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Storage Oh for gods sake - Toshiba N300 4TB Drives - Failing!!!!!!!!

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by Bazz, 2 Jan 2019.

  1. Bazz

    Bazz Bit of everything geek

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    So,
    Purchase some Toshiba N300 4TB drives for my NAS (the one I was looking at selling).
    I was asked by a friend to give him a detailed report of each drive because he was interested......lucky I did.

    Every single drive has 'bad sector count' 3 of them are above the threshold.

    Drive 1 - 43
    Drive 2 - 45
    Drive 3 - 42
    Drive 4 - 97
    Drive 5 - 168
    Drive 6 - 26
    Drive 7 - 147
    Drive 8 - 46

    Threshold set in firmware is 50, so as you can see, 3 of them are above that, strangely, disk 4 is one of their newer drives (1 to 4 are new, 5 to 8 are older type (by 3 months))

    Synology NAS shows the 3 with the highest bad sector count as failing, though disk 7 has been like that since I powered on the NAS for the first time (drive was used in another NAS before then for 6 months).

    Though I have seen some bad reviews (other forums/Amazon), Blackblaze promoted these drives as good for small NAS, something I was happy to buy based on very low failure rates, but now I am not certain they are good enough for NAS duties at all.
    Toshiba don't really have a easily found RMA system, they try and flog you off to point of sale, but luckily I have the online RMA website (found in my inbox from 6 years ago) and am about to RMA the 3 highest drives.

    My question is, should I RMA all of them? 4 of the remainder are close to the threshold and the other is only half way.

    Data is backed up and currently I can lose 2 drives without loosing data.

    Even stranger is the Seagate 750GB HDD I have which is now in its 9th year and going strong (though it has 10 bad sectors), all these N300 drives are under a year old!

    No where did I put my HDD transport boxes LOL
     
  2. TheMadDutchDude

    TheMadDutchDude The Flying Dutchman

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    I would RMA them all and get rid of them personally. That's a shockingly high rate at which they are dying...
     
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  3. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Staff Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    I'm with @TheMadDutchDude: I start to shuffle data onto something else when I see *one* bad sector, let alone a few dozen. But I'd say you've either got a bad batch (which is why I always recommend that RAID arrays are built up of different drive models and manufacturers), or there's something very wrong with your NAS: there's no way they should be dying like that.

    For contrast, here are the drives in my HP Microserver, as of the 24th when the automatic SMART checker last ran:
    Code:
    /dev/sda status:
    Model Family:     HP 250GB SATA disk VB0250EAVER
    Device Model:     VB0250EAVER
      5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct   0x0033   100   100   036    Pre-fail  Always       -       0
    196 Reallocated_Event_Count 0x0032   100   100   036    Old_age   Always       -       0
    197 Current_Pending_Sector  0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
    190 Airflow_Temperature_Cel 0x0022   073   063   045    Old_age   Always       -       27 (Min/Max 24/37)
    194 Temperature_Celsius     0x0022   027   040   000    Old_age   Always       -       27 (0 13 0 0 0)
    SMART overall-health self-assessment test result: PASSED
    
    /dev/sdb status:
    Model Family:     Seagate Barracuda 7200.14 (AF)
    Device Model:     ST2000DM001-1CH164
      5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct   0x0033   100   100   010    Pre-fail  Always       -       0
    197 Current_Pending_Sector  0x0012   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
    190 Airflow_Temperature_Cel 0x0022   075   047   045    Old_age   Always       -       25 (Min/Max 16/39)
    194 Temperature_Celsius     0x0022   025   053   000    Old_age   Always       -       25 (0 11 0 0 0)
    SMART overall-health self-assessment test result: PASSED
    
    /dev/sdc status:
    Model Family:     Hitachi Deskstar 5K3000
    Device Model:     Hitachi HDS5C3020BLE630
      5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct   0x0033   100   100   005    Pre-fail  Always       -       0
    196 Reallocated_Event_Count 0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
    197 Current_Pending_Sector  0x0022   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
    194 Temperature_Celsius     0x0002   240   240   000    Old_age   Always       -       25 (Min/Max 14/42)
    SMART overall-health self-assessment test result: PASSED
    
