I see your point, but we already have strict control of what you can do in private anyway, although this seems like it's going to the extreme to some, I, and many others think it's fine. The general public couldn't be trusted with handguns, so we got that right taken away, we can't be trusted to be polite and not assume that because you're in a pub no-one minds if you light up. I know a couple of pubs decided to take a no-smoking stance (mainly chain pubs), but it was only a tiny handful. I think a "government initiative" would have been a more PC way of doing it, but it wouldn't have made much of a difference, and you'd still be limited to about 1 pub in 100 if you really didn't like the smoke. Actually, thinking about it, I don't really care about smokers in pubs, I'm used to it, living in a family where 3 out of the 4 people are smokers. What I dislike more about a pub is when they're overcrowded nightclub wannabes, which usually means they're packed to the brim with chain smoking chavs. I much prefer a quieter "proper" pub but they're difficult to come by nowadays I think the thing that really annoys me and lead me to the pro-ban side is how my dad and my brother leave their *** ends all over my desk and in the cups and glasses, so you get a nice ashey smell to them even after they've been cleaned I've somehow managed to argue myself onto the opposite side of an argument
Your analogy is flawed. In a free society, you choose to expose yourself to tobacco smoke if you enter a pub that allows smoking and has smokers in it. If you don't like this, you leave the pub. The final say goes to the person who owns the pub though, not to the goverment. Of course, we're living in an increasingly less free society. As you point out, our government, government of the people for the people, is saying that we cannot be trusted with this and that. They are saying that because some people misuse and abuse things that we should all have our rights removed. Are you happy being treated like a child? I am not, if you want to be treated like a child I don't mind but I resent people who want to be treated like children stamping all over my rights.
See above edit of me realising how retarded I am XD I honestly don't have a clue what I'm on about sometimes
I understand some people get very stressed and smoking helps them alot. But for the vast majority they are stupidly ignorant and some damn right inconsiderate. To smoke near someone who does not smoke is a violation of their rights. And if you cant see that im sorry but you are clearly ignorant. Further more. Once hooked on nicoteen you no longer smoke to feel calm, you smoke to feel normal. You feel agitated without smoking. This means you are paying to feel like someone who doesn't smoke would. i wont be lookings at this again as i know all you smokers will not agree with a word i say. If you did you wouldn't be smokers. One day youll get it into your heads, but then again. Youll probably die before you do. Btw nice yellow nails and teeth and scaley leathery skin Well you will have by the time your older. You can Always tell if someone is a smoker from their look. Generaly their IQ is the next give away Call me a fasist or what ever i want but i am pointing out the fact non smokers should not have to suffer having smokers breathing smoke around them. The smell makes me feel sick and my mum is badly asmatic. All you people smoking around her gives her terribly tight chests where she can not physical breath properly and your telling me you have a right to do that to people? If you think so then you are very selfish.
Our liver metabolises benzene into something toxic, benzene itself it harmless. Back on topic. There's a limit to you choosing something, if I went to cash a cheque in a bank which subsequently was robbed by armed robbers, and in the stuggle I was shot and died, then it's my fault for choosing to enter the bank. I know that doesn't quite hold up, but the point is there.
My nails look healthy, my teeth look fine and my skin, well, it's nice and purdy. 142, you mean? ****, are all of us smokers quite smart, then?! Awesome! As for the rest of your post: either I am the one exception in a very big group of smokers, or you are wrong. I'm leaning towards the latter.
Flawed reasoning. The robbers have commited an aggressive act against your person. The bankers did not consent to being robbed and shot at. Therefore the robbers were in the wrong. In a building where the owner has consented to the consumption of tobacco, the patrons have nothing to complain about. The only viable analogy along your lines is if you were to walk into a shooting gallery with the express intention of standing in between the shooters and the target, and then complain when you get shot.
