Build Advice SQL Server - first boot and not responding?

I'm about to buy a new server for SQL.
It will cover one small CRM db and couple more medium size db.
Nothing huge, it is not for a big data center, small company, 15 PCs using CRM system.
2-3 users will be linked to the tables and 1 user will be running one db on the server, 2M records, simple views, some updates, nothing big again.

I was looking at entry level Dell R320 with 1 cpu quad core :
- Intel® Xeon® E5-2420 v2, 2.20GHz, 15M Cache, 7.2GT/s GPI, Turbo, 6C, 80W, DDR3-1600MHz
- 2x 16GB RAM
- WIndows Server 2012 standard 2VMs

Now, I need to plan what storage I will use.
I would love to use SSD+HDDs, but don't know which way. It would be retail version, not enterprise, something like Samsung 850 PRO 1TB.
Now, would it be better to :

• install OS, SQL server, CRM system db and other needed tables on that SSD and get 2x 1TB 7200 HDDs for storage of old data?
• Or would it be better to go with 2x600GB SAS 15K HDDs for OS, SQL and main db and forget SSD?
• Or 2x600GB SAS 15K HDDs for OS and SQL, but get that 1TB SSD and keep all databases on it?

What would the best solution, what would you guys suggest?
Anyone running SQL server on SSDs?

 

can you get 3x600gb 15k drives and run a RAID5?

 

Yes, just changed a spec n Dell site and it only raised the price by £250.
Do you mean these 2 HDDs and no SSD?

 

well personally I would probably build the server :

2x146 15k disks RAID 1 for the OS
3x300 15k disks RAID 5 (3x600 if loads of data) for the Database and whatever else

resilient fast OS array and resilient fast data storage.

I think 2x600 is potentially bags and bags of space for the OS, maybe too much, but maybe running the os and the databases from the same array / different volumes might impact on performance.

I don't think you need SSD

my thoughts on your options:

1 - no resilience on the os etc. means there will be downtime due to disk failure etc.
2 - impact on performance like pointed out above
3 - There is no resilience then on the database, and I don't think in that setup it would benefit much from SSD

 

In this case, could I just get 3x600GB SAS 15K and get OS, sql and databases on it, then some 1-2TB 7200 HDD for storage of old stuff?

Or get smaller - 256GB SSD for OS and SQL software but 3x600GB SAS for databases?

 

Just as a word of warning if you do want to use SSDs - either entirely or as a (additional) cache for r/ws for your array - the consumer Samsung SSDs really aren't great in heavy write non-trim environments; which includes attaching them as individual drives to a raid card or, if you're going for a server motherboard, an on board equivalent.

Whilst increasing the over provisioning will help to some extent, for a consumer level SSD i would instead suggest a Sandforce (SF) drive, which are incredibly very resilient even 'on the fly' & your data's likely to be pretty compressible, or something like the Plextor M5 Pro as it's got much more aggressive garbage collection (GC).


Admittedly the M5 Pros aren't that readily available anymore, so i emailed Plextor about a fortnight back to ask them about the M6 Pro's GC - i needed to buy a drive for large quantities of highly sequential incompressible writes in non-trim, so not a SF really wouldn't have been optimal d.t. my intended usage - but they simply didn't get back to me...

i then found a new 512GB M5 Pro for £154 delivered, which was a very decent price, so went for that - though it was the last one that CCL had.

 

Well, I may pick for example Intel Intel 730 Series SATA III 480GB, no need to be Samsung.
I could keep that for OS and software and then 3x600GB SAS HDDs for databases?
WHat do you think?

 

That's certainly another reasonable choice - though, again, it'd benefit from increasing the OP if you're going to be doing much in the way of writes to it.

Well, with a SQL server then its dynamic use of a SSD for a r/w cache can dramatically improve performance - so it would be advantageous to use one for this as well as the OS.

The best way to increase the OP is to make the VD smaller than the maximum when setting the card up on the raid card (i assume you're adding one rather than using s/w raid via the onboard HBA d.t. usage) or HBA...

Generally, the recommendation would be to aim for at least 28% of the total nand in a heavy write environment (esp with smaller random writes vs sequential ones) - so a 480GB 730 has 512GB of nand in, your starting point would be to aim for ~369GB when creating the VD.


As said, is a generalism though, & the idea is that you go up or down from this depending on actual usage.

So, as an example, intel's current mid range end enterprise SSDs (the S3700 & S3610), which are explicitly designed for dataservers (& have better error checking & alt GC algorithms for performance consistency & whatnot), have ~24.5% OP as standard (they have slightly higher amounts of nand than the 128, 256, etc... usual multiples)...

...however, even with these, the heavier & more random the i/o load the more you should increase this in order to maintain performance in non-trim environments.

