nobody can predict the moment of revolution http://vimeo.com/29513113 thoughts? if anyone here is in the minneapolis/st paul mn metro area, and interested in taking part, occupymn will be demonstrating this saturday.
Why? What would that solve? Personally I would follow a strict moral code, and follow the guidelines that are set by the police force that I work for. So for example, if there were some people in a fenced off area, I wouldn't walk up to them, spray them, and then walk away. Because anyone with good morals, knows that this is wrong.
That's not exactly what happened is it? I thought it wasn't just a few people peacefully hanging out? They weren't screaming insults at the police? Well then it seems a great injustice has occurred!!!!11111
OH my god, they were screaming insults? That clearly gives anyone the authority to physically harm them then. The next time someone insults me maybe I will take a bat and smash their head in. Or maybe I will run them over with my car. I mean, they insulted them? the nerve! How dare they! Rotten bitches. Line them up against a wall and throw stones at them until they are dead. And as for the police who are supposed to be of outstanding moral values and are there to uphold the law and protect the citizens, let them throw the first stone.
So it was just a few people, and just a few insults? Well, even if that's all the police faced, it would still be a great injustice!
I'm not asking for it to solve anything, but you all sit on your arses and criticise people based upon a youtube video and little to no experience of conflict or resolution. We all know that the videos are edited to make it look worse, and we all know the the media are there to dramatise a situation to keep people watching. Your 'strict moral code' will go to **** when you're put into a very stressful situation where your life is being threatened and potentially at risk. I'm not saying that you do what you want, but 'macing' someone is not causing them physical harm, it is merely an irritant that causes you to cough and sting for 20-30 minutes. In the eyes of the court it is considered an incredibly low level of force. The bunch of morons should consider themselves lucky they weren't shot knowig what America can be like. They put themselves into the situaton whereby conflict with law enforcement is inevitable. People who are calm and compliant do not have force used against them. In that video it appears that the Police were outnumbered and were the targets. The Police need to be seen to control the situation and if a show of force is necessary to do so, then so be it. I'll ask one question, was the female caused any injury whatsoever?
I see someone's posted some demands for the Occupy Wall St. movement. These are so funny, it must be a troll... source: http://occupywallst.org/forum/proposed-list-of-demands-for-occupy-wall-st-moveme/
From the very top of the page to which you linked (the first thing that anyone who visits will read, so I'm uncertain as to how you missed it): Meanwhile, Occupy Wall Street set records with the demonstration in Times Square and across the world yesterday, dwarfing miniscule turnouts by the astroturfed Tea Party which somehow had far less difficulty finding coverage with fifty demonstrators than the opposition has had in demonstrations with thousands of participants in any antiwar, anti-RNC or anti-profiteering demonstration in the past thirty years. The only reason OWS is being reported at all is because they stayed in one place long enough to become impossible not to cover, because in New York, they make efforts to adhere to the law, and because they document and distribute evidence of the city's attempts to disperse or evict them illegally. The stereotype of OWS being composed of vague hippies who don't want to work and have no message was created by paid reporters and commentators, and mainstream news organizations which have a vested interest in playing down whatever common consensus works against its corporate owners. It's another instance of what Roland Barthes called neither-nor criticism: Dismissing clear charges you don't wish to answer as incoherent or beyond comprehension. Individuals on public forums can dismiss and mischaracterize OWS all they like, but the posts I've read seem not to show any firsthand knowledge of the demonstrations being discussed. Compared to the Tea Party and most of Fox's daily reporting, the literacy and the intelligence of many of the participants is made clear by the signs they carry, the pages they maintain, and by exchanges like this: Full video (According to Youtube, this video has been unlinked, which is why bit-tech's embedding won't show it.) There are also many moments like this one with Cornel West. His words are being repeated by the crowd because public speakers are not allowed to use microphones at demonstrations in NYC: Former Harvard Professor Dr. Cornell West speaks at Occupy Wall Street And by the way: OWS deserves its own thread in the Serious Section apart from this one. There have been demonstrations in the UK and Italy as well.