No, to drive over someone who does not drive is the correct analogy. You're mistakenly assuming that it is a perfect analogue, but it's not. Cigarette smoke is inherently harmful, driving is not, unless practiced in an unsafe manner. Cigarette smoke is known to be harmful, proved scientifically, and there is practically no good reason to do it. In addition, in people who do not smoke but are forced to be party to it, they suffer from eye and throat irritation, coughs, increased risk of cancer, risk of emphysema, and generally are uncomfortable, and in the susceptible it can start asthma attacks, which can be fatal. There are also those who are allergic, and their lungs produce adhesions and start collecting fluid, lowering their effective breath capacity. At this point, you ask for the right to inflict that upon people? That's kind of like saying I have the right to go around kicking people in the gonads or shooting them in the foot. I'm in favor not only of banning smoking but classifying it as child abuse to smoke around children. They have no choice and can't just go somewhere else. Did I smoke? Yup, but I kicked the habit successfully. I do believe that's earned me the right to say something on the matter.
Driving is inherantly harmfull to those who you drive past. They inhale exhaust fumes. Those are inherently harmful. There is no "100% safe" driving when you're driving past humans. Carbon monoxide (in car fumes) is also proven scientifically to be bad for humans. So we're left with what, you disliking smoking and not disliking driving? Your opinion on whether someone should choose to do something that isn't an act of aggression or similar against you is irrelevent. For sufferers of illness, shall we say that cancer patients walking around a shopping centre where people with colds and the flu are coughing and sneezing is tantamount to shooting them in the foot (it's worse some might say, it could kill them afterall)? Sick people have it tough, this i know, for I am one of them. But I don't ask expect to be able to go into a private (or even publicly) owned place and ask them to turn all the lights down and make everyone be quiet because my head feels like it's being hit with a sledge hammer. I would suggest that people who are allergic or asthmatic do not enter into smokey pubs. I would also suggest that they should not force that pub and it's patrons to stop consuming tobacco just because they, a single person, want to be allowed to enter that pub on their own terms. While it is nice when people are considerate of my illness, I have never and will never expect strangers to alter their lifestyle just because it suits me. This comes back to the assholes and non-assholes thing, as opposed to the smoker and non-smoker thing really. That and taking personal responsibility.
The smell alone isn't enough reason to ban something. Well, I support the ban anyway. But that's probably because I have really sensitive eyes and lungs to smoke where I can hardly breath and my eyes get puffy, red and dry whenever I'm near too much secondhand smoke. That and it's just bad for your health anyway.
i used to ride the bus a lot and it seemed like most people were courteous enough to step away from the shelter a bit before they lit up, even on the -30 days really, though, even if they ban smoking in the shelters, who is going to enforce it? if somebody wants to smoke in the bus stop they are going to, whether there is a sign or not.
or you know, people can stop whining, and just avoid smokers. Yeah, while some of you have asthma, and others; some people just seem to feel the need to walk out of their way to go past a group of smokers, and purposely make an ass of themselves. Generally, i see anywhere outdoors, beyond the requisite some 20 feet from the doors to be fair game. You experience if for all of three seconds. Don't like it? Don't hang out there.
I actually quite like the smell of smoke, wouldn't start it though. I don't see why I have to step away if some jackarse in the middle of a town square (with many others surrounding him) lights up. Driving is not inherently dangerous, there are such low concentrations of CO and other gases (along with catalytic converters in most) that it makes no difference. I have not seen a study to show exhaust gas exposure for a second causes harm.
You don't. You can stay put. Or you can leave. Or you could ask him to stop or himself move. Why are people so oblivious to these options? Rubbish, you put enough cars in an area and someone breathing enough of the air, and they're going to be affected. Just like people who're exposed to enough cigarette smoke often enough can also get sick. Perhaps the degree is lesser, but there is still damage being done. Just because the area lacks study doesn't mean we can ignore the obvious facts, CO is bad for humans, cars emit CO, therefore car exhaust fumes harm people. I always find it dissapointing in these threads that many people seem to run out of arguments and just stop posting. If you're going to hold facist beliefs at least make sure they can be tested by the process of debate instead of just ignoring debate and keeping your beliefs
I can't see the problem with smoking in an open area myself, the smoke dissipates very quickly, unless s/he blows smoke in your face, it hardly makes a difference to the atmosphere if your stood about a metre away. The one thing that bugs me about it though is the litter left behind by smokers, since many will absent mindedly drop their butt when they're done with it, but that's mainly due to badly enforced littering laws, if a few more fines got slapped around then people would soon stop.