 

Sorry, I don't know anything about servers yet, only trying to choose the best and cheapest optin I can get right now

For RAID I was thinking onboard - PERC H310 Integrated RAID Controller, Mini-type
Are they so bad that I would better not use one?
From Dell cutomise option I can pick either:
- PERC H710 Integrated RAID Controller, 512MB NV Cache, Mini-type (+£139)
- PERC H810 RAID Adapter for External JBOD, 1Gb NV Cache (+£500)
- SAS 6Gbps HBA External Controller (+£70)

Thing is, if I don't want to buy SSD via Dell - their prices are horrendous. I wanted to buy one myself and install it after I get the server. But that means Dell will install OS on that 3x600GB drives. I will have someone who would need to reinstall it on SSD.


EDIT: I think I'm going to go with SAS 15K drives. 3x600GB RAID5 for OS, sql server and actual databases, then 7200 HDD 2-4TB just for storage.

 

Right, it's simply that, looking up the R320 on Dell's website then it said that it can come with s/w raid, & you'd talked about it being 'entry level' then it wasn't clear that you'd budgeted for anything better.

Now, looking it up, whilst the H310 is h/w raid then it has no cache, which will be really detrimental for performance with R5/50/6/60/etc.

(not that having a cache won't improve R0/00/1/10, but it's more critical to performance when using a parity array)


So, with the options you've given, the HBA will use s/w raid so that'd be a worse option than the 310 for R5... ...whilst the 810 would be complete overkill & so an utter waste of money.

indeed, the 710 is going to be way more powerful than you actually need for your stated usage - but, out of the ltd options presented, it's hands down the one i'd go for.

Oh, & reading through the spec, the 710's cache is apparently flash backed (an alt to having a battery), so protection for data in its cache if there's a power failure; which is quite snazzy...

(i don't actually mean 'snazzy' - my head's lost the adjective that i actually wanted to use)


Otherwise, obviously it's your call with using a SSD or not...

Whilst it'd naturally help with the OS & apps & whatnot, if you're not happy about reinstalling the OS onto it (i assume Dell will send you some disks or something) then you could still consider adding one solely for a SQL cache...

But you're quite right; there's no point in paying through the nose for one from Dell.



Oh, & as a quick thought, i assume you've planned for backing everything up somehow?

it's simply that you haven't mentioned it, & raid obviously isn't backup... Though you obviously could already have other kit that you're going to use for that & didn't see it as relevant.

 

Thank you for your input.
I think I better start with those 3x600GB 15K in RAID5 with H710 like you said.
I would get one SATA 4TB drive for all the storage and old stuff we use.
Having 32GB of RAM SQL should be fast anyway, cause all db would go in RAM, so no need for SSD.
At least for next few years I think.

Backup - this will be covered by our IT support company, all in cloud.

 

If you do go down the VM route remember SQL needs a LUN of it's own really or it's own array if you go physical.

 

OK.
Little change of plans. We will go with SSDs

I checked the prices and Dell wants a lot for drives, a lot more than they actually are worth, to the point where Intel SSDs (730 series) become in our range.

So would go with R320server with 8 hot plugs 2.5".
This is max for my budget.

Drives config:

2x 240GB SSD Intel 730 RAID1 - OS
4x 480GB SSD Intel 730 RAID10 - databases (will be 960GB of space and really fast)
2x 750GB HDD 2.5" 7200 WD Scorpion black RAID1 - SQL logs, backup etc

What do you guys think?
All on that H710 controller.

 

do you need specific caddys for these to fit in the server?

 

no when you customise, you get the option of 4x 3.5" chassis or 8x 2.5"

 

Yeah, I chose 8 hot plug chassis, so I hope caddies will come with this. It was £90 more then 4 hot plug, so guessing that's caddies difference.

Do you guys think this config would be fine? I mean running logs on separate drives, OS and databases on others.

Also, another question - do I need to buy CALs for this server?
We have main domain server with licenses and domain users will be remotely using it. Would I need additional CALs?

 

Whenever i've bought a server, the hotplug chassis has come filled with blanks, and the drives themselves come in caddies - but this is HP not dell, maybe dell do it differently. I've successfully navigated my career in IT without buying any DELL servers

 

That is what I just learnt. Dell guy told me on the phone that if I get my own drives, I need to get caddies.
So I asked to make sure its ready for 8 drives, so it has sata back planes...

Now, OS. They chargning my £700 for 2012 r2.

Scan has it for £439 excl VAT.
I'm an expert in Microsoft licenses, OEMs etc.

If I buy this Microsoft Windows Server 2012 Standard Edition 1pk DSP OEM would I need to buy CAL?
Or is this version ok and I can install it on new server?

 

with 2012 you get no CALs, so you will need to first choose which licensing model you are going to go with, either person or device, then you need to get a CAL for all of those people/devices.

Which SQL you running? Express, or full on SQL Server? if the latter you will need CALs for that as well.

 

What is the difference between user and device license?