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"Seattle police officer punches woman"

Discussion in 'Serious' started by Sloth, 17 Jun 2010.

  1. robots

    robots New Member

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    Yes I watched the video, we just have a different opinion. The reason for that, is because I'm normal, and you are a biased freak.

    ...and for that, you get a 24 hour suspension. Have a cold shower. It's probably the heat affecting you. --Nexxo

    She didn't assault him at all, she tried to get his hands off her friend. If you call that assault then you have some kind of agenda, or you are one of those fragile little broken individuals that calls everything "an assault". Assault implies inflicting injury, she didn't even come close to that.

    But whatever, it's a waste of time me commenting on this. If you have such a skewed, biased view that you would call THAT an assault, then you could never be reasoned with anyway.

    You should work for the daily mail. I can just picture your headlines, "Suspicious black skinned possible illegal immigrant, selfishly races across a busy public highway, endangering countless lives, and then viciously assaults an innocent police officer who was just trying to protect nearby children. Valiant, well trained hero skilfully subdues the crazed psychotic attacker!"

    Yeah that would do it. The truth is probably closer to the exact opposite of that. More like, "Fat, friendless, wife beating, racist, sexist, needle dicked, paedophile, no life loser, joins Seattle police force, to throw his weight around and bully people so that he can feel like he is somebody. Has a bad morning, so vents his frustrations by arresting a jay walker, and then completely mishandles the situation, panics, and ends up punching her in the face. Sickeningly corrupt, predominantly white, bureaucracy takes his side and hopes it will all blow over ASAP before they all get impeached and torn to shreds in court."


    Don't worry, I will.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 26 Jun 2010
    walle likes this.
  2. VipersGratitude

    VipersGratitude Well-Known Member

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    The question is whether the punch was necessary or if alternative presented itself. He could, for example, have asked the guy light blue t-shirt to re-establish the role he was previously performing (of his own volition) of restraining the 17yr old girl, while he dealt with the other.

    That's fine to say in hindsight, but he had no way of knowing his punch wouldnt cause excessive damage until after the fact. I draw your attention to the eggshell principle.

    I once suffered an injury that broke my skull in six places, detatching my cheekbone and almost severing the optic nerve on that side of my face. I did have facial reconstructive surgery, but I will always have a weakness in that part of my skull - What if that girl had previously suffered a similar injury? It could have caused permanent gross disfigurement, blindness, or potentially death.

    That is simply saying the ends justified the means while ignoring the purpose of the legal definition - What means justify the ends?

    King County Superior Court Judge, Michael Spearman would disagree with you - 'The use of force in a [jaywalking] situation as a best practice is questionable'

    Objection, your honor...Conjecture :eyebrow:
     
  3. M7ck

    M7ck Ⓜod Ⓜaster

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    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
     
  4. stuartpb

    stuartpb Well-Known Member

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    Are you on drugs? Or does talking bollocks come naturally to you?? Seriously!!
     
  5. robots

    robots New Member

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    It's only bollocks if it's untrue.
     
  6. Sloth

    Sloth #yolo #swag

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    Indeed he could have, and that might have worked, or might not. Who knows if the guy would have been able to restrain her again, if he listened. Perhaps the first girl would have broken free and ran before the second was restrained again. Maybe when you've got two people shouting and pushing you and struggling over a citation you've got a little more on your mind and a punch is a quick and effective method of allowing him to cuff them both so you'll just go with that.

    Not to say that isn't a real concern, but it's really not something which can be accounted for in every situation. There would never be a single taser ever issued due to their random chance of killing some people. Handcuffs couldn't be used in case they damaged a previously injured wrist. Bending over and placing ones hands on the hood of a patrol car (as is quite common for searches) could cause lower back injuries. Grabbing hold of the first girl as she walked away could have broken her arm, she might have brittle bones. He might have used a hand sanitizer which caused a serious allergic reaction with either of them.


