Discussion in 'Gaming' started by Parge, 10 Oct 2012.
£214.49......definitely a bit rich for my wallet
I think he meant spending £50 on hardware to get it to be playable, going back to the whole 'My 3DFX GPU can do 200fps at 4K on full settings' type RSI forum stuff we were talking about earlier.
So $350 for the Reclaimer, cant say im surprised.
I'll have to consider my options, because buying something requires melting something, and potentially losing access to items in the AC.
I very much doubt my Starfarer or this Reclaimer, would give me a Hornet trainer, which is wrong really because both are comfortably more expensive. So melting down a MAX may mean losing the Hornet trainer.
And just as i consider giving up on the Retaliator, along comes the Greybox walkthrough video:
How can Aegis create this, with its surgical clean styling, then create the Reclaimer, which looks like a re-badged MISC ship
Time to start calculating what i can & cant afford, cos i dont intend on spending any more, maybe $25 or something if im short a little, but i wont spend my credits and then think about buying a $60 type ship or owt like that. I think my spend is bordering $1k, so £600+ which is really stupid
Yea Parge; keep with the program... I should probably have included quotes to keep the thought/conversation progress straight; it's not so obvious. I'm at 3 ships (one a package) and I'm pretty sure that'll be it... but I can't see any of them
Which ships have you already got?
I know you said you had the Xi'an Scout with its LTI the other day, cant remember if you've said the other 2. I've got the Cutlass in my head, but not sure if that was someone else mentioning it elsewhere.
Its looking like the Retaliator & Reclaimer would be outside my reach without adding $100+ or melting my Starfarer.
My hangar is worth about $760 melted (roughly $850 spent) if i count the AMD Mustang as $40 (Aurora LX ship package w/AC pass = $45, only difference is the ship).
Here's what im contemplating:
CCU Aurora LX to Gladius (alpha game package) @ ~$55
Reclaimer LTI @ $350 (tomorrow)
Starfarer LTI @ $175 (got)
Gladius LTI @ $80 (got)
Mustang AMD @ $40 (waiting for code)
$60 RSI Credit.
That'd be $760, and if they did a CCU for the Gladius to Hornet, i could have 2x Hornet, instead of 2x Gladius. I like the idea of owning 2 fighters simply for escorting my other ships, but really thats something i could do in-game just as easy.
What i'd love to do is transfer the package to the Gladius LTI (which is SA) and then CCU it to a Freelancer and apply my MIS upgrade, basically giving me a LTI Freelancer MIS package
What concerns me is if i melt what i need to melt to buy the Reclaimer tomorrow, i have no idea what i'll have in terms of trainer ships in AC (Starfarer, Aurora, Gladius & Reclaimer), as 3 of those are still only concept art, and hardly any good for dogfighting or racing
I'm currently trying to work out where to go from here. I have the M50, Hornet which I plan to change to the Hornet Ghost and I have the AMD mustang code coming too.
I'm thinking that would the mustang do for a general ship, racing, dogfighting and then melt the M50 and Hornet into a Reclaimer.
Or this is just the first of a wave of 7 ships. Each one is going to look awesome and make everyone want to pledge more, It might be worth waiting and see if any of them are more affordable?
Wow, you guys have spent that much on ships? I don't know whether to be impressed at you commitment or to impress on you that you should be committed (to a mental asylum)
I have the most basic of basic ships and I can certainly tell from the in-game handling that it's a bit of a pig to fly. But I'm not prepared to throw silly money at the game for the bigger / stronger / faster ships.
At the moment there's too little detail on in the in game economy and how easily it is to upgrade ships in game. Will it take months of grinding to earn enough for a simple upgrade or what?
I fear they'll strike a balance where it's either very time consuming to afford upgrades or real world money expensive... there'll be little patience for those who just wish to play and upgrade as they go.
I'm old-school, I want to earn my upgrades not simply buy them because my real world disposable income allows me to double down on what could be the CS equivalent to a theme park q-bot.
The last thing I want to do is get into a game if it has a large "Play to win" element. If my enjoyment of the game depends on me always having a bigger and badder ship than the next guy then I'm not jumping on that RSI gravy train.
Nice money earner for RSI though
Yeah, there's a mix, some have spent $70, some have spent $700.
For ships that cannot be flown in a game that does not yet exist.
I get that people want to support this game (and over $50m raised shows that to be the case), and that people are desperate for this to be amazing, but reading that Paul has spent the thick end of $1,000 on various ships for a game that only exists in a limited alpha form, with no guarantees as to how easy it may be to earn additional ships in-game without paying, made go a bit
I mean, what if it's crap? That's partly a joke - it does look good, but so much is unknown at the moment and it's not as if there haven't been games that have promised much and failed to deliver. I just wonder if this game has any chance of meeting the insanely high expectations that seem to have become attached to it - and that's for your average punter who might have pledged $50, let alone your superfan who's dropped ten or twenty times that.
Yeah, I mean, taking that risk is not for me, but I'm certainly not going to complain.
