Displays Need a suitable monitor recommendation

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by thelaw, 12 Aug 2011.

  1. thelaw

    thelaw What's a Dremel?

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    The last thing i need to upgrade my pc is a gaming monitor - i currently use a Acer AL1715B 17" TFT 12ms (1280x1024) display so obviously most monitors out there will be a improvement even the cheap ones :)

    I would like it to run nicely without straining my gpu ideally i would want a bigger screen too so i dont have to strain my eyes anymore and i feel a little small with my 17" when the other lads talk about how big there's is:waah:

    My budget is around the £100 mark give or take a few more quid if say one is going for £110 etc and i have no brand preference just would want something built to last and well black in colour is my only personal preferences.
     
  2. MrGumby

    MrGumby CPC 464 User

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  3. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    Is it possible to stretch it to ~150 pounds (could be a bit cheaper depending on the stores you go to, I don't know much about U.K stores)?

    Think that would be a but a BIG step up, and that will crush a huge amount of monitors out there, and provide you a much better computer and gaming experience for your system. Think of it as you'll get the same as an Apple iMac display (but 23inch instead of 22), but not glossy, and with an adjustable stand (and I mean ADJUSTABLE... tilting a screen 5 degree, is not considered by me as "adjustable"). If you can push 150 pounds (again, maybe less.. depending on witch store you get it): I recommend the LG IPS231P-BN

    I would suggest to go higher in budget though, but you are tying my hands really good with such a tiny budget. I find it VERY shameful, that you spend all that money on this fantastic monitor, and the main and most important thing.. the monitor.. you are cutting corners like no tomorrow. I mean if you did some casual work, and web surfing.. sure they are MANY monitors and cheaper too that will do the trick... But aside from that... I am afraid there is nothing.

    If you can't, I would recommend to save your money and when it reach 250-350 pounds incl VAT, then we will talk, and a real above descent monitor could be purchased.

    What's so special about these fancy menchy screen, and higher priced one? You ask.
    (post coming...)
     
    Last edited: 12 Aug 2011
  4. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    A very good question!
    Well enjoy!


    No, Seriously :)
    You get to use an LCD panel technology called IPS or if you prefer: In-Plane Switching panel. Instead of the awful TN panel (which is what you are using now).
    Ok so what does it provide?

    Ok well, the monitors featuring this panel technology (today) is not aimed at the "ultra low budget that it's a joke", so you get some quality product, for most models, not glossy, descent to proper back light spreading, better back light technology (better (more white) LED back light (White LED backlight isn't white), or better high grade CFL lamp for fantastic white light, and if you have a money tree or won the loto: RGB LED, where you have red, green and blue LED's scattered everywhere on the back, put very close together, to provide a white light, and provide full adjustable setting on the colors intensity of these LED's to provide perfect back light illumination edge to edge.
    High grade CFL back light is better than white LED's back light.


    Advantages of this panel technology are:
    -> For computers monitors using an IPS panel, it feature a full color processor and true 8-bit Look Up Table to ensure proper color reproduction with the monitor settings.

    What does that mean?
    Well, assuming you don't have the monitor set at absurd settings, you are able to see "more colors". Especially, for the less than 100 pounds monitor you are looking at.

    Original:
    [​IMG]

    What it's "supposed to look like" (colors changed to show more of the gray):
    [​IMG]

    (exaggeration done on purpose on both picture to show the difference, and try for YOUR monitor to see the difference). I did this, as I can't come to you with my IPS panel, and start doing comparisons.
    Don't start spreading this... it's just for you to explain my point.

    For those here that asks: yes the first picture is quite a light gray, but it's visible on my side if you look closely. I picked that color, as I am SURE at 100% that OP won't see it.
    The above is not scientific AT ALL.. it's just to try and explain color "rounding" if you will that occurs with a cheap TN panel, and no color processor, and one with a better panel (IPS) technology and with a color processor.

    If you don't see the first one at all, even if your force your self, and playing with your settings of the monitor, without having everything else look screwed up... well, the monitor can't produce it properly.

    Ok, so it's not everyday you see very light gray... but imagine all the other colors that gets blended as other colors, whether it's a dark color and something in between. The color processor helps in reducing this blending issue, mixed with the fact that IPS panels generally have a high grade LCD liquid to provide the ability to provide better color reproduction.

    So at the end of the day, pictures, games, movies (especially HD ones) look superb., and you really see color details that you didn't before.

    [edit]
    Now about color reproduction:
    Have a look at youtube they are plenty of examples showing how colors are better reproduced.. for example this one:

    Notice how the butterfly appear orangy on the TN panel, instead of the rich red:


    Now imagine this everywhere for every color.
    [/edit]

    -> Additionally, you have no backlight bleeding on colors, and very low on blacks (assuming you don't set the monitor brightness to "make me blind" setting. (back light bleeding can't be avoided, limitation of LCD technology). TN panels back light bleeding affects everything.. blacks, whites, and colors. This can reduce headaches (if you have any) and provide better and more enjoyable image output, even if you don't really notice on a TN panel on colors (professionals do, as they are used to a lot better screens, that usually costs more than your computer all together at the day you purchased it)

    -> Sharper image. As IPS panels pixels ares filled fully, allowing the light to pass or block fully, text is sharper, images looks better of course, making it easier to read.
    Due to this pixel filling difference, if you put your monitor in portrait mode, your colors don't change, and your text is just as sharp as it was when it was in landscape mode. Go ahead, flip your screen, and you'll see what you'll get.

