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News Raspberry Pi 4 brings new GPU, USB 3.0, 4K

Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by bit-tech, 24 Jun 2019.

  1. RedFlames

    RedFlames ...is not a Belgian football team

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  2. Jeff Hine

    Jeff Hine Nothing special

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  3. adidan

    adidan Guesswork is still work

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  4. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Staff Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    Did you mean iwlist - the command to get information about active wireless interfaces - or something else? 'cos "iwlist" on its own ain't going to tell you much.
     
  5. Xlog

    Xlog Active Member

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    iwlist should return capabilities of wifi adapter, I'm curious what modes/combinations current one supports
     
  6. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Staff Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    Not on its own, it doesn't - I think you're thinking of "iw list" with a space in it. (Yes, there is an "iw list" command and an "iwlist" command that do very different things. Helpful, no?)

    Code:
    pi@raspberrypi:~ $ iw list
    Wiphy phy0
            max # scan SSIDs: 10
            max scan IEs length: 2048 bytes
            max # sched scan SSIDs: 16
            max # match sets: 16
            max # scan plans: 1
            max scan plan interval: 508
            max scan plan iterations: 0
            Retry short limit: 7
            Retry long limit: 4
            Coverage class: 0 (up to 0m)
            Device supports roaming.
            Device supports T-DLS.
            Supported Ciphers:
                    * WEP40 (00-0f-ac:1)
                    * WEP104 (00-0f-ac:5)
                    * TKIP (00-0f-ac:2)
                    * CCMP-128 (00-0f-ac:4)
                    * CMAC (00-0f-ac:6)
            Available Antennas: TX 0 RX 0
            Supported interface modes:
                     * IBSS
                     * managed
                     * AP
                     * P2P-client
                     * P2P-GO
                     * P2P-device
            Band 1:  
                    Capabilities: 0x1062
                            HT20/HT40
                            Static SM Power Save
                            RX HT20 SGI
                            RX HT40 SGI
                            No RX STBC
                            Max AMSDU length: 3839 bytes
                            DSSS/CCK HT40
                    Maximum RX AMPDU length 65535 bytes (exponent: 0x003)
                    Minimum RX AMPDU time spacing: 16 usec (0x07)
                    HT TX/RX MCS rate indexes supported: 0-7
                    Bitrates (non-HT):
                            * 1.0 Mbps
                            * 2.0 Mbps (short preamble supported)
                            * 5.5 Mbps (short preamble supported)
                            * 11.0 Mbps (short preamble supported)
                            * 6.0 Mbps
                            * 9.0 Mbps
                            * 12.0 Mbps
                            * 18.0 Mbps
                            * 24.0 Mbps
                            * 36.0 Mbps
                            * 48.0 Mbps
                            * 54.0 Mbps
                    Frequencies:
                            * 2412 MHz [1] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2417 MHz [2] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2422 MHz [3] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2427 MHz [4] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2432 MHz [5] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2437 MHz [6] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2442 MHz [7] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2447 MHz [8] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2452 MHz [9] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2457 MHz [10] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2462 MHz [11] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2467 MHz [12] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2472 MHz [13] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 2484 MHz [14] (disabled)
            Band 2:
                    Capabilities: 0x1062
                            HT20/HT40
                            Static SM Power Save
                            RX HT20 SGI
                            RX HT40 SGI
                            No RX STBC
                            Max AMSDU length: 3839 bytes
                            DSSS/CCK HT40
                    Maximum RX AMPDU length 65535 bytes (exponent: 0x003)
                    Minimum RX AMPDU time spacing: 16 usec (0x07)
                    HT TX/RX MCS rate indexes supported: 0-7
                    VHT Capabilities (0x00001020):
                            Max MPDU length: 3895
                            Supported Channel Width: neither 160 nor 80+80
                            short GI (80 MHz)
                            SU Beamformee
                    VHT RX MCS set:
                            1 streams: MCS 0-9
                            2 streams: not supported
                            3 streams: not supported
                            4 streams: not supported
                            5 streams: not supported
                            6 streams: not supported
                            7 streams: not supported
                            8 streams: not supported