I think, among the big spenders there is a mix of level headed people who can easily afford it and want to fund what looks like it could well be their dream game, and people who've got a bit caught up in the whole collecting ships aspect of the campaign. Since most people in the latter segment of that group have spent their cash over two years or so, it probably doesn't seem too bad to them, unless they add it up.
None of this really bothers me, its their money to spend, but I won't have a seconds patience for a single one of them if the game turns out to be utter tosh (unlikely), or, there is an aspect or core component of the game that they dislike (more likely), and we have to hear about it.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking anyone who is super-psyched for this and happy to sponsor the development of the game, but the idea of spending $350 on a Reclaimer salvage ship (as an example being discussed upthread), when no-one knows how much fun it may be to actually operate such a ship, or how easy it might be to obtain in-game, is verging on insanity, imo. That's over £200 on a single ship for a game that hasn't yet been released!
Obviously, people are free to spend their own money on whatever they like, and if they've got the money available, why the hell shouldn't they? Otoh, continuing to spend money on extra ships, when no-one knows what the gameplay is going to be like, or whether the extra ships are going to be "worth it", just seems a little... ridiculous. £200+ for a salvage ship when no-one knows whether salvage operations will even be entertaining? What happens if it's really, really boring or that part of the game is underdeveloped? In fact, what happens if any aspect of the game doesnt' live up to the hype after people have spent literally hundreds of pounds on speculative pre-release content? I'm a little worried that there may be some seriously disappointed gamers out there come final release day.
Then again, maybe it'll be utterly brilliant and everyone will be delighted
Whilst I'm here, I've got a question. Given that RSI seem to have secured enough funding to acheive all of their initial goals, what exactly is the further revenue that RSI are accruing being used for? They seem to be continuing to offer ships, packages and whatnot for decent wedges of cash, and I could definitely see the point of pledging money when the initial goals were still to be acheived, but now that they seem to have met those goals, what is the money being used for?
To me it seems as insane as people using in app purchasing to spend crazy money on an in game currency to get their pixilated virtual farms to grow a bit quicker... or to get through candy crush saga or whatever.
At least with ED their no such obvious 'pay to win' (or pay to play differently). In that game though, I'll still be flying around in my crappy little n00bmobile while others are flying around in their Tantive IVs above my head and humming the Star Wars theme...
For those of you spending the big bucks to open up new experiences... while you're off exploring the galaxy having lots of fun. Do spare a thought for me grinding away making peanuts by trading peanuts
I agree, there could quite possibly be a load of butthurt people out there that don't think there is enough content for their £200 ship purchase. Those people need to point blank shut up; ships are a pledge to fund the game and nothing else, and if you are buying them for any other reason, then its no one but your own fault. CIG are not blameless here however, they totally propagate these kinds of thoughts, but that is really a little bit like blaming McDonalds for making you fat - which is really just people not being willing to take responsibility for their own actions.
Regarding the continued funding, they asked the community if they should stop the crowdfunding campaign about $25m ago, and people overwhelmingly responded that they shouldn't.
There is a heap of information out there about what they are using it for (almost every letter for the chairman references it).
The TLDR is that its used to develop aspects of the game that they didn't think they would be able to get in the release build, sooner (ie: now) by bringing more people on board than they had anticipated they would be able tod, and also to put together R&D teams for things like procedural generation. Basically, to massively expand the universe and its features faster and further than they previously thought they would be able to.
SC isn't P2W though is it. People who have bought a load of ships will only have an advantage for the first few weeks after launch, then after that, anyone that wants to, will have caught up by playing. ED isn't P2W either, but the people that have spent more to play it for a year prior to release, will be far more skillful in game until those who jump in on release, at least for the first few weeks, til those people catch up.
Arena commander, IS currently P2W, because in dogfighting or racing, the more expensive ships are far better. However, obviously this is just a tiny alpha, and not the actual game.
This post on reddit goes into more detail
Thanks for the link, Parge. Interesting stuff in there.
That link is just win.
I'm happy with the amount I have paid towards funding the future of the game. I may spend a little more but I shall see what comes.
The problem is that CIG are using eye candy and pay to enjoy alpha to get more money. Its great for pulling in many $ but someone with a Aurora now, may as well not bother till later.
I definitely agree it is silly, I started out planning to just get an Aurora, because im not into space sims, films or TV (Red Dwarf being the exception which is hardly a stereotypical space prog) and what i really liked was the idea of being able to be a gunner in someone elses ship. When playing BF, i'd rather be in the gunner seat of a tank or heli.
Bitcoins are to blame for my spending, doesnt feel like you're spending cash when you havent gone out and worked 30hrs to buy that 1 ship etc. The inflated price felt like it was buy 1, get 1 free. The reality was more that i'd have twice as much cash, but if you chose not to think sensibly, you can justify anything
So to a degree, i havent spent anything to have them, nor the majority of items in my signature for that matter, but then if i hadnt bought them i'd have the cash instead, which i'd have spent elsewhere just as easily.
I dont think i could possibly justify it if i was working 40hr weeks and spending £200 on a ship, but i got into bitcoins having decided to give it a try with GPU's i'd recently bought (2x 6870 @ £140ea) and i think ive spent about £5k as a chain reaction of that decision. It doesnt change the fact that i spent all that money, but its not like i worked 6mo for it, i did nothing for it really.
