capacity as the iPad, you have Office, you have XBox Music (free ad-supported streaming, or 10$ per month - unlimited download/streaming no ads), and if you add the Apple media card reader, Apples cover, and Apple keyboard to match the Surface RT 32GB features, you are spending way over about 140$ more than the RT, and you still don't have all the built-in apps, and a real full size USB port. Sure you don't have the screen resolution, but at 10inch the current resolution is sufficient, as it uses vector based graphic engine so everything is always smooth. You don't need higher/lower quality icon, and interface. Everything scales properly.
     
  12. steveo_mcg

    steveo_mcg New Member

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    But you're buying into a "new" ecosystem, there is no way of knowing how well appointed the RT app store will be. Buying an iPad is currently a safe bet.

    MS are at a major disadvantage being late to the party they're relying on there being enough people who haven't bought into Apple and willing to spend that kind of money or are willing to spend the same again to switch. Few of the Android tablets have managed to compete on spec and features with the iPad so it'll be interesting to see how MS do.
     
  13. Stelph

    Stelph Member

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    Also Apple may have just done a masterstroke and swept the rug out from under microsoft by announcing the iPad mini on the 23rd October. Microsoft were always going to struggle to force people away from iPads to their tablet so I think their main target would have been people who didnt like Android and didnt want to invest lots of money into an iPad, a cheap iPad mini gives them a very tempting alternative and so I think youll end up seeing the iPad mini selling like hotcakes and the surface only selling to people who must have microsoft outlook which I dont think will be a huge number of people.

    Expect price drops quite soon after xmas
     
  14. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    Not really. Because Microsoft has something that Android doesn't: the name "Windows". People associate "Windows", with ease of use, with "just like on my computer at home", with "plenty of programs", with "secure", I believe. Plus you mention that you have Office, and now people know "it has everything I need", and "I can do work on the go, like a laptop".

    Apps will come and quickly. Why? Because all Modern UI apps works on BOTH Windows 8 and Windows RT, with no effort needed by the developer, due to the WinRT infrastructure set to them. So right now, you just widely expand the potential marketshare. Making a very tempting invitation, plus cheaper price than developing on iOS. Especially for developers as they get to use Visual Studio, the best development IDE there is, from what I am aware of.
    So, I expect a lot of apps, and will quickly catch up to iPad. Plus consumers will love it more. Because your tablet apps, can be installed without additional fees on the desktop or their laptop.

    So there are a lot of value for developers and consumers.

    Obviously, I don't expect for Windows 8 to catch up the next year to Apple, that's impossible, but how many iOS apps are flash light, fart, some million's iteration of pong and other basic/classic games like that? A LOT of redundancy. Something that Microsoft has the edge of not having... at least not for now.
     
  15. steveo_mcg

    steveo_mcg New Member

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    I would agree with you 5 years ago, but Android is a household name and if not Google certainly is probably more so.

    Apple is much bigger advantage, its synonymous with "just works" and fun, Windows on the other hand is synonymous with work and getting your son round to fix the computer. It might be getting better but a bad reputation like that takes a lot of work to repair.

    The one advantage they might have is if Win8 gains some traction and people prefer to stick to one environment between their home computer and tablet. But since Intel are complaining that people are not buying as many computers as before it might be a while before the masses migrate to a modern Windows.

    It will likely catch up but its not already there, Apple is. Unless you need or want a MS tablet why would you bother when the iPad already does what you probably need to do for the same price and Android is cheaper. Plus we've seen MS sink golden opportunities in the past.

    Like I said it'll be interesting to see how they get on.
     
  16. Cei

    Cei pew pew pew

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    More to the point, will Bit-Tech be reviewing?
     
  17. Jehla

    Jehla Member

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    Sorry, I was unclear. I meant that most things I use that are currently x86 only would not run very well at all on tablet hardware. Games, handbrake, etc.
     
  18. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    I see your point, but in my view, I don't see people seeing Android as you are seeing, including myself.

    I don't have a cellphone, or a smart phone. I know shocking!
    However I have been having peeks here and there and this is what I got from Android.

    When people talk about Android to others or me, I hear a lot of jargon is passed, and mainly the word "rooting". To me at least, I see the Android platform, as a toy, basically a device for people that like their hands dirty. Always tweak this, tweak that, OC the phone, replace the OS, community Android this and that, that one is better for this and that, and that one is better for this and that. When it occurs, I just simply go in my head: "ENNNNNOOUUUGGTHH!!!! Already!". I love building and repairing computers, but when I am on the go, I don't have time for this ****. I just want to enjoy my device, the same why I enjoy my MP3 player. I don't care about any of this. I don't have the patience for this.

    To be honest I have my eyes on the Windows Phone 8 right now. I don't plan to buy it though. I want to finish my study first, get a job, THEN at which point I'll actually make a decision.
     
  19. Er-El

    Er-El New Member

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    Holy cow that's cheap! I'm buying 5.
     
  20. Guinevere

    Guinevere Mega Mom

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    I agree the surface isn't overpriced but don't agree you get twice the storage capacity. The three options are the same and they're banking on most people picking it up with a keyboard cover.

    So in price iPad 3 = Surface + Cover. I think this was very wise of MS even if you're only getting a screen of comparable quality to an iPad 2.

    Where do I start?

    Office is great and might make a difference... certainly with the marketing. Xbox music sounds a bit like Spotify doesn't it, and maybe this time MS is going to do something in the music space and not abandon it two years later. Trouble is enterprise is going to (at first) want x86 compatibility or an extensive app market. RT has a very very long way to go before it will have the app support than an iPad can provide. And I'm talking pro apps here not just casual stuff like fruit ninja and bad piggies.

    Most people don't buy smart covers, apple keyboards and card readers. So the value of having them 'included' looks good on paper but doesn't mean the same to all people.

    As to screen resolution... oh my. Saying the elements of screen are vector based is completely irrelevant when comparing PPI levels. I thought the world now had a common understanding that unless you have particularly bad eyesight or a tolerance for extreme aliasing screens with high PPI ratings are significantly preferable to those with lower PPI.

    It doesn't matter if the actual content of the pixels was generated from a raster bitmap or from a vector representation if the size of the pixels means small on screen elements can't be displayed in sufficient detail. Vector rendered images have some benefits (and some disadvantages) over raster stored images but negating the downsides to a screen with low PPI isn't one of them. iOS also renders some elements using vectors by the way but most standard onscreen assets other than text is pulled from pre-rendered raster images as it's faster and more forgiving on battery consumption. As an iOS developer I have to use rendered assets in a few compulsory places (EG the App icon) but for everything else I'm free to use vector images, and I do. But I don't use vectors for everything as that would be an insane waste of both my time and more importantly CPU / GPU cycles.

    I would challenge anyone who tends to notice the difference between 'good' and 'bad' screens to spend time with a retina device compared to an equivalent non retina and not say they prefer the retina. I'd also do this test with the a new high PPI kindle over the older generations.

    If everything else is equal, smaller pixels make for better images. End of.

    The caveat of course is that if you really can't see or care for the difference between a ?x768 screen and ?x1536 screen (or equivalent) then you'll be fine with an RT table or an older generation iPad.
     

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