    -> View angle... what view angle limitation?
    Are you tired of always adjusting your screen to get the full colors? Well... IPS panels... as long as you are not behind it, you'll see the very same great image (well almost if you want to be technical). It provides a nice 178 degree in ALL directions, vertical, horizontal... diagonal, if you want to go there.

    Who said I was done?
    Don't take my word for it, check out this tread:
    http://forums.bit-tech.net/showthread.php?t=214177
     
    Last edited: 12 Aug 2011
  5. thelaw

    thelaw What's a Dremel?

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    ok, so i thought my first post was clear, i am after a monitor which is going to be a improvement on my current one, what i am not after is the latest, greatest, must have all the bells and whistles with chocolate sauce with a cherry on the top IPS 9999x9999 resolution with quantum speed MS rates with 20 klingon disruptor cannons.....personally signed by bill gates and comes with 15 playboy bunnies on the side..

    All i am after is a recommendation for a 1980x1080 monitor as this seems to be the standard res these days, that is bigger size than my current 17 inch one in the budget range i would like to spend in. I am too old and long in the tooth to be hooked up in the latest greatest must have now latest tech so it does not have to be the latest IPS monitors either, a TFT/LCD will be fine with me.

    Too throw a random in that i was looking at, something like this to give people a idea...maybe someone could suggest one in that price range of my £100 give or take range - a monitor that would be fit for purpose

    http://www.ebuyer.com/248927

    or even this on offer

    http://www.dabs.com/products/samsun...een-1920-x-1080-5ms-vga-lcd-monitor-7DZS.html

    Appreciate that i am running a very old monitor with a higher ms rate and a older res setting with a small screen so most newer monitors even the cheaper ones will be a vast improvement on what i currently have (as far as my eyes and viewing pleasure will be concerned) compared to what i have now.
     
    Last edited: 12 Aug 2011
  6. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    No they are not.. they are descent...
    So, in your case, then buy anything. Even a 30 pounds one will be better.

    But something reasonable... well anything... they are all the same for each price point.
    I just find very shameful, to have such a great computer, and skip on something critical such a descent monitor. It's like a HUGE step behind compared to CRT monitors in term of image output.


    The problem on YOUR post, is that you said you want something BETTER.
    Then, now you say now that you care anything above bare-bone, yet your computer specs says everywhere that you want and like: "bells and whistles with chocolate sauce with a cherry on the top IPS 9999x9999 resolution with quantum speed MS rates with 20 klingon disruptor cannons.....personally signed by bill gates and comes with 15 playboy bunnies on the side.." x2

    So yea, you are not clear at all.


    P.S: The only time you can say that you are "too old and long in the tooth" is when you'll be in your 80's. Until then, go to bed, and wake up from the RIGHT side of the bed, Mr. Frustrated About Life.

    I was trying to be friendly and helpful, and provide you some knowledge so that you know what you buy. You could have explained that you sadly can't afford to stretch your budget and can't wait, and I would come with a nice collection of monitor and nice comparison between them... but no, you have to be as you are, so now, I don't care, hence this wonderful and helpful post.
     
    Last edited: 12 Aug 2011
  7. Soniclord

    Soniclord What's a Dremel?

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  8. 3lusive

    3lusive Minimodder

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    Out of all the ones suggested (except the IPS model which will be better than the rest), I'd easily get the BenQ - nice matte finish, good colours, and doesn't break the bank. But you have to think like this, if you are spending £100 on the monitor, you can spend £50 more and get a much better stand and much better viewing angles than on the benq (but if you absolutely had £100 to spend yes I would get Benq G2220HD or its newer model the G2222HDL, same screen but one has an LED backlight, review of it here).

    But if I had £150 to spend I probably would get the LG IPS, because you get more for your money.
     
  9. thelaw

    thelaw What's a Dremel?

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    ahh goodbytes, you took my reply too much to heart, yes i was taken a bit back by your piss taking of your first reply which basically mocked what i was asking after given the budget range i was looking at in which you pointed out "there were 0 monitors available" (which i see you have now edited out of your response)....so my second reply was to just make it much clearer on my requirements..

    To the others that have made recommendations thank you for taking the time to reply with genuine recommendations i will look into those now.
     
    Last edited: 12 Aug 2011
  10. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    I was kidding with "there were 0 monitors available", but then thought after of not being funny at all (it sucked, sorry) and removed it. I posted too quickly, sorry.
     
  11. thelaw

    thelaw What's a Dremel?