    /dev/sdd status:
    Device Model:     WDC WD60EFRX-68MYMN1
      5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct   0x0033   200   200   140    Pre-fail  Always       -       0
    196 Reallocated_Event_Count 0x0032   200   200   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
    197 Current_Pending_Sector  0x0032   200   200   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
    194 Temperature_Celsius     0x0022   129   112   000    Old_age   Always       -       23
    SMART overall-health self-assessment test result: PASSED
    The two 2TB drives are probably approaching eight years old (just checked the Seagate and it's showing 5.8 power-on years, and it spins down when it can), while the 6TB WDC is a bit newer. Still: zero reallocated or pending sectors.
     
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  4. Bazz

    Bazz Bit of everything geek

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    Contacted Toshiba for RMA as soon as for all 8 drives.
     
  5. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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    Technically Tosh are right in you should take it up with the retailer [if you bought them as a member of the general pubic].

    The only thing i'd add is - check them in another system, make sure the drives are dud and it's not the NAS making a hash of reporting the SMART data.

    Other than that... i'd be sending the lot back.
     
  6. Bazz

    Bazz Bit of everything geek

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    Toshiba got back to me, I asked if there was a way of logging all of these in 1 job, based on the info I gave them.
    They said yes, then directed me towards the RMA claims page which only allows 1 drive at a time LOL
    (oh well, doesn't cost me a thing, so if they want to pay 8 times, they can)
     
  7. Dave Lister

    Dave Lister Member

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    I wouldn't be surprised if the NAS was to blame somehow, over at gamers nexus they seem to have uncovered a possible quality control problem with modern synology storage systems.
     
  8. Mister_Tad

    Mister_Tad Super Moderator Super Moderator

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    I would be. A NAS killing drives? Aside from inadequate cooling, that's pretty far fetched. A Synolgoy NAS is no more than an appliance-ified linux server.

    I watched all of their NAS videos as part of of some pre-purchase research, and concluded that they're mainly (nay, entirely) talking through their posterior.
     
    Last edited: 15 Jan 2019
  9. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Staff Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    Shonky power supply could do it pretty easily, though I'd expect that to show different symptoms than bad sectors - but, then again, I'm also incredulous that eight hard drives bought in two different batches months apart would be dying without the NAS being responsible, so... <shrug>
     
  10. Mister_Tad

    Mister_Tad Super Moderator Super Moderator

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    Well yeah, as could any power supply... pretty sure that would just manifest itself as dead drives though, rather than dying ones.

    If it was something other than reallocated sectors, I'd probably suggest that the NAS's interpretation of the SMART data is at fault and wonder what Toshiba's own diagnostic tool had to say about it (which I'm surprised Toshiba didn't demand prior to RMA), since whilst SMART is a standard set of data, the HDD's mechanism for reporting/tracking it is disparate amongst vendors. I feel like if any of them were consistent across vendors though, it would be reallocated sector count.
     
    Last edited: 15 Jan 2019
  11. Dave Lister

    Dave Lister Member

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    Just my two pence guys, I'm definitely no expert but thought the situation should be pointed out as a possible problem.

    I'm actually using an N300 4tb myself as a games drive and have been for almost a year without any hiccups.
     
  12. Mister_Tad

    Mister_Tad Super Moderator Super Moderator

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    I'd find it more likely an environmental influence, if there was something making them fail, as opposed a commonality in the drives making them fail of their own volition.
    I can't fathom what a any host could do to cause slow failures like this in a set of drives.
     
  13. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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    Could the NAS be reporting the drives as faulty when they are in fact, fine?
     
  14. Mister_Tad

    Mister_Tad Super Moderator Super Moderator

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    Broadly speaking, yes. Which is why I'm surprised Toshiba didn't ask for a diagnostic report from their own tool to rule this out.

    Except there's not much room for misinterpretation when the SMART data is reporting reallocated sectors.
     
  15. Thewelder

    Thewelder Member

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    Might need to try big ssd,'s in raid 1? Idk
     
  16. Bazz

    Bazz Bit of everything geek

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    Have some 8TB Red's on their way, once installed I'll pull these and run more diagnostics, just in case it is the NAS :(
     

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