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News Swastika prompts German Wolfenstein recall

Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by CardJoe, 23 Sep 2009.

  1. cjmUK

    cjmUK Old git.

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    All true - yet curiously, they do allow swastikas in films on TV. Is there a difference between these and games? Denying the holocaust and glorifying that era are clearly wrong, but I think we can all agree the the 'Nazis' in Wolfenstein are not role models that we are likely to aspire to. Arguably, it's appropriate to regard Nazis, alongside aliens & monsters as the ultimate enemies of us all.
     
  2. stuartpb

    stuartpb Well-Known Member

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    I think different people find the symbol offensive to varying degrees. I wouldn't like to see it being used in a game such as Wolfenstein, as the game is quite light-hearted in it's approach to WWII, and I don't think it's appropriate to use a symbol that still has such meaning to a massive amount of people.

    I would feel the same with films that used the symbol that were of the light-hearted nature. If the film is trying to be historically accurate, and tell a meaningful story, then I would have no problem. Even though WWII is out of most people's living memory, there are still many people out there who have been affected by the nazi era. Then there is the neo nazi element to factor in too, which also affects many people here and now.
     
  3. thehippoz

    thehippoz New Member

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    oh well.. after seeing that video of the crazed german kid playing counterstrike (think it was).. take it out! XD
     
  4. cjmUK

    cjmUK Old git.

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    ...for example, The Producers?

    They best way to 'exorcise a demon' is to poke fun at it.

    I understand your reasoning, but I disagree. The game bears the odd swastika but it doesn't glorify Fascism and try to mitigate what happened in WWII. It is not disrespectful to modern Germany, Judaism or any other of the affected parties.

    As for the symbol having a particular meaning for a large group of people, I can only assume you are talking about Hindus and other groups (particularly in the Indian sub-continent) for whom the swastika has had religious meaning, and those who have been using the symbol since the neolithic period. I suspect these people are slightly miffed that a nasty little Austrian Corporal with one gonad has stigmatised their symbol.
     
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  5. rpsgc

    rpsgc Member

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    So does the Christian cross, only those who suffered and were tortured/burned at the stake/drowned (Witch hunts) and/or murdered directly or indirectly because of it are already dead.
    Oh and let's not forget the genocides in the New World.

    Shall we ban it too?
     
    Last edited: 23 Sep 2009
  6. Florian

    Florian New Member

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    The Christian cross also has positive connotations, whereas the reversed swastika does not.
     
  7. cjmUK

    cjmUK Old git.

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    Nonsense - read my previous post: The swastika has had positive connotations for the last few thousand years (long before Christendom existed), and it's only in the last 70 years that it has been challenged.

    (note: both the standard and reversed swastika have meaning in Sanskrit!)
     
  8. stuartpb

    stuartpb Well-Known Member

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    So to ask my original question again, would you feel comfortable, or any of you other guys, wearing a piece of clothing with the swastika on it?
     
  9. TSR2

    TSR2 New Member

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    Are German or especially Russian games allowed hammers, sickles and pictures of Stalin? Stalin was a lot worse than Hitler.
     
  10. stuartpb

    stuartpb Well-Known Member

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    The swastika is immediately identifiable world-wide with the suffering and pain that was dished out during WWII. It is probably the most recognised and hated symbol to have existed in the 20th century. As such, it's usage should not be taken lightly, especially when there are still survivors of the horrors of WWII. Maybe we should be asking these people their opinions on when it's appropriate to use it, as they are the ones who have earned that opinion.
     
  11. PrometheusCon

    PrometheusCon New Member

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    Wait... so where's the pictures showing this faint symbol. I just wanna see how 'bad' it is. I understand the laws and if it says it needs to go then so be it, but I need pics!
     
  12. Destroyer

    Destroyer New Member

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    Not my style, but I definitely feel comfortable reading a book with this cover prominently featuring the swastika and the Nazi eagle in public:
    http://www.penguin.co.uk/static/covers/all/5/5/9780141042855H.jpg
    However, I do not live in Germany :)
     
  13. Xir

    Xir Well-Known Member

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    written by this guy (on the right) http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/79/Bundesarchiv_Bild_101I-139-1112-17%2C_Russland-Mitte%2C_Heinz_Guderian.jpg
    I doubt the cover looks the same in Germany...the book is probably a standard read for tanktroops though:D

    As a foreigner living in Germany: generally Germans are taught about the war...but alas most of it is "you're guilty, even though your parents didn't exist at the time...oh, and your debt is eternal, and all jews are good, did we mention you're guilty and in debt and guilty?"
    And this is starting to down a lot less well lately...
     
    Last edited: 24 Sep 2009
  14. cjmUK

    cjmUK Old git.

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    It's right that they should be ever mindful of the darkest period in their history and all that went with it. It is also right that they take steps to prevent it happening again - after all, Germany was at the heart of the two biggest wars in history, all within a space of 25 years. So laws against holocaust denial and the use of emotive symbology like the swastika is appropriate.

    However, given that there are few survivors from that period, and given that they have been model world citizens for the last 60-odd years (excluding some dodgy stuff on the football pitch), I would consider their debt paid.

    However, that still doesn't mean that WWII films/books/games should disappear and, in case you still in any doubt, I certainly don't think a swastika in Wolfenstein is even remotely inappropriate.
     
  15. Thedarkrage

    Thedarkrage Thats not a pic of me its my gf

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    I just think that Germany just don't like violent games. There trying to ban any 18+ game from being made or sold in the country
     
  16. Thedarkrage

    Thedarkrage Thats not a pic of me its my gf

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  17. Xir

    Xir Well-Known Member

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  18. cjmUK

    cjmUK Old git.

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  19. edz

    edz Member

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    Just saw Inglourious Basterds yesterday. Apparentely it's not censored in Germany because it's a work of art.
     
  20. Kiytan

    Kiytan Shiny

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    Modern history perhaps
     
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