I'm not sure if this is the right forum to put this in, but is bit-tech ever in direct contact with e.g. Lian Li? If so I would love to have a couple of questions regarding their design/build decisions answered.
I deliberately held off posting any actual questions because I wanted to see a "reaction" first. What I'd like to know is based on my experience with my own PC61 (from the year of our Lord 2002) and in part on my experience assembling a friend's system in a PC-B25 and generally looking at how Lian Li "do things" now. When I got my case way back when it cost an arm and a leg (not unlike now ). Not only did it *look* good, but it also had all sorts of ingenious little features that just made the case that much better. One of the cool features was the detachable IO header cable. Along with the removable motherboard tray you could assemble most of the parts conveniently out of the case and then easily connect the cable once the motherboard tray was put back into the case. While the motherboard tray has remained in some Lian Li cases the detachable IO header cable is gone. Another cool and, especially for Lian Li cases, genuinely useful feature was the way you mounted the motherboard. The motherboard tray had a number of square holes cut out into which you could hook the "stand-offs". These days Lian Li simply drills normal holes into their motherboard trays into which you now screw normal stand-offs. The problem with this is that as aluminium is a very soft metal you can easily wreck the holes in the motherboard. That was almost happening when we assembled my friend's new system. It was hard to find the right screws to screw into the stand-offs and we wrecked at least one mounting hole in the process while trying to tighten the screws. With the "old way" you'd be hard pressed to wreck anything, and if you somehow managed to break one of the stand-offs you'd at least not have wrecked the motherboard tray itself. My question is, why has Lian Li decided to drop those helpful little extras? It can't cost that much more to do it "the old way" and with regards to the motherboard mounting holes that "extra" could really be a life (read: case) saver. I'd *really* love for someone with some clout to ask Lian Li these questions. Maybe they could be convinced doing it the right way again. We're paying a price premium for Lian Li cases as it is...
I agree, Lian Li has lost a bit of their old flair. On another note, Cheiftec has resumed production of the legendary Dragon(Antec Dragon).
For anyone not quite understanding what it is I'm missing in new Lian Li cases here are a couple of screen shots (courtesy of Dan's Data) to illustrate. The stand-offs: The motherboard tray with the square holes: The detachable IO (well, output anyway) header cable: Why did these features have to go...?
Those square standoffs are horrible. they snap in two, they fall through the holes and get lost of they don't go in perfectly. If you lose them you can't get replacements and they seemt o strip really easily. That's my personal experience anyway.
I've never had problems with the mobo standoff holes being damaged in Alu cases. Maybe you should be gentler? The detaching IO is a stroke of genius with a removable mobo tray. Shame that's died.
Anyone remember Mk.6 EMP by Captain Slug? I don't know if he ever finished it, but he etched circuit boards so that every mobo connector had a quick disconnect. The motherboard tray could just slide in and out and everything (including power etc) would get connected/disconnected all at once. It was a petty sweet idea.
That's easy - it's cheaper to drill a hole than to fashion a standoff. Just be gentler when screwing in the brass standoffs I agree with Pedro - those alu standoffs are flimsy and unique to lili so replacing them was a bitch. I think people sit there with rose tinted glasses - Li Li has some nice additions now: cool PCI bracket locks, vibration-free hard drive mounts, quick locking/vibration free PSU mount, larger fans etc
To play Devil's Advocate... They were also used by Chenbro (the OEM behind Dell cases IIRC) on the Gaming Bomb and Xpider II cases. They might have been used on others, but those are two cases I've had which used them. Still, very hard to find. Also unique to Lian Li; I hope I never lose any!
When the hell do any of us have one or know someone with one to get spares? Between us we probably have a few billion brass standoffs though
Hmm... I've had my PC61 for 8 years and it's seen its fair number of builds inside. I've never managed to break any of the standoffs and I've never had problems rearranging them. On the other hand it took only one build inside a PC-B25 to ruin at least one hole completely and I am one of the most careful and gentle people I know. Putting in the standoff isn't the problem; it's screwing in the correct screw later. Not only did neither I nor my friend easily figure out which type of screw to use; it took almost no effort to ruin the holes in the motherboard. As for the detachable front panel/IO cable it's also useful for cases without a removable motherboard tray. You could easily connect the detached cable on the motherboard before mounting it inside the case, then just as easily reconnect the detached cable.
azrael, that's why i allways try first to try the screw outside the case. If it stops halfway, it is not the correct screw. Problem solved. And i didn't break a hole in any of PC-A09, PC-V1000B Plus II, PC-A17, PC-V350 or PC-V1110A cases i owned (or own).
My question is, why has Lian Li decided to drop those helpful little extras? It can't cost that much more to do it "the old way" and with regards to the motherboard mounting holes that "extra" could really be a life (read: case) saver. I'd *really* love for someone with some clout to ask Lian Li these questions. Maybe they could be convinced doing it the right way again. We're paying a price premium for Lian Li cases as it is... [/QUOTE] Mobo square holes: -It's a LOT faster to make. drill and tap a hole, instead of maching (or more likely, punching) a hole into the aluminum, then smoothing out the edges. Then, stamping a piece of aluminum into the proper shape, annealing/tempering, drilling, tapping. -Much less stuff to keep track of. Logistics. Instead of having a billion styles of square hole things, one style of standoffs. -Every other case already uses regular standoffs. Solution: hand-tight, then use a pair of needle nose pliers to add 1/8 of a turn to it. never comes out unless you want it to, never strips the threads. Detachable front cable: -Logistics, once again. Different style for different cases, then the plastic, and metal for the contact points -people who put it in upside down or backwards, etc. Solution: Asus qconnect