I do often think i really shouldnt have spent that much, but i also cant deny im enjoying the whole process, even if my £26 Aurora LN package would give me the same access really. I like what it is that they're doing, it feels like theres a proper thought process to things, and its not simply what they've thrown together in order to get a game released in a 2yr window because thats the cycle they've agreed to work in.
Im pretty sure they'll get SC to $100m before its finished, and this will allow them to work on content far beyond the scope they'd anticipated, with larger teams because the funds will be there to cover wages for 4-5yrs, rather than being dependant upon generating income from new content paying that. If they can add in a new SQ42 type storyline each year, introducing a new alien race and systems, and stuff like that, then it's likely to be better if they have the means to fund it already.
I dont think they're taking funds out of necessity, but do you stop funding and close the doors on anyone who hasnt found SC? I only found it in Feb, when Bit-Tech did the article on hitting $37m iirc. They didnt need funding, but i wouldnt have been able to join if they'd decide they had enough.
I think its about supporting what they're doing, and showing them they have the backing of the community to not simply make a decent space sim for $12m or whatever they expected it to cost, but now money really isnt much of an issue, theres nobody holding back on the purse strings saying you dont need more than 15 planets, just integrate facebook & twitter cos they're huge with the target audience.
The only thing im not fond of is the recent price increase for returning ship sales. They're justifying it as a perk of pledging long before you'll get the ship. I see it as being hiking up the price, when really money isnt an issue, so its not like they're needing to drum up extra funding. Its not the same as saying sell ships for half the price, so everyone can have tons and have nothing to earn either, its simply sticking with 1 price for all.
Do you think a normal person (IE someone who isn't devoting their life or ALL their spare time TO SC) is going to be able to afford an Idris or even a Reclaimer in a 'few' weeks ?
I don't think that rate of progression will lead to a nice game balance.
With such expensive ships I can't see how they can keep purchases happy without introducing a significant P2W element.
Its not quite conclusive, but at Gamescom last month, the day before the show CR was on stage talking about SC and ended by doing a little Q&A with the audience, and one of the things the host asked was about earning vs the P2W argument (and his previous Q about how they'd handle P2W he agreed the intended model was a good solution).
Its hard to understand exactly what the circumstances would be that he's basing this on, but when asked how long it'd take to earn a Constellation, CR said 'about a week'.
The problem is how to understand the answer.
How many hrs/day is that, 5hrs for 35hrs in the week? Its a lot for someone who's working. Is it 10hr a week, which is probably higher than the average person plays, but then thats not much for someone who does a lot of gaming, you could do that in a weekend (heck, a day!).
What ships are you using? Is that with an Aurora or a Constellation? The difference is significant.
Are you grinding, going to location A, buying a load of goods, selling it a B and buying some goods, taking that to C... and effectively playing with the sole purpose of earning that Constellation in 'about a week', or is that simply playing organically, some trading, exploring, just earning as you go and having enough.
So that 'about a week' could be anything from:
A) Grinding with a Constellation for 35hrs
B) Having fun in an Aurora for 10hrs
So really, even with an answer, we dont have a meaningful answer.
Selfishly, i want to have to earn everything, i want to work within my Org (4ppl realistically) buying a few nick-nacks along the way, but working towards earning an Idris for ourselves, in like 2mo. We'd maybe buy another ship if we felt there was opportunities to make more money elsewhere (ie Mining) or to simply earn it a new way instead of in areas we've done to death, but IMO if we could simply earn one in a month (1wk = conny, 4wk x 4ppl = 16 conny) then it might feel like we've reached our end-game very early. I want to play this game for years to come, and being able to buy almost anything in the first few months is going to be weird.
But i also agree it shouldnt be a grind, it needs to be accessible to everyone and there has to be a compromise, where people who play a lot arent getting stuff too easy, and people who only get a few hours a week arent disadvantaged and locked out.
It does say a lot though, if you could earn a Constellation in 1wk, a $200/£150 ship. You work hard at your job for a week, and spend a chunk of those wages on a virtual ship, or you earn it by playing a few hrs each night for a week instead. This is exactly how it should be though, it shouldnt be a case of giving you an unfair advantage over people with a financial leg up.
Its a fine line really, between catering for busy enthusiasts and hardcore gamers, then you've got short term and long term players. Do you make things easy to buy cos newcomers realise it'll take them 50hrs gameplay to earn a Conny, or make it harder because you'll have players playing 1000hrs in the first 6mo and letting them have a conny in 10hrs means they'll challenge the UEE fleet for ships.
- edit -
I think people have also suggested that its possible buying a ship is about 50% of the final cost. So you'd spend say 1m on the ship, then 1m on upgrading the engines, weapons, adding in ship systems etc etc. So simply owning a Constellation doesnt mean its complete, its like buying a home and not kitting it out how you want it. You can keep it as-is, but really you have plans for it and you have to extend your budget to cover this. So 1wk for a Conny, 1wk for making it awesome, is a possibility.
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