    That was to say he was not brutally beating anyone. He punched and swiftly cuffed her. No repeated blows or abusive behaviour once she was restrained. His only forceful actions were reactions to actions on the girls' parts, whether his actions were excessively forceful or not is obviously debatable, but he never just struck someone out of the blue.

    I suppose someone could still say that his punch was "out of the blue", but compared to other cases of random violence it seems pretty safe to say he at least had some reasoning.

    Until someone creates a time machine, saying any sort of alternative is better could be claimed as conjecture depending on how picky you want to get.
     
  7. VipersGratitude

    VipersGratitude Well-Known Member

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    Well, Walsh has been charged with a gross misdemeanour and the 17yr old girl got off scot free...I guess someone is watching the watchmen
     
  8. BaronVonDuncs

    BaronVonDuncs New Member

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    Couldn't find that story myself. As far as I can tell she has apologised and is being charged with a gross misdemeanour and is due to appear on 2nd July.

    Interesting report on jaywalking citations by a civilian auditor
    http://www.seattle.gov/police/OPA/docs/Auditor_Report_June-Nov2009.pdf

    which suggest the whole thing is much more systemic than merely one officer acting this way and would make me concerned at the general ethos and culture of the Seattle Police but I suspect that they are around the mean for a US police force.

    I thought the posts by Robot were hilarious by the way although I do broadly agree with him so maybe that colours my view.
     
  9. Mr Mario

    Mr Mario New Member

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    This.
    As much as I dislike the idea of a police officer punching anyone (even more so a woman), people who resist arrest and intervene with the arrest of another person are very much in the wrong. Personally I think that it should be considered a serious offence to behave in such a manner as it undermines the legitimate authority of the officer. I do however feel he over reacted, the video doesn't show much before the scuffle started so it's hard to give an opinion as to how else the officer should have handled the situation.
     
  10. Bakes

    Bakes New Member

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    Yes, but the people were arrested for crossing the road when the lights were against them.

    IMO, the officer must have acted pretty badly for it to get to the point where he had to punch someone in the fact. Whilst his course of action might have been the best possible in the situation, the escalation seems pretty crap imo.
     
  11. Mr Mario

    Mr Mario New Member

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    Yeah I agree totally. It was ridiculous to try and arrest someone for crossing the road wrong, a quick "cross on green next time please" would have been far more appropriate, and how that lead to someone getting punched? Still a better course of action for the lady would have been to appeal the charge/caution/arrest or what ever he was doing, afterwards. Resisting a guy who's petty enough to do you for crossing a road wrong is never going to end well. She certainly had the moral high-ground, until she resisted, or her friend intervened. That is: presumably she started resisting, rather than the officer just started grabbing and pulling her?
     
  12. stuartpb

    stuartpb Well-Known Member

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    Why blame the cop for it escalating? I used to work as a porter in our hospital way back in the early 90's, and there were some people who I had to deal with who just wouldn't listen to reason. I even got involved in physical confrontations, as back then the hospital didn't have security guards to intervene. I have had to restrain people who were becoming violent or had been violent with other patients and staff. When someone is refusing to listen, and is becoming agitated to the point where physical agression is coming into play, then they must accept some responsibility for that course they are taking. Until you have experienced being put in a position where physical force (of any kind) is neccessary, you simply cannot make judgements on others when they are in those situations. Armchair viewing really does not cut the mustard.

    The first lady always had the option to just take the ticket from the cop, and to fight it in court. She didn't, and the second lady simply should not have got involved. That's the top and bottom of it. I highly suspect the officer was becoming concerned for his own safety, I have witnessed women become aggressive myself, and they can hurt a man just as easily as another man, especially when it's 2 on 1.
     
  13. RichCreedy

    RichCreedy Hey What Who

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    if a policemen catches you commit an offence, you should allow him to do his job, and fight the law in court if you think it unjust.

    when i say fight, i dont mean hit the judge with his gavel
     

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