                    VHT RX highest supported: 0 Mbps
                    VHT TX MCS set:
                            1 streams: MCS 0-9
                            2 streams: not supported
                            3 streams: not supported
                            4 streams: not supported
                            5 streams: not supported
                            6 streams: not supported
                            7 streams: not supported
                            8 streams: not supported
                    VHT TX highest supported: 0 Mbps
                    Bitrates (non-HT):
                            * 6.0 Mbps
                            * 9.0 Mbps
                            * 12.0 Mbps
                            * 18.0 Mbps
                            * 24.0 Mbps
                            * 36.0 Mbps
                            * 48.0 Mbps
                            * 54.0 Mbps
                    Frequencies:
                            * 5170 MHz [34] (disabled)
                            * 5180 MHz [36] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 5190 MHz [38] (disabled)
                            * 5200 MHz [40] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 5210 MHz [42] (disabled)
                            * 5220 MHz [44] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 5230 MHz [46] (disabled)
                            * 5240 MHz [48] (20.0 dBm)
                            * 5260 MHz [52] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5280 MHz [56] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5300 MHz [60] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5320 MHz [64] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5500 MHz [100] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5520 MHz [104] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5540 MHz [108] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5560 MHz [112] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5580 MHz [116] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5600 MHz [120] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5620 MHz [124] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5640 MHz [128] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5660 MHz [132] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5680 MHz [136] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5700 MHz [140] (20.0 dBm) (no IR, radar detection)
                            * 5720 MHz [144] (disabled)
                            * 5745 MHz [149] (disabled)
                            * 5765 MHz [153] (disabled)
                            * 5785 MHz [157] (disabled)
                            * 5805 MHz [161] (disabled)
                            * 5825 MHz [165] (disabled)
            Supported commands:
                     * new_interface
                     * set_interface
                     * new_key
                     * start_ap
                     * join_ibss
                     * set_pmksa
                     * del_pmksa
                     * flush_pmksa
                     * remain_on_channel
                     * frame
                     * set_wiphy_netns
                     * set_channel
                     * tdls_oper
                     * start_sched_scan
                     * start_p2p_device
                     * connect
                     * disconnect
                     * crit_protocol_start
                     * crit_protocol_stop
                     * update_connect_params
            Supported TX frame types:
                     * managed: 0x00 0x10 0x20 0x30 0x40 0x50 0x60 0x70 0x80 0x90 0xa0 0xb0 0xc0 0xd0 0xe0 0xf0
                     * P2P-client: 0x00 0x10 0x20 0x30 0x40 0x50 0x60 0x70 0x80 0x90 0xa0 0xb0 0xc0 0xd0 0xe0 0xf0
                     * P2P-GO: 0x00 0x10 0x20 0x30 0x40 0x50 0x60 0x70 0x80 0x90 0xa0 0xb0 0xc0 0xd0 0xe0 0xf0
                     * P2P-device: 0x00 0x10 0x20 0x30 0x40 0x50 0x60 0x70 0x80 0x90 0xa0 0xb0 0xc0 0xd0 0xe0 0xf0
            Supported RX frame types:
                     * managed: 0x40 0xd0
                     * P2P-client: 0x40 0xd0
                     * P2P-GO: 0x00 0x20 0x40 0xa0 0xb0 0xc0 0xd0
                     * P2P-device: 0x40 0xd0
            software interface modes (can always be added):
            valid interface combinations:
                     * #{ managed } <= 1, #{ P2P-device } <= 1, #{ P2P-client, P2P-GO } <= 1,
                       total <= 3, #channels <= 2
                     * #{ managed } <= 1, #{ AP } <= 1, #{ P2P-client } <= 1, #{ P2P-device } <= 1,
                       total <= 4, #channels <= 1
            Device supports scan flush.
            Device supports randomizing MAC-addr in sched scans.
            Supported extended features:
                    * [ 4WAY_HANDSHAKE_STA_PSK ]: 4-way handshake with PSK in station mode
                    * [ 4WAY_HANDSHAKE_STA_1X ]: 4-way handshake with 802.1X in station mode
     
  7. Xlog

    Xlog Active Member

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    yeh, thanks, always confuse the two.
    and again, no 802.11s or monitor support :(
     
  8. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Staff Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    Interestingly, it's actually the exact same radio module that was on the Pi 3B+/A+: the 'upgrade' to Bluetooth 5.0 is purely a paper exercise, in that between the 3B+/A+ launch and this launch Broadcom got it qualified as Bluetooth 5.0 (up from Bluetooth 4.2) - a process which doesn't require them to implement any of the optional stuff that actually makes Bluetooth 5.0 any different to Bluetooth 4.2.
     