Macing someone doesn't cause physical harm? to be honest,I guess we use different dictionary's because I'd say it meets the requirements to be classed as harmful. I'm not saying the protesters are right or wrong. I just hate the way people assume that if some one got pepper sprayed/maced that a little water will wash it right out with no lasting effects
At least they havent shooted at anybody..... unlike Canadians Cops. ''Peace Officer'' who bring peace by brutality, that's fantastic isnt it ? I do not have any respect for Policeman, sorry to say so, even if its unpolished, its my opinion. Firefighter save life, I do respect their job, same thing for the EMT, but the Police ? Giving tickets, eating donuts, flashing their lights to turn on a traffic light without any emergency around the place, pulling out their guns because a Hobo is tearing trash bag ?
First off, the admin note wasn't so big when I posted that, 12 days ago. The section about media hype is new since then. However, it was bloody obvious that it wasn't anything official from the tweets that were around when it came out. And that's why I said "Someone" (not OWS or Adbusters but definitely an individual) has posted a list of demands. Also "These are so funny it must be a troll.." is not something I would say about an official list of demands but I would say it about A TROLL. Geddit? I never said it was official. The sad fact is that nobody cared about OWS for the last 12 days, hence no responses on here. If it weren't for co-ordinated action across continents yesterday, this thing would be over.
Renewed activism in the States -- real activism, not paid for by billionaires or hyped by the news media they happen to own -- is not a footnote. And the reason no one has posted on this thread is because it's about a particular instance of police brutality. The movement itself is ongoing and increasing in size with every major protest. The moment is far from "over," as you'd know if you lived in New York or had been here recently. BTW: Your note about trolling gave the impression it was likely that OWS itself had written the list of demands. Saying the disclaimer was "not nearly as big" when you posted still implies that you read it, which makes me wonder why you didn't identify the list correctly in the first place.
No-one posted about the brutality? I haven't tried to play it down, I agree that pepper spray causes real physical injury, and I also think that it's unfair that only a few were sprayed - It would have been much more fair, if after the police had asked members of the screaming mob to settle down, if every single unco-operative member of the mob was sprayed. Why didn't they? Fear I suppose, since the cops were so outnumbered. As for the video of the supposedly intelligent protester... who claims to have a low standard of living? How can an overweight person say that? They should have let a skinny guy talk! If the guy ate less junk food, but more veges and water, he'd be skinnier and the money saved would pay for his health insurance If he ate healthily however... he wouldn't get sick very often, and the insurance would be cheaper! As for the low wages he complained about... does he really want the government to take action? His low wages are the government's fault? Does he have any idea what he is asking for? I missed the intelligent bit, perhaps you could point that part out
Exploitative CEO's are bad, I agree that many employees need to stand up to them. Not the government, and not wall st, unless they are your employer. Again it's sad that many people do not realize that a 4% payrise is merely keeping up with a mediocre level of inflation, and anything less than 4% is a pay cut. I admire people that take a chance at starting up a business. One of my old friends dropped out of school, and worked as a cleaner. There's heaps of rich CEO's always wanting to employ cleaners, or even gardeners, etc. That old mate of mine is now the wealthy CEO of his own cleaning business, and has a few people working for him. I'm sure the protesters would love to call him greedy or evil, etc, as they stand around, whilst blogging, listening to music and sipping on coffee or a soda.
Actually it's small businesses they're fighting for - What they are against are gloabal corporations who make their money financial manipulation, like Vodafone, who paid just £1,400 tax on profits of £3.5bn
There are companies out there big enough to provide credit to their employees, and in the same article, they published that Vodaphone paid £2.6 billion pounds in tax in 2011. It's not fair to look at one segment of a large company, and suggest they are cheating the tax system, and again in the same article, they publish that losses in the sharemarket had reduced profits and taxable income. Sometimes governments will provide stimulus to the economy, by granting tax breaks to companies. Protestors need to think before they get jealous over companies recieving tax cuts. When governments help companies, it generates/retains jobs, and the government is paid back over and over through income tax, sales tax, etc.
In a country where simulated drowning isn't considered torture, macing may not be considered physical harm It certainly is considered physical harm here, but hey, we're the "old World" remember