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    Thats alright, i appreciate the time you took to talk(type) about the difference in the panels it just wasn't going to suit me requirement/budget wise and felt like it was a mock post with the first bit of the reply which you took out. I also apologise for my smarmy comment too.


    Ok ---- so far folks so far i am leaning towards the BenQ G2222HDL 21.5-inch Widescreen LED Back-Light Monitor (Full-HD, DVI-D, Glossy Black, 5ms,) given its LED backlit and full HD..

    http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B002UJ31...exr-21&creative=22110&creativeASIN=B002UJ31A0

    Any other suggestions?
     
    Last edited: 12 Aug 2011
  12. 3lusive

    3lusive Minimodder

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    Its stated as glossy black but it is definitely matte (as the review states). You cant tell the AG coating is there, unlike some screens, and if you are coming from a glossy screen you will never go back to suffering from horrible glare. Also, unlike some tv's and screens which have a really dodgy Dynamic contrast setting (making light scenes go annoyingly bright), this one actually works quite well and it just makes everything more richer and deeper, so if you like that kind of thing it can be good for gaming and movies. Amazon have great after sales support, so if you do buy it I would get it with them above other smaller retailers.

    The only problems with it are the stand and viewing angles, but you get that with all the displays at that price point (unless you spend extra and get the LG). But if not, thats a good screen that will be an upgrade from your last one. Use http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/ to calibrate your displays
     
  13. thelaw

    thelaw What's a Dremel?

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    Cheers 3lusive,

    I note that my card has a HDMI point is it worth getting a hdmi to dvi cable to go with it for the HD support or shall i get a straight forward dvi to dvi cable, i have not used hdmi before so not sure if it offers advantages over dvi cables.
     
  14. 3lusive

    3lusive Minimodder

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    It should produce the exact same picture (both digital signals). Looking at the reviews it seems you will need to buy a dvi cable if it doesnt come with one (probably come with vga), they only cost a few pounds though. If you want to connect a console, bluray player etc, you can do so with a HDMI-DVI adapter that works the exact same.
     
  15. thelaw

    thelaw What's a Dremel?

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    Any difference in connection between a dvi -i or a dvi -d connect, my card state its a dvi- i output but the monitor is dvi-d in put, i take a dvi-i cable will slot into a dvi-d input without too much issue?
     
  16. immoral

    immoral What's a Dremel?

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    How does the Dell U2311h compare to the LG IPS231P-BN?
    Obviously the Dell uses CCFL instead of LED but how does this affect the display,
    I've heard that backlight bleeding is a problem for the Dell monitor, does anyone have any experience with this?

    Thanks,
    /Dante
     
  17. 3lusive

    3lusive Minimodder

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    Just get a dvi-d cable like the one linked. That will fit into the dvi-i port on your card (it just means integrated so it can accept both digital and analogue signal, so you can use a VGA adaptor with it for old monitors)

    http://www.scan.co.uk/products/2m-d...ble-(for-tft-monitors)-premium-signal-quality
     
  18. 3lusive

    3lusive Minimodder

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    Basically, they are both IPS displays so you will get much better viewing angles (much less colour/contrast shift when you move your head off centre, unlike on a TN display). They are both good monitors and have high quality stands. Only major difference is the backlight and price. The LG IPS is about £50 cheaper, and it has an LED backlight. Backlight bleeding is a problem for any monitor, the U2311 that I got had backlight bleeding in the corners, but its just a loterry that tbh. While it isnt true that one is absolutely better than the other, I would go with the LG because I think it will have a higher overall contrast ratio than the Dell one (and Im not referring to the companies stated spec). If you want to see both in action see here and here
     
  19. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes How many wifi's does it have?

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    The Dell one also has Display Port, better OSD menu, a bit faster (but nothing large between the 2.. in fact I don't think you'll notice anything unless you look them very up-close, and side by side).

    The only fix for the back light bleeding, is getting PVA panels, which are able to proerly block the light... but it's much slower, so its not great for many gaming and fast action movies. Dont' get me wrong PVA did HUGE improvement (like IPS panels) over the years in getting faster without sacrificing anything. But PVA was always the slowest, and unlike last gen IPS panels or today, it's still too slow today to be considered for all types of games, and fast action video's/movie's and not see any lag, and ghosting (for ordinary people, I am not talking about hard core FPS championship players, that played the very same game since they were 8, to be the best of the best, and have develop super super fast twitch reflexes, like you took 900 coffees.
     
  20. 3lusive

    3lusive Minimodder

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    Yea I forgot to mention response times but like you say there wont be much difference. Also, I didnt know this till recently but my Samsung TV (its like a 3 series model from 09) uses an S-PVA panel which is why it has insanely good viewing angles and contrast ratio, like you can literally go completely off-axis both vertically and horizontally and it maintains colour completely. I used to use the TV as my main gaming tv for over a year while at university (and im talking heavy cod sessions on Gamebattles and all sorts, over 800 hours on Cod) and it was completely fine, so I do now think response times are completely over rated even for gamers - Im more interested whether it can produce deep blacks etc for my movies and gaming.
     
    Last edited: 12 Aug 2011

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