  9. jb0

    jb0 Active Member

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    I dislike USB-C in general, as I feel it is an over-engineered connector that generates confusion by virtue of optionally doing a million different things, but not mandating much at all. I feel like the connector's very EXISTENCE is a mistake. ALSO, I AM AN OLD MAN WHO HATES CHANGE. GET OFF MY RS-232-INTERFACED LAWN.

    As a dedicated power connector, I hate USB-C. It is fragile poop with about twenty more pins than it needs to do the job.
    ON THE UPSIDE, the connector is at least designed to transfer the amounts of power the Pi4 draws, which micro-USB on the older boards wasn't.
     
  10. Paradigm Shifter

    Paradigm Shifter de nihilo nihil fit

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    I think the Raspberry Pi just got to the point where I will stop bothering with the alternates. As long as I can PXE boot them, I couldn't care less about no eMMC. The ODROID ones are pretty good, but frustratingly fussy at times.
     
  11. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Staff Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    Pi 4 doesn't do PXE boot yet, but it's coming. It also doesn't do USB boot yet - well, not proper USB boot, you can still stick /boot on a read-only microSD and have it look at a USB drive for root - and that'll follow.

    Interestingly, that wouldn't have been possible before: the bootloader was an integral part of the SoC. Wanted to add a new boot function? Build a new SoC. The BCM2711 includes an ickle EEPROM that holds the new bootloader, meaning it can be flashed to add new functionality at any time. Which is how it's going to get PXE and proper USB boot.
     
  12. Xlog

    Xlog Active Member

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    Is it really EEPROM and not something like NOR flash? because eeprom is very expensive, capacity limited (couple Mbits max) and completely unnecessary for such application.
     
  13. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Staff Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    You just asked "is it really EEPROM and not something like [type of EEPROM]."
    It's 4Mb (megabit, not megabyte) in the production models.
     
  14. edzieba

    edzieba Virtual Realist

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    IIRC only the Compute Modules ever exposed the second CSI/DSI interface anyway. Stock boards had to make do with sequential multiplexing for multiple cameras (through even the Compute Modules frustratingly could not genlock their dual cameras).
     
  15. Xlog

    Xlog Active Member

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    We are getting into semantics, but usually then somebody says EEPROM they mean high endurance, byte erasable memory (~100000 cycles).
     
  16. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Staff Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    It's typically used by engineers as shorthand for "a lump of read-only memory I can erase and reprogram electrically." As in, Electrically Erasable Programmable Read-Only Memory. Or EEPROM for short.

    Source: guess what the people who designed the Raspberry Pi 4 call it? Three guesses, first two don't count.
     
  17. leexgx

    leexgx CPC hang out zone (i Fix pcs i do )

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    As long as the ssd used is 1A type (only really found Kingston uv400 that works in everything in a USB 3 case)

    Laptop hdds and other ssds (1.2-2A) I tested some and sometimes the USB port shuts off or can't deliver enough power and the cady stops working intermittently (admittedly most of those was in usb2 port witch offers no guarantee anything over 0.5A to 1A, but some usb3 was been iffy as well)
     
  18. Gareth Halfacree

    Gareth Halfacree WIIGII! Staff Administrator Super Moderator Moderator

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    I didn't realise some of the USB SSDs were pulling a full amp - that might be a problem for running two on a Pi 4 and relying on bus power. Officially, you've got 1.2A across all four ports to play with - that's combined total, not per-port.
     
  19. nimbu

    nimbu Well-Known Member

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    The Pi4, POE hat and a 512gb ssd. Looking like a nice tasty rsync target I can hide somewhere in the house and have my Synology backup to.
     
  20. leexgx

    leexgx CPC hang out zone (i Fix pcs i do )

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    It is peak power of 1A (its typically less then that)

    Powered usb 3 hub I best option if your using USB powered hdd/ssds or the pi might crash or USB devices might stop working (on laptops I just find the USB 2 so times can't provide more then 1A-800ma and cause the drive to stop, the Kingston uv400 seems to be happy on any system I used them on a USB port) on my older pi I used powered hub as they could barely do 500ma on the USB ports